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The increased demand is from non traditional customers. To an extent that some here have show a distaste for that fact.
Pure speculation on your part. Again, you are making the argument that Porsche sold more by limiting choice and that just makes no sense.
That's analogous to saying if Porsche only offered the car in the most popular color (say white) they would somehow sell more than by offering multiple color options. That's just silly.
Porsche obviously turned off some potential customers by making the car pdk only. You can certainly argue that number was small, but it makes no rational sense that the number was zero.
I do believe 7 GT3 prices increased because they are manual.
It will take time for many to realise how good the PDK car is. Many are negative on it but have not even sat in it let alone tried it on road or track. Look at some of the old timer GT3 hardcore guys like Mooty & Deacon - so many of them now a new one or two join the ranks every month and soon with the 991 GT3RS even more all of a sudden will be with flappy paddle. These are the guys who use the GT3 for its intended purpose. We will see if they can break these cars and if they say they like them. Time will tell I guess.
In the USA you have too many GT3 all varieties.
In the UK used 991 GT3 trading at 50%+ on base MSRP!
In at least a 5 markets I can name 991 GT3 selling used at same or above base MSPR. Small markets sure, some RHD but in each and every one of those markets used 991 GT3 is selling above used 997 GT3.
I have no idea of 997.2 GT3 residuals in USA but if they are selling 150K USD then that is very good. Once the 991 GT3RS is launched we may see a further shift.
The thing that may make the 991 GT3/RS a better investment long term is the transmission. The PDK has doubled or if you consider growth and emerging market future demand (i.e. Chinese collectors and Indian collectors etc) maybe even gone up 5 fold. In 10 years time there will still only be 2800 991 GT3 but the number of people with $300,000 to have one of the last naturally aspirated 9000 rpm god machines with have tripled over today and most of them would only know a stick as something used to hit a golf ball. Id warrant many of them will be emerging market millionaires and new tech head wealthy.
Put that down in the book as an Uncle Macca prediction :-)
I wont have one by then. Ill have sold it far too cheap like my other Porsches an moved on LOL!
Firstly, lets give PAG credit where's its due. ................My POV PAG are going an insanely brilliant job of "punching above their weight" with this new Gen GT3. In days of old there was always a cooking model Feza faster than an GT3, or an Aston or Lambo that could "top trump" it. Not today. You need a 458 Speciale to do that and we havent even seen the GT3RS yet!
However I conceed the days of PAG puling off this type of coup with a N/A engine are almost gone. The FeFi will be needed in 2017/18 to keep the Top Trumps players winning!
Firstly I grew up loving Porsches before the "GT3" badge was coined. Im 44, but the GT3 badge came along when I was in a 993RS and it seemed like a bit of a "new kid on the block thing" back in 2000. Of course now its all we talk/think and dream about LOL!
I predict the GT3 name is on its way out. After almost 2 generations that would seem fair. By 2020 I believe we will have a road racer based on 960/88 architecture which will already be seeing competition. The Gt4 name may survive a few more years but the Gt3 orad cars will be gone and we will be in a new roller coaster..
Nope, not contrary. I completely agree with your point in bold and didn't mean to imply otherwise. Now that being said, I remember rolling up next to a Scud on an interstate while driving my RS and whilst I knew on track it was an easy match, there was no denying that I felt like the guy driving the antique. I'm okay with that for the most part for the reasons you lay out and others not listed but a lot of buyers aren't.
On actual competition vs the more cut-throat internet competition we engage in here most manufacturer-based racing around the world is gravitating towards FIA GT3 format and we've seen what's happened with the 911's ability to compete in this realm over the past few years. Will the 2016 FIA/ACO rule changes make the platform relevant again? Time will tell, but my bias tells me they need a new platform to swim in this pool.
I do believe 7 GT3 prices increased because they are manual.
It will take time for many to realise how good the PDK car is. Many are negative on it but have not even sat in it let alone tried it on road or track. Look at some of the old timer GT3 hardcore guys like Mooty & Deacon - so many of them now a new one or two join the ranks every month and soon with the 991 GT3RS even more all of a sudden will be with flappy paddle. These are the guys who use the GT3 for its intended purpose. We will see if they can break these cars and if they say they like them. Time will tell I guess.
In the USA you have too many GT3 all varieties.
In the UK used 991 GT3 trading at 50%+ on base MSRP!
In at least a 5 markets I can name 991 GT3 selling used at same or above base MSPR. Small markets sure, some RHD but in each and every one of those markets used 991 GT3 is selling above used 997 GT3.
I have no idea of 997.2 GT3 residuals in USA but if they are selling 150K USD then that is very good. Once the 991 GT3RS is launched we may see a further shift.
The thing that may make the 991 GT3/RS a better investment long term is the transmission. The PDK has doubled or if you consider growth and emerging market future demand (i.e. Chinese collectors and Indian collectors etc) maybe even gone up 5 fold. In 10 years time there will still only be 2800 991 GT3 but the number of people with $300,000 to have one of the last naturally aspirated 9000 rpm god machines with have tripled over today and most of them would only know a stick as something used to hit a golf ball. Id warrant many of them will be emerging market millionaires and new tech head wealthy.
Put that down in the book as an Uncle Macca prediction :-)
I wont have one by then. Ill have sold it far too cheap like my other Porsches an moved on LOL!
Uncle Macca has accurately predicted the future once again.
I can only say AMEN! to this one.
Look at some of the old timer GT3 hardcore guys like Mooty & Deacon - so many of them now a new one or two join the ranks every month and soon with the 991 GT3RS even more all of a sudden will be with flappy paddle. !
as good and experienced manual drivers they are, they want to be faster. Not having to manually shift and rev match under braking means much more focus available for driving line and braking decisions.
as good and experienced manual drivers they are, they want to be faster. Not having to manually shift and rev match under braking means much more focus available for driving line and braking decisions.
maybe deacon. mooty just wants to be able to post while navigating SF traffic....
I do believe 7 GT3 prices increased because they are manual.
It will take time for many to realise how good the PDK car is.
This. 991 GT3 is only beginning to hit the track in substantial numbers. Let's see where things are 6 or 12 months from now, after 997 GT3 guys have gotten used to being passed and eventually found their way into the passenger and driver's seats of the 991 and given it a try themselves. Of course, some will still prefer the 997 even then, but prices will be driven by overall trends, which I predict will favor the 991.
"The reports of it's death have been greatly exaggerated." Mark Twain on the 960/988.
Originally Posted by JasonAndreas
Unless the board of directors never actually voted to put it on the production roadmap?
Don't fall for that story. Porsche has mostly gone 'quiet' about the 960/988 to insure that deliveries of their expensive 918 Spyder goes as schedule and everyone who ordered one pays for it (and doesn't decide to cancel)! Once all of those 918 vehicles are paid for & shipped to their customers, PAG will begin the great marketing offensive (initially via well placed leaks with influential automotive writers) on the 960/988. It had to be done this way since the mid-engined 960/988 borrows so much from what was learned in the development & production of the 918 and will offer quite a bit of the performance of that Hybrid Supercar model...yet cost 2/3 less!
So if the 960/988 is not yet on the production roadmap, it will be pretty damn soon! It's not just an engineering excersise for Porsche...but a necessary new model that hopefully will insure that Porsche remains competitive at the racetrack in this market segment! It's called & known as the Ferrari-Fighter for a reason, capiche!
I agree with Eduardo. My questioning at PAG has me quite comfortable we will see talk of 960/88 FeFi soon. 918 has all sold out and is now trading hands for a premium in some markets. Of the three "Uber-cars" (P1, La Ferrari, 918) the 918 seems to be getting the most praise as a drivers car and is the cheapest of the three. I think PAG were worried in 2013 they may have had a CGT issue bit its come together for hem at the last minute. Nothing is stopping the 960 breaking cover now and more than ever PAG need this car before the become "overweight" family haulers for developed and emerging market middle class! I believe even APs team have some visibility into the platform and will be working the Motorsport variant at the same time as the development team put the final touches on the road version.
Don't fall for that story. Porsche has mostly gone 'quiet' about the 960/988 to insure that deliveries of their expensive 918 Spyder goes as schedule and everyone who ordered one pays for it (and doesn't decide to cancel)! Once all of those 918 vehicles are paid for & shipped to their customers, PAG will begin the great marketing offensive (initially via well placed leaks with influential automotive writers) on the 960/988. It had to be done this way since the mid-engined 960/988 borrows so much from what was learned in the development & production of the 918 and will offer quite a bit of the performance of that Hybrid Supercar model...yet cost 2/3 less!
So if the 960/988 is not yet on the production roadmap, it will be pretty damn soon! It's not just an engineering excersise for Porsche...but a necessary new model that hopefully will insure that Porsche remains competitive at the racetrack in this market segment! It's called & known as the Ferrari-Fighter for a reason, capiche!
Saludos,
Eduardo
Carmel
Yup. I basically see the 960 on the lambo/r8 platform w/ some 918 derived parts all for tidy sum of $300k!
02-26-2015, 03:07 PM
most manufacturer-based racing around the world is gravitating towards FIA GT3 format and we've seen what's happened with the 911's ability to compete in this realm over the past few years. Will the 2016 FIA/ACO rule changes make the platform relevant again? Time will tell, but my bias tells me they need a new platform to swim in this pool.
