John McM

John, you need to post more as this sounds interesting. How's the 964 you bought recently?

mjharrisonnz

Not planning to. I know of 2 definates coming and possibly a 3rd. They've sold out of allocation now, but I understand a few are for sale at original list price so one can be had if wanted.

I'm keener to expand the 911 side of my collection and introduce an air cooled model and potentially a 996 RS. Whatever I get I want it to have investment value for the future.

O2GO

Cheap alright. Got to see past the tippo and tan interior. Watch for corrosion although I expect importers would avoid that depending on morals.

Ha - I can talk. Red interior to get used to.

racoguy

Life with the 964 is good, pretty happy with it. Reg on hold right now as I'm using my Mustang over Summer. Not sure I'll register it again before I pull it apart to backdate and extensively modify.
Need to get my friends 964 repaired next which he ended up buying after driving mine........
If you have time to kill and feel like a read then take a look here at some of my work,
http://www.vask.org.nz/index.php/topic,27167.0.html

O2GO

Magnus Walker blogpost on transforming the 997 GT2 colour scheme. Dave - he used some orange. Also, have you seen his blog on how he restores Fuchs?

http://magnuswalker911.blogspot.co.n...-makeover.html

Maxem

Yeah, I had a look at that. Good to see someone injecting a bit of creativity into the water pumpers. As they become cheaper I guess they will get played with.

Kiwi Carguy

Matt, it may be a long or complicated answer so apologies in advance but what made you choose the P1 over the Spyder and LaFerarri (I can't recall if you have the LaF as well)?

996tnz

Been away over Christmas and just catching up again. I'll reserve final judgement for when I see your RS60 in the light of day but from the pics your interior looks great, with nice highlights setting off the red. It looks to have some of that sense of occasion more commonly seen in the likes of a Ferrari. I'm picking you'll really bond with it.

Will read back some now...

Kiwi Carguy

A rather nice looking Metallic black 997 I spotted in Lyall Bay, Wellington on Boxing Day.

996tnz

Pel, I suspect you've probably sorted this now but here's what I found out when looking into this for my 996T:

1. N-ratings are more than just a Porsche marketing tax. There can be quite large design changes from the non-N rated version of the same tyre eg: additional textile layers of sidewall reinforcement; reduced tread depth to minimise tread squirm, overheating and degradation when driven really hard; and wider than standard rain grooves to better keep the rear in place at high speeds in the wet.

2. Porsche vets N-rated tyres so you're getting a known good package.

3. N-rated tyres do not have a monopoly on what works well on a 911, but it pays to do your homework as you can't assume all others that fit will work acceptably when hard driven. IMO:

a) The speed rating should match the car, particularly if working it hard at times. In my case Y, or preferably (Y).

b) The rears at least need to have a heavy load rating (eg XL - but check the actual rated load).

c) The handling characteristics should match the intended use, and driver skill and attentiveness. For NZ daily driving, good wet performance is worth a lot.

d) The tyre should review well against others in performance tyre tests.

e) The tyre should ideally be well regarded by others driving your model of car. Or at least not hated anyway!

f) The compound should suit your local climate. Some R-comps may develop cracks if used or stored under 5 degrees for instance.

f) For an AWD like the 996T then rolling diameter tolerances front to rear should be within factory limits. I believe that the 996T ideally wants the rears about 1 per cent smaller than the fronts for instance (0-2pc range).

g) Looks and branding, if it matters to you.

h) If they meet all the above criteria, then cheap is good.


I've run several sets of Sumitomo HTRZIIIs on mine. Same group that makes Falkens. At half the price of most others, very good wet and dry performance for non-Rcomps and with XL rated rears, I reckon they're a great choice for a daily driver.

They're also fast on a wet and dry track but their deeper tread depth does get them hotter and I've found that running them at 9 or 10 tenths on track sees them die early with interior sidewall bubbles or tread chunking down to the cords when only half worn (not sure how much better N-rateds would stand up to a 100kph+ 360 spin or a series of rough chipseal launches though).

Macca

I think we will see more and more of this. The rise in aircooled prices has been sudden and unexpected and from what Im hearing has alot of after-market product suppliers focussed on backdates and the mid 80s to mid 90s 911s very worried right now. Infact I think we will see a few of them drop the 964 back date concept in the next 12 months and move quickly to working on hot rod 996/997. The ownership continuum over the last 2 decades has typically been:

New
Used within network (less than 5 years old).
Used outside network (5-10 years old and mostly depreciated). Enthusiasts fit in here.
Enthusiast owned (10 years old+).
From 25-30 years + and on special models typically moves to collector for more original examples.

Dependant on model typically the car would then gravitate from enthusiast to collector.

However in this market we have a new dynamic. Speculator and investor. The prices of older enthusiast owned cars of low volume model derivatives such as RS, CS, Speedster, turbo has gone from enthusiast to collector/investor and in many cases investor/speculator which has indeed short circuited the typical continuum of ownership. The last time we saw this was early 90's when Asia/Japan was awash with cash and it lasted a couple of years before the big bust. Back then 2.7RS were trading hands at a record of 600K and that was eye watering stuff. After the bubble burst you'd be lucky to see 200K for them. Once the investors flee the only buyers are the enthusiasts and collectors. They don't have the budget the investors do. Of course because its happened before in the 80s and 90s doesn't mean it will be the same again.

So the guys such as Paul Stephens and many other outfits that have sprung up over the last 5 years using 964 to backdate cars will be struggling to find reasonable stock in the future and will need to pay more for suitable donors. The model still works but the end price of the backdate starts to go up 15-20K GBP etc and the availability of cars decreases. If you were in that game I think you would be considering some other alternatives. Generally the market leads these businesses into their eventual endeavours. Someone like Magnus operates quite differently - he is a "trend setter" not a follower and he has become a "brand" so it is plausible he could become a useful pointer to the direction things take. I dont see him filling up his garage with water pumpers just yet though!

The aircooled stuff is disappearing now a a great rate of knots from the track days around the world now. Porsche have left a massive hole with the M96 engine reliability issues. Until the 9A1 there are few alternatives other than to spend money fortifying the engine for track use. Its a shame but more and more guys I speak with are moving to other platforms for track work (Atom, Xbow, Caterham and many UK based track specials) until the newer Caymans and 911s with the DFI come down to a price point that justifies them buying them cheap and turning into track day specials. Increasing prices of GT3's has also started to ruin it for the bang for buck track day ****** to some degree.

Its going to be interesting what emerges from all of this but if the bubble can hold for another 18-24 months we will start to see some creative thinking come about in this space which personally I believe is the best thing ever. IMO the whole space is a bit stale now and it needs something to ignite it again or else the enthusiasts with limited budgets will turn elsewhere.

Magnus colour schemed 7.2 GT2 whilst not my personal cup of tea is the most exciting image Ive seen posted for a long while. For many reasons but mostly because if we are lucky it could signal the herald for change.

Maxem

Good thoughts Macca.
It's interesting to see most of the old 911's on TM, the white 930, the blue 964 turbo and the arena red turbo's are hanging around. Overpriced For this market I guess.

Let me take a punt;
993 turbo's $130 tops. Arena red did hold them back but looking better now as a period colour.
Blue 964 turbo $95 -100. it sold for 80 odd not a year ago)
Old 911's not a bit over a hundred because they are not E or S coupes.
White 930 $75-80. The green trim is holding it back. Was 70k a year ago.

The manual 996 NZ coupes - not moving fast at mid thirties. Late twenties and A good buy would be had.

No science behind all of that, it's just what I'd pay if I was after one and not feel ripped or stupid for overpaying.

Macca

Dave. I think your pricing thoughts are pretty spot on. Nothing has sold at these elevated prices not even john or my car (yet). I believe the collective local knowledge on this board as good or better for price analysis than any other source in NZ.

Interestingly I saw a 997S in black this week in Town on some upgraded wheels and sports suspension and my gut feel was it looked bloody good. In fact it made me look which was how good it was (I barely notice many of the later gen cars).

John McM

Couldn't get through all 34 pages in one sitting, but what I read had me in awe of the skills and dedication. The 964 should be a ripper.

Obsessed

Paul does this explain why there was a lot of time spent shopping and in the spa in Taupo and none on track?