mjg

I took a look and a ride in the black GT3. Not my favourite colour, but it looks better in person than in photos. I didn't drive as the seats aren't on sliders, so it'd be a pain to adjust them for a quick visit. It's hard to judge as a passenger around urban streets, but it rode better than I expected and a couple of quick visits to the rev. limiter in second gave me a good idea of the power and traction.

Exterior is fairly tidy with a handful of stone chips, except for the windscreen which is pretty pitted. Surprising the paint is so good considering the screen, maybe it has been touched up. Interior is also fine, although the full cage displaces bits of the trim in ugly ways. A bit of time and money could address some of that: fit an interior-matching cover over the removed passenger airbag spot, refit three point belt hardware for street use, maybe find a way to refit sun visors, etc.

It's got some nice upgrades: floating front rotors, upgraded clutch and (I think) RS single mass flywheel.

One of the coolant fittings let go while at a track event (known weakness with the GT1 block), so that's been looked at but I'd need to chat with Motorscience to see if it was addressed permanently with welds or pins in the fittings. It's had new drive shafts and diff bearings recently, and some work done on first gear after hard use by the previous owner.

Not sure how much flexibility there is in the price. It'd cost a bit to get it back to road car spec and if that was done I can't see it being priced higher than the red GT3 given the mileage. And at that price the silver GT3 at $100k is starting to look like a good deal given the upgrades that has.

Macca

Hi Matt. Interesting feedback. Shame you couldn't get a drive. PITA having a fixed bucket IMHO. It appears there is plenty to choose from at the moment so you can take your time and perhaps negotiate with more strength. There seems to be interest in your 964 too so I wouldnt imagine that will be hard to shift.

I have a great comparo article between 996.1&2 GT3 from Evo which is interesting. PM me your email details if you would like that...

KiwiSean

I agree, there definitely seems to be a few 996 GT3s coming up and nice ones at that. I saw the silver one at the northern lunch and councours, it's a nice straight car by the looks of it.

I'm wondering. Would it not be better to wait for the 991 GT3 hit the market in a few months to see what that does to the 996 and 997 pricing?

Macca

Hi Sean. The 991 GT3 will be announced at the Geneva Auto Salon Press Conference next Tuesday. This car I believe will be technical tour de force for Porsche now celebrating the 50th anniversary of the 911 in 2013. It will feature a new motorsports basis engine 3.8 and PDK-S (a new PKD-S designed or the 9000rpm soft limited engine) will be the only transmission option - a first for the GT3 and a sign of things to come!

Production of the 991 GT3 will likely not start until June/July 2013 with RHD deliveries arriving in NZ Nov/Dec this year.

The big surprise is the price which will most likely rise 15-18% above the outgoing 997.2 GT3. In New Zealand depending on EMDs strategy and forward cover this will likely translate to a 330k nzd+ base price over the outgoing models 280k base price. Most cars delivered will in all likelihood have 10-20k nzd of options. There is unlikely to be any discounting as its rumoured the production run will likely be less than that of the 996.1 GT3 (1800 odd units) due to economic depression.

Contrary to typical pricing behavior I suspect the new 991 GT3 will actually fortify prior model pricing especially that of the 997.2 GT3+RS (6 speed and 40K cheaper at retail in the first instance thus offering a lower cost entry platform on the used market). The new 991 Gt3 with PDK will attract a different buyer and the older model GT3 with manual transmission may well be all that is left if this is your transmission preference (which for many enthusiasts it will be).

My personal opinion is that the 996 GT3 models are already at the bottom of their depreciation curve and will likely firm up a bit from here ((good examples). Ropy ones will continue to flocculate around the 80k nzd price mark with good examples sitting in the 95-100k category.

IMHO of course!

peterC2S

Interesting comments Matt - will you go and have a look/drive of the silver one? It certainly looks the business on paper.

I tend to agree with Macc re little/no negative impact of the 991 GT3 on 996 GT3 pricing. perhaps a bit on 997 (non RS) models. Good 996 GT3s seem to be as rare as well sorted 964's - I'm sure you;ll have no trouble with yours if you decide to sell.

Macca

Just out of curiosity has anyone on here investigated a bolt in half cage solution for the 964/993. Ive done plenty of research and Im about to place an order for a Heigo set up (steel, FIA approved) but wondered if anyone knows of another option. Key requirements are that it can bold onto existing mounting points in the car, make no damage to the interior and be revered back to stock within 15-20 mins (i.e. can be assembled before an event and easily disassembled afterwards if necessary). For me the primary objective of this set up is to provide improved safety to my wife and myself during tarmac rally events (such as Targa Tour). I guess adding some additional stiffness to the 993 tub is an added benefit as well. NZ homogenization is not a key requirement for us as the system needs to be primarily compliant for European events. Below is a picture of the unit I am about to order (will have the bars colour coded steel grey) but just wondering before I go if someone has another suggestion or a used Heigo floating around? They make these in around 10 different configurations for the 964/993 (sunroof, no sunroof, full system etc) and they were factory optioned (exclusive program) for 964 and 993 (RS etc) thus period correct.... wasn't a priority of mine frankly but"The Manager" asked what they were for during the last Targa and has suggested if she is to ride again some additional protection would be a "good idea" (not sure how this reflects on my driving skills actually!)

kiwi 911

Macca,

Would this be an acceptable Motorsport NZ solution for a roll cage?

Macca

Kiwi911. I am afraid not. In Europe you would find this FIA cage eligable for many historic Motorsport events and rallys but Motorsport NZ are very conservative in this regard and for full Motorspot NZ sanctioned competition events a full cage is required (which is probably a very good idea). I do not believe MNZ will sanction any half cages for full Motorsport events. However for clubsport events, DEs and some sprints etc this cage should indeed qualify (although no certification is needed for these events in any case).

I needed a low cost, quality, period/porsche correct half cage that would not damage my interior and if I leave the hoop in place can be assembled and disassembled (for touring where we use the back seat for spill over luggage) within 10-15 minutes with the minimal of effort and tools...its also the most aesthetically acceptable solution could find the only down side being long lead times for build...

mjg

Wow, this thread moves fast. I had to hunt through pages and pages to find savantx's email address re the C2.

Obsessed, I joined the PCNZ back when I got the C2... but I've only made it to one gymkhana and one driver training day since.

Macca, would love the Evo article, have PMed you my email address.

Peter, not sure about the silver one, it has all the right bits, price is past what I'd want to spend, will have to think about it. Maybe my goal of low 80s is unrealistic right now.

kiwi 911

Nah - it's been for sale for a while now.

If the car stacks up, make the offer...............

John McM

Guys, as a track newbie, I'm interested in the progression path.

Simon G. intimated that I should have aimed higher than the C4, because I would outgrow it quickly. However, he has the same dilemma with his 944, which is racing outside C class.

When I asked him about his upgrade path, it appeared to be a jump to a competitive GT3, bypassing the 996 models.

I'm not altogether sure that the competiton is deeper until you get to the latest models and then it's serious $.

So the question is, why the urge to move to 996 GT3s? Who will you compete against if anyone and what extra will you get out of the experience that you're not getting right now?

John McM

BTW: The logic in my choice of the C4 is that it will test my driving standard for a while, I can work on it myself and its possible destruction on the track [unlikely on Playdays] would be an annoyance not a financial tragedy.

Macca

John. Ill get in early and have a shot at this.

I assumed the group above were just into some fun weekend warrior stuff with their daily drivers. The 996 GT3 is the best car for the job of both road and track at he 80k price point. It would cost you 100k to get your 964 C4 into a state of tune comparable in performance and handling. Out of the box the GT3 has the drive to the track, enjoy it all day, drive home and go to work next day thing nailed.

I would not recommend a 996GT3 as the basis for any competitive racing, nor would I recommend a stock anything unless you have time and $$$ to make mistakes on the learning curve. If you try looking for "race car" on TM youll find 50-100 examples of vehicles people have poured money into, improved and then sold on for a vehicle in a different class. For 30k youll have your pick of heavily modified 944s. For 70k you can get an ex 2003 cup car! Subaru WRX tarmac rally cars, Lancer Evo shingle cars - you name iyt its there and if you want to go serious racing then save the pain and buy into a rig that's tested and ready to go.

If you are intending to contest Bridgetone B or C class I dont think anyone here would have recommended buying a base road car for a noobie.

I have no intentions of competing track races in my 993. I want a car that I can drive to the track, enjoy and learn in and which has the capability to be adjustable and competitive (for class of vehicke - i.e. road car) then drive home put in the garage and drive again 3 months later in a Targa Tour or similar. If I wanted to compete in a heartbeat Id spend 35k on a 350zx modified (from scratch) ex race/targa car or similar.

All IMHO of course (you know Ill always tell it as I see it LOL!).

Macca

Just to clarify the 964, 993, 996GT3 are not ideal basis for truning into competition cars o teh basis of their platform and capability but more so due to their value as stock road cars (in some cases very low production volumes) and their cost to improve/modify. People loose 10,000$$$ on their race cars. no one gets their dosh back. Better to by someones money pit and enjoy it till you grow out of it then pass it down etc...

Macca

Hi John. Think I found your wheels. Jamie from this NZ board bought them cheap on trade me years ago. Hes based in Otaki and sold them as they didnt fit well on his 964T. I reckon your C4 owner could have bought them. I recall seeing them in person....Im sure Jamie can pick the story up from here....Not sure we could even work out what they were at the time but i recall they are heavy.

Heres the yellow 996GT3 Bill Abercrombie purchased last year from Gillies. Matt, email me for Bills details if you want to see if you can pry it away from him...