John McM

Go on, get it out of your system.

John McM

Just been out to the Waitakere Refuse Transfer Station. No charge, when I told them what I wanted to do. Weighed myself on the way in and the way out. Same result.

Weight as it starts at the track is 1,379kg ex Driver

Points to take into account: Full tank 1kg fire extinguisher Missing 1 OEM comfort seat Momo Mod07 No spare wheel No tyre pump No tool kit No frunk carpet Strut brace Primary Muffler Bypass Lightweight flywheel and RS Clutch Sunroof Air Con Front and rear ARBs Fibreglass ducktail Fuch wheels and track tyres Techart air dam Spare wheel, tool kit, tyre pump, frunk carpet would add 17.5kg. Comfort seat is ~ 23kg.

So as is at what I understand DIN Standard to be it would weigh 1,419.5 kg

Macca

That's a very good result John!

Assuming factory published is 1450 kg full tank DIN (ex options) and with options 1475 kg DIN, then you are 55 kg below factory figure. That's a pretty impressive result for the things you have mentioned. I'm guessing the rear RS lid, flywheel and bypass alone probably account for half of that saving. Not sure where the rest is.

I would recommend you having it done at Road & Race on some proper scales some time as it will give you better insight to your corner weights. I am in need of doing this again when I am back as the last time was almost 3 years ago when it measured 1320 KG in full road trim with half tank. Here's an old one below from Jan 2011. Its very useful to understand which corner of the car you need to target for weight reduction.

Not sure these days, probably got as low as 1300 at one point but lately been adding in ore than taking away so perhaps around 1335 kg full tank DIN and 1320 Kg on track full tank, half cage worth 20kg) DIN. Essentially on the track you are only 50 Kg heavier than my 993 if I leave the spare wheel and passenger seat in! Very good for a C4....

John McM

I forgot to add that the engine under tray is missing as well. Apparently that's 4.7kg off the standard build.

Looking at other people's efforts I think I can take another 40/50kg out before it starts to really cost in both $ and comfort.

Macca

That would mean 1375 KG DIN (the same as a C2 with sunroof and air con).

If you replace your drivers seat with two race seats, side mounts and sliders you will not gain nor loose weight.

Without removing air con or sunroof I cannot see from my experience where you will loose more than another 45 Kg (and assumes the scales you have used are correct). So I think your reasoning is sound. However to loose 45kg you will have some real costs=

I cans see 5Kg for rear wiper motor and assembly, 9kg from RS door cards, 9kg from rear seat backs and rear belts, 8kg in a gell cell, and perhaps 15kg from ripping out all the carpet and putting in an RS carpet set (remember to put in some strategic sound deadening matting - talk to Paul and I about this we learnt a bit from a guy in Oz on this). Lets say that lot amounts to $6-7K in parts an labor (including 2 x racetec seats, mounts, sliders).

Remember as you add stiffness and safety you add weight. A 5 point hardness styem and harness bar will add maybe 13kg! Bigger brakes maybe 9kg, strut braces 2-3kg and half cages 18-20kg with full cage 28+kg.

I found the first 100kg manageable from a budget point of view (much like costs above). I never want to make this car much more than it is right now. 20-30kg lighter would be great, 100 bhp more would also be great and slightly better handing, faster and safer on road and track would also be great and all these areas will be covered in the near future - but I never want it to be race car noisy inside, harsh suspension, creaks and rattles, or do without air con, stereo, sunroof or any of the things that make is such a great road car and a car we can still both cover lots of ground in in comfort. I want to make this car better than factory in almost every area with as little compromise as I can.

So yes the first 100kg you can cover for 6-7K. The issue I found was the next 30-40 kg cost me much more than that. More frustrating still is that 40 Kg saving was totally offset by items I added including over mats, autodip rear mirror, air rain sensing, auto drivers window lifter (best mod ever especially on the track), upgraded audio and head unit, built in bluetooth and GPS tracker unit, 18" wheels, half cage, HIDs, strut brace etc. From my notes we added in 38kg so far over factory!

So 100KG is relatively sane. Second 40kg is more and results in no gain (from my example), but more safety, performance and convenience/comfort.

unless you want to go the route of removing the sunroof and air con system in full in which case maybe you will only spend 3-4 K on panel and paint, labour and hassle (the air con system needs fuel tank removal to get the condenser out and while you are in there you may as well strip out most of the mechanical HVACs hear like flaps and motors).

If you go this latter route you are IMHO committing this car to becoming a Porsche series car and there is no real practical going back, nor will you beable to sell this as a road car again. The big beware here is you are starting with a C4 platform so you really need to thing if you will race this car. It is far cheaper once you have developed the driving skills to go and buy a 964 ex Bridgestone car IMHO.

Matt. You are entirely correct. It makes no fiscal sense to do what we do with these cars at all. For someone like me spending much much more than a 997 over these last 3 years to modify my 993 is a little different. For me this is a hobby, I have alot of free time and it keeps my mind active while I am offshore. I also have only one car space so need to make a vehicle that can perform faultlessly for everything I wish to do with it from getting the milk when I am home to a 5 day Targa Tour or 3-4 consecutive track days being pushed as hard as I can make it go. To get this type of reliability and performance form a 30 year old 911 is never cheap - but yes Ive gone the extra and created something unique and personal. I could go and buy a 993 or 964 RS tomorrow morning, thats not the thing for me, its the creative aspect I like and making something unique and better suited to my specific lifestyle and needs than anything Porsche produced.

All that being said I would not do what I have done again. It has become an addiction and a very expensive one at that. By the time the GT3 arrives this car will owe me as much albeit over 15 years of ownership. The money matters least of all to me (not that Im rich just that I believe having fun and doing what you love in life should not be marginalized by money - live in a smaller house or something instead!).

If I were to do it all again the 993 would be gone back in 2006 and replaced by 996.1 GT3, then my now would have maybe 996.2 GT3RS (this one is a real investment), then 997.1 GT3 etc and not done anything other than basic known improvements for each and used the money i had saved to do more trips to NZ for Targa Bambina, track days, Traga Tasmania etc and actually enjoying learning to drive quickly. From this year I have turned my focus on learning to be good driver - I just need to work out how I can get to the track more often to make that happen!

peterC2S

Oh, ok...

http://blipshift.com/products/bro?utm_source=blipshift+Updates&utm_campaign=7abac31248-Bro10_11_2013&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_0513fd2cb9-7abac31248-345760385

John McM

I am tempted to buy it but the postage is better spread over a few shirts. Is there only one on offer at any one time?

John McM

Macca, you are correct in your estimations. I will concentrate on the battery and interior first up. If I go for a full repaint at some stage I will do a sunroof delete. That said, it will be an interactive process over the years. As is I can happily do the 2013/14 season. It's a full one: 2 days in Nov, 2 in Dec, 5 in Jan, then Feb and March. Let's hope the Redline lives up to its rep.

NZ928S4

Hi folks, Yep me too in Orewa.. 91 928 S4.

kiwi 911

X 2 - I feel the same pain brother.

X 2 (as long as one lives within their means)

bugger - should have listened to you 18 months ago and purchased a 996 GT3 and 964 3.6T instead.

X 2

kiwi 911

Try some of these: (taken from another Pcar thread)

10g Carrera 2 rear badge

2.497kg rear wiper assy (wiring still to be removed)

9.018kg stereo system including centre tunnel tape holder and a Del Amitri cassette tape left by the PO (wiring and radio metal chassis still to be removed)

0.212kg pair of alumnium carpet edging cover strips

0.797kg pair of sun visors

3.614kg rear parcel shelf

1.877kg front footwell carpet mats and brackets

0.576kg front corner carpet trip covering heating ducting

0.342kg pair of engine lid gas struts, mtg pins and clips

0.702kg fuel tank plastic protection shroud

0.098kg wire plastic shroud under VIN in front trunk

0.189kg ABS unit plastic shroud

0.024kg wire plastic shroud between battery and front bulkhead

0.037kg fuel cap flexible flap cover

2.669kg engine bay heater fan unti, ducting, mtg bolts

1.631kg engine bay sound deadening

1.888kg heater flaps, jubilee clips and donkey dick to heat exchanger

1.947kg metal tubes and jubilee clips from heat exchanger to engine bay tin

0.708kg various engine undertray mounting brackets

0.089kg spoiler mechanism plastic shroud

0.414kg interior trim cappings below side rear windows

3.305kg rear bulkhead internal sound deadening (car louder but not annoyingly so but this may change when I remove the rear seats)

2.425kg interior rear wheel arch trim

0.615kg inner door sill carpets

0.727kg drivers footwell carpet

0.141kg carpet behind pedals

0.672kg front passenger floor carpet

2.204kg front passenger floor sound deadening

0.279kg pair of heating donkey dick from dash to cill inc. jubilee clips

0.106kg pair of plastic sill vents below rear side window

1.961kg pair of heating donkey dick insulated ducting inside the cill

5.100kg rear bumper aluminium beam (not inc. fixings)

0.800kg pair of rear bumper beam mounting tubes (not inc. fixings)

4.700kg engine under tray (not inc. fixings)

0.258kg set of 4 wheel centre caps (not orginal Porsche parts)

1.550kg passenger seat electrical motors, drive cables, wiring loom and steel mounting bracket

0.024kg cigarette lighter

0.285kg ashtray and dash holder

0.895kg pair of rear floor carpets

0.055kg diagnostic plug steel mounting bracket

9.332kg rear seat area and rear foor sound deadening (not including rear bullkhead area)

0.220kg carpet behind rear sear bases

0.609kg pair of carpets outboard of rear seat bases

0.232kg pair of carpets below and forward of rear seat bases

1.171kg pair of leather seat bases

6.170kg pair of leather seat backs including outboard bolt (not including centre sprung pin bracket, will add this to the weight as I forgot)

0.742kg sunroof air defelector, front sunroof metal surround

0.182kg plastuc outer sill protectors

2.098kg pair of rear seatblets including mounting bolts/washers

0.142kg drivers footwell battery cable shroud

0.449kg sunroof motor cover panels

0.768kg central tunnel carpet (not completely removed)

3.229kg central tunnel sound deadening (not completely removed)

0.156kg pair of rear seat locking pins

1.548kg drivers seat electric motors, cables and steel cross member

0.044kg leather swatch sample under the drivers seat

1.500kg drivers floor pan sound deadening

0.087kg B-pillar vinyl trim

0.935kg radio chassis and some wiring

0.108kg spare wheel clamp and bolt

0.113kg ABS pump plastic cover

1.682kg alumnium jack

0.471kg kack handle

0.601kg wheel brace

13.487kg spare wheel

1.973kg tool roll

0.135kg steel battery cable shroud under the spare wheel

0.770kg sunroof motor and mounting bracket

0.273kg bitumen sound deadening strip on central tunnel RHS

0.681kg bitumen sound deadening on rear floor behind front seats, pair

1.976kg sound deadening under dash and front wheel arch area (still some left behind the pedals)

0.708kg plywood pedal board

1.2kg tyre pump kit

1.169kg pair of door pocket lids

1.875kg pair of door pockets

0.423kg pair of door speaker wiring mystery junction boxes

0.042kg Porsche bonnet badge

0.916kg glove box lid

0.976kg steel ECU tray inder passenger seat

0.049kg plastic bracket under brake fluid reservoir (really not sure why this is fitted)

0.355kg more stereo wiring

0.044kg brake and clutch pedal rubber pads

0.445kg HVAC unitl plastic shroud and bonnet rubber seal

John McM

Matt, I don't think many of the RSG cars have remained unmolested I.e. Owner mods are the norm.

I now have MORE in the C4 than the 996TT but it's the C4 I look forward to taking out as it gives me more reward for driving well.

floatingkiwi

Oh don't get me wrong chaps I'm not poo pooing your mods - I'm right there with you on what you've done! Wish I was in the same boat. Long live the mod process, I'm all for it!

peterC2S

If you browse previous shirts you will find some with remaining stock in limited sizes.

John McM

I can't see more than a couple and nothing my size. Bugger.