Macca

Matt. Here are some links that are of interest on the subject. There are lots of reference to this elsewhere too but I typically have followed Bills advice on set up for the track.

The issue appears to be more vendor specific than anything. The JZM shocks were notorious for having short bolts. A few of the other vendor kits had bolts that were of poor grade/tensile steel and stretched. Lastly and perhaps most fundamentally is the design. The four bolt sliding type provides more opportunity for movement. The rotating 3 stud type is more secure. Interestingly the RS has the later and I just noted on my 991 GT3 its also the 3 stud rotating type like the Mode units Bill installed. I could not justify the expensive of the Mod units at the time (very nicely made pice of kit but double the price of the rennline). Looking at my emails, Tom teh owner of rennline confirmed to me he was using a high quality tensile bolt in later designs so that was not of concern for me. However the four straight slotted design did provide the potential for movement and this was a point of contention. The camber pinning brace was Toms answer to this. He had seen some examples of it happening but believed it was due to poor nut torque management on teh side of the track rather than poor design. The locking pins were his final word on the matter although he didnt think it would be any issue for road or light track work....

The last 3-4 links are from the same thread. Paul will find this link fascinating as it works through the sysherical arms, the solid shims and discusses theory on things such as anti squat. It took me a while to post this as I re read the entire thread. Im not sure any of it is relevant to 964 and GT3 owners. Ive essentially followed all the recommended modifications now, although to be fair its taken many years to get there! As I said to Paul at the beginning do it once and properly or pay much labour for re doing, and geo etc. Its a long road for us slow learners....



https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...-question.html

https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...endations.html

https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...-set-up-2.html

https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...-set-up-3.html

https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...-set-up-5.html

Macca

Here is the 991 GT3 top mount. The slots allow only .30 minutes (1/2 degree) additional negative camber adjustment over the factory geo (-1.30/-1.30). To get further adjustment, like on the 997.2GT3/4.0RS etc you need to use spacers on the bottom suspension or replace the coffin arm with one that has adjustment built in (991 GT3 Cup or AM like RRS, Elephant Racing etc).

John McM

I don't think Doug and I swapping cars would work. We tried for a short period on the way to Apirana and it just felt odd. All touch points on the cars are different - seat, steering wheel, gear ****, LWF.

As for comparable cars, the variables between Lola and Herman are much more than tyres, we have differences in weight, suspension, gearbox ratios, harness, flywheel, ECU chip and not to mention 2wd vs 4wd handling.

All too hard to quantify unless we get Steve to drive them back to back. I'd be happy to do that.

The other thing would be to get a RSG beater to set times for each driver.

996tnz

The bat gets my vote next time. Pity I didn't have anyone to hold the heat gun - would've gone quicker than stopping to reheat so often. Still feel the after effects of the hours of inverted hammering!

mjg

They really don't. Think about the angles and forces, the torque spec on the bolts in question, etc. and you will understand why. Look at the design of bespoke top-of-the-line DTM cars which will see more load than any of the cars we're talking about ever will.



Also, the 991 GT3 top mount isn't an adjustable camber plate like we are discussing, it just has slotted holes in the shock tower. I also think you'll find the slots are straight, not curved. Looks like you can see daylight through the gap in the slots...

mjg

RSG 2k cup car.

We'll still need a large order of these t-shirts though:

996tnz

It is a sign. Let me start by pledging the same amount as I did towards the Durametric

Oh, you were thinking more Liana/Lacetti/Cee'd. Damn.

Macca

John McM

10 x $200. Park at HD. Sounds good, especially if you are sans car like Dave.

Macca

Im totally in for this! Seriously. It would be alot of fun. One session each to see who can make it do quickest and if its not broken at the end of that someone can buy it for the 2K cup (John?).

RS ZWEI

I sell Real Estate (down in Napier), two weeks ago I was talking to one of our national auctioneers, she said the market has slowed in Auckland. If it is going to soften it will take a while for Vendors to get their heads around new values cos "the guy 2 doors down got X 2 months ago, why cant I?"

996tnz

PS - no 951 drivers here to post their ride?

John McM

RSG 2k cup beater list so far.

Macca
John

Macca

I think that was Toms point too. Steve Weiner had had some experience here and recommended the Mode type too. If I felt it justified the outlay I would have bought them. I wouldnt be scribing them however (maybe tipex instead!).

Correct, it wasnt the right example. The GT3 ones are only adjustable top mounts from the factory not a camber plate as you say. I think the slots provide a very minimal amount of adjustment. I was chatting to Chuck Moreland (owner of elephant racing) about these last week when picking up some bushes (thats his car in teh picture) and he said he measured them out at max 0.25 degrees additional -ve camber. He said the 997 GT3 track guys typically use lower WB shims or the adjustable coffin arm to get more. Or the Am coffin arms.

On the USA side Chucks a very capable engineer if you ever want to discuss suspension. The exe-tc guys in the UK also have some really good experience with 996/997 GT3. They were the ones that supplied the iphone camber tool Graeme recommended....

Macca

P.S. Paul isnt allowed to drive the RSG beater till everyone else has had a trun ;-P