Any Rennlisters from New Zealand?
01-01-2015, 07:17 PM
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Last edited by Obsessed; 01-12-2015 at 05:11 AM.
01-01-2015, 08:38 PM
The government needs to recognise some responsibility too. The have equipped us with the worlds slowest mostly single lane arterial highway which adds aggravation and impatience to the repertoire. Kiwis aren't particularly patient drivers ... .>snip<...real growth not just a 5 minute **** in the arm!! Ok 2015 rant over early in the peace. I think I covered all bases other than religion!
Macca and John, I too fear that the last 20-30 years of social engineering has killed the opportunity for rational debate and policy setting. Any debate will just feed the regulatory ratchet.
The real issue I reckon is that actual safety is a function along the lines of (skill x attentiveness) divided by (the task complexity x the surprise rate), the latter rate being the variability or beta of the task complexity.
Speed is one of the main drivers of task complexity but remains a much smaller part of the bigger safety-efficiency equation. Attentiveness also typically rises with speed, at least partially offsetting speed's contribution to risk (the concept of 'optimal arousal' for drivers, where driving slowly down a long straight with no other traffic can see attention drift and prove more dangerous than taking that same stretch at a more involving speed).
Skill I see as very broad and includes such factors as vehicle awareness (state and capabilities), forward vision and traffic prediction, car control, personal awareness (of being tired/angry/distracted/sick etc) and situational awareness (slick with drizzle? milking time? sun strike? fog? blind exits? etc etc)
By surprise rate, I mean the probability of sudden large spikes in task complexity due to things like a truck losing its load, a car suddenly pulling out on you, a sheep bolting onto the road, a huge washout on a blind corner, landslides, a wheel falling off, steering failure, plane landings etc etc)
The obsession with reducing speeds is understandable as that and alcohol impairment were the only quantitatively measurable factors of the much bigger driving safety-efficiency equation for decades (plus vehicle condition and seat belt usage). So these and other observable driving standards gave the authorities a basis for monitoring and shaping behaviour, albeit in quite an unbalanced way.
The surprise rate has been moderated through shaping road design and vehicle design standards as well as through norming driver behaviour. The variable message boards on the motorway are also aimed at reducing surprises. Ironically, some of these wins are short lived as drivers compensate by increasing speeds or reducing attentiveness - like the Peltzman effect where the introduction of seatbelts didn't reduce road fatalities in the US because drivers took advantage of the lowered personal risk to drive faster and less attentively. The net effect killed about as many more pedestrians as it saved drivers!
What doesn't get officially measured or credited is the skill and attentiveness of the driver of course (beyond substance impairment). Graduated driver licensing and the learner approved motorcycle scheme are about as far as things go down that path and like most regulations are broad brush blunt instruments that make no distinction between say, someone entirely new to driving or riding and some other young people who may have won a national race series by the time they take to the road.
As Paul pointed out, we each manage our personal safety based on far more specific information than a government has at its disposal.
This may not be popular but I do sometimes wonder if more practiced drivers should be obliged to spend an hour or two with a newbie every few years to remind us of how little skill they typically have. For some, even checking the rear view mirror is a big ask. If everyone on the road was a driving god or goddess NZ would be a much more satisfying place to move around in but that won't happen tomorrow.
Macca's onto it with the suggestion to skill up weaker drivers faster. In the meantime, let's just all be careful out there and stay attentive.
Oops - 2015 is looking like the year of the rant after all...
01-01-2015, 08:43 PM
Rennlist Member
Micheal, bring $200 and you too can join the force that is the mighty Black Beauty!
01-01-2015, 09:02 PM
Rennlist Member
Had one of best drives in NZ of the last few years today. Unbelievable actually. 93km of windy roads without a single car in front. I'm not kidding - must have been a fluke! From Pokeno to Pirongia taking Tom Tom windiest route. The GT3 is immense and took everything without flinching. The speeds it carries into corners astonishing. The roads and scenery were amazing - you could drive maximum attack without going over 105 kph most of the time. Mostly 3& 4 gear with a dozen second gear 25kmph corners for good measure. We need to do a Sunday drive like this soon Doug when you are saddled up. Bloody brilliant drive. Have most of it on film but probably should post here - may put on my YouTube page later!!!!
01-01-2015, 09:32 PM
Rennlist Member
Walt. Some excellent thoroughly thought out input there mate. You have managed to circle the issues by way of a hypothetical equation very well. If there was indeed anyone of government influence observing these pages they could likely learn something here...well done.
01-01-2015, 09:55 PM
Drifting
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Macca, glad you had such a nice run and thanks for posting. Great stuff for us armchair drivers on holiday. That Tom Tom maximum windy roads feature is one I really love. Dishes up nice surprises.
Missing not having a sports car with all this time on my hands but only 3 more sleeps until I pick up the RS60.
That area you went through is really lovely driving. I'm doing it in reverse on Tuesday but seeing I'm starting at Picton at 5:30am by this stage will either be keen for some B road action or to point to home and save it for Weds. Hopefully the former. Planning on seeing Lola rebuild progress on the way through Pirongia. Heh, before I know it I'll have two toys back in my sandpit. Can't wait.
Missing not having a sports car with all this time on my hands but only 3 more sleeps until I pick up the RS60.
That area you went through is really lovely driving. I'm doing it in reverse on Tuesday but seeing I'm starting at Picton at 5:30am by this stage will either be keen for some B road action or to point to home and save it for Weds. Hopefully the former. Planning on seeing Lola rebuild progress on the way through Pirongia. Heh, before I know it I'll have two toys back in my sandpit. Can't wait.
01-02-2015, 01:25 AM
Happy new year to everyone and all the very best for 2015 . May all our cars survive unscathed and we get to drive them as intended.
Macca my first long drive in my GT3 was on the same roads and late on a damp Sunday afternoon. I needed to pick up Annie in Hamilton and enjoyed the hour and a half so much that I have done it a few times since . My experience is the same, no cars ahead or behind and winding empty roads that feel fast at 110 . Beautiful scenery and the only concern is disturbing the local farmers who may complain. We live in the best country in the world.
Macca my first long drive in my GT3 was on the same roads and late on a damp Sunday afternoon. I needed to pick up Annie in Hamilton and enjoyed the hour and a half so much that I have done it a few times since . My experience is the same, no cars ahead or behind and winding empty roads that feel fast at 110 . Beautiful scenery and the only concern is disturbing the local farmers who may complain. We live in the best country in the world.
01-02-2015, 03:03 AM
Three Wheelin'
No problem in getting a warrant for the last 5 years/80Kkm, VTNZ et al.
And no-one has picked up that on the LVVA cert plate it states that the engine is an IL6...
01-02-2015, 04:06 AM
...Unless it's p*ssing down, in which case it might be a good option
You should sell Macca a session though, it might be your only chance to get him on the leaderboard for a while.
01-02-2015, 04:17 AM
Interesting. My car is certified with aftermarket 18" wheels, H&R RSS coilovers front and rear (with torsion bar delete), polybronze pivots, spherical bearing adjustable strut mounts, and fixed back seats with the rear seats still in place.
No problem in getting a warrant for the last 5 years/80Kkm, VTNZ et al.
No problem in getting a warrant for the last 5 years/80Kkm, VTNZ et al.
Can I fit two fixed-back bucket seats in my two-door car, or does one of the seats need to be able to be tilted forward so that back seat passengers can get out?
A vehicle that has a permanent or fixed roof structure and more than one row of seats must incorporate a ready means of entry and exit by the most direct path practicable for all rear-seat passengers. This means that there must be either:
— one or more doors adjacent to each row of seating; or
— an aisle space of a width of not less than 300mm from each row of seating to one or more doors; or
— one or more seats within each row of seating, other than the rear-most seating row, that folds or tilts forward.
Simply put, back seat passengers need to be able to get out of the car easily. With two fixed-back bucket seats it’s going to be almost impossible, so the best options are to either fit one recliner or re-register the car as a two-seater. In the latter instance you won’t legally be able to carry any backseat passengers.
So it does seem that our situation is a bit naughty, although obviously inconsistently enforced.
A vehicle that has a permanent or fixed roof structure and more than one row of seats must incorporate a ready means of entry and exit by the most direct path practicable for all rear-seat passengers. This means that there must be either:
— one or more doors adjacent to each row of seating; or
— an aisle space of a width of not less than 300mm from each row of seating to one or more doors; or
— one or more seats within each row of seating, other than the rear-most seating row, that folds or tilts forward.
Simply put, back seat passengers need to be able to get out of the car easily. With two fixed-back bucket seats it’s going to be almost impossible, so the best options are to either fit one recliner or re-register the car as a two-seater. In the latter instance you won’t legally be able to carry any backseat passengers.