Any Rennlisters from New Zealand?
02-22-2013, 08:57 PM
#1291
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Nik. After all these years lurking on our board when you going to buy yourself a nice little 964 to turn into an RS projekt? I reckon Matts might be a great start. Come on mate, ya cant sit on the sidelines forever, you know you want to and Hawkes Bay Real Estate must be lucrative surely LOL!
02-22-2013, 09:21 PM
#1292
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Peter. Its the car Tony Elsemore and others use at the EMD/PNZ driver training days - used to be all sticker-ed up. I think its seen alot of hard use but good to know its standing up well to the punishment. The clutch shouldn't be that heavy. I drove one briefly a while back and the clutch was no heavier than my 993. It must also have some sort of short shifter kit on it. They are a well balanced package and considerably easier to drive on the limit than our old tech steads. I wouldn't write it off but I would say in 6 months these will all be 50k or less and you'll be-able to get a nice original NZ new one low kms with some nice options for that kind of money. A well sorted late model Caymen S will be faster than any 964/993 (even considerably modified) in every way give like for like drivers IMHO.
I was very surprised about the clutch but that is coming from the C4 which I find perfect. On Friday I spent about half an hour coming through spaghetti junction at a crawl and just slightly uphill all the way - that was about my limit of tolerance! No way I could have done that in the Cayman.
Also very keen to hear how Matt's getting on with GT3s. That silver Mk II on TM also looks a great bit of kit at $100k.
02-22-2013, 09:25 PM
#1293
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I haven't seen the black GT3 yet. It was down at Motorsport Services for some work, coming back this week. I'll definitely post my thoughts once I've seen it.
Surprised to hear about the Cayman S's clutch, I found they are easier to daily than either of my current cars. Having said that, I'm used to a fairly heavy clutch and not much torque from the M3 and I guess the C4's clutch is on the high pressure system and has quite a different feel to the C2's?
A gen2 would be a great base for a dual purpose street/track car. Out of the box they're quicker than a 997 GT3 around low power tracks, and with a few suspension/tyre tweaks and a Guard LSD they'd be killer.
Surprised to hear about the Cayman S's clutch, I found they are easier to daily than either of my current cars. Having said that, I'm used to a fairly heavy clutch and not much torque from the M3 and I guess the C4's clutch is on the high pressure system and has quite a different feel to the C2's?
A gen2 would be a great base for a dual purpose street/track car. Out of the box they're quicker than a 997 GT3 around low power tracks, and with a few suspension/tyre tweaks and a Guard LSD they'd be killer.
02-22-2013, 10:31 PM
#1294
Rennlist Member
Hi Peter. Apologies. I made an assumption there not realizing they brought in and sold some to the public.
If you took 60kg out of a 2012 Cayman R (bucket seats, Lithium battery etc) on Dot rated tyres you'd definitely be giving a 997.1 GT3 stiff competition around any NZ tracks I would think. That's 1290kg for 330 bhp with superior dynamic vs 415 bhp for 1395kg. The GT3 as a 20% superior power to weight advantage but the Cayman chassis would negate much of that.
One thing was obvious from running against a Gen 1 2006 Cayman S with EKS (similar skilled driver) during the Targa (perhaps a better real world road comparison than on the track) was that he got out of his car after each session somewhat fresher than I did! Although in the end the 993 proved a little quicker I would say this was perhaps down to how hard it was being driven. Its a bit different with a clutch, constant heel and toe, no traction control or automatic box (which Im sure is faster on a Targa stage than a manual because of being in the torque zone more frequently). His 295hp and 1360kg for my 308hp and 1320kg. This time only a 6% power to weight benefit to the 911 but a quite different tech.
You felllas might be interested in the 964 C2 Tipo that joined us for the last two days of the Targa. It was driven by a unassuming guy who had campaigned it in 4 Targa tours. I was told before he joined that he was a good driver and could really pedal that little car. Sure enough he could peddle it alright. Mechanically the car was in good fettle but cosmetically it was pretty rough. It couldn't keep up with the 993 or Cayman but I tell you it wasn't that far behind. I asked him about the tipo (not having a high regard for these) and he said that once you learnt to anticipate the need to change a second before you needed the gear it was actually very good for the roads as it was on the more sporting map always in the ideal torque/power band. It was a bit of an eye opener but goes to show a good driver can pedal a tipo quite fast....
If you took 60kg out of a 2012 Cayman R (bucket seats, Lithium battery etc) on Dot rated tyres you'd definitely be giving a 997.1 GT3 stiff competition around any NZ tracks I would think. That's 1290kg for 330 bhp with superior dynamic vs 415 bhp for 1395kg. The GT3 as a 20% superior power to weight advantage but the Cayman chassis would negate much of that.
One thing was obvious from running against a Gen 1 2006 Cayman S with EKS (similar skilled driver) during the Targa (perhaps a better real world road comparison than on the track) was that he got out of his car after each session somewhat fresher than I did! Although in the end the 993 proved a little quicker I would say this was perhaps down to how hard it was being driven. Its a bit different with a clutch, constant heel and toe, no traction control or automatic box (which Im sure is faster on a Targa stage than a manual because of being in the torque zone more frequently). His 295hp and 1360kg for my 308hp and 1320kg. This time only a 6% power to weight benefit to the 911 but a quite different tech.
You felllas might be interested in the 964 C2 Tipo that joined us for the last two days of the Targa. It was driven by a unassuming guy who had campaigned it in 4 Targa tours. I was told before he joined that he was a good driver and could really pedal that little car. Sure enough he could peddle it alright. Mechanically the car was in good fettle but cosmetically it was pretty rough. It couldn't keep up with the 993 or Cayman but I tell you it wasn't that far behind. I asked him about the tipo (not having a high regard for these) and he said that once you learnt to anticipate the need to change a second before you needed the gear it was actually very good for the roads as it was on the more sporting map always in the ideal torque/power band. It was a bit of an eye opener but goes to show a good driver can pedal a tipo quite fast....
02-23-2013, 01:58 AM
#1295
Rennlist Member
Guys, I picked up the C4. Photos to follow when I can get to a PC. It's obviously a well loved car. Not perfect by any stretch but I'm very happy.
A touching part of this story is that the owner passed away a couple of days ago. His old personalized plate will be a part of his ceremony. This devotion to the marque is something only a few can understand. I'm sure to all do.
A touching part of this story is that the owner passed away a couple of days ago. His old personalized plate will be a part of his ceremony. This devotion to the marque is something only a few can understand. I'm sure to all do.
02-23-2013, 02:17 AM
#1296
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John - that's incredibly sad re the previous owner. Very cool to know that his family understood his passion even if it is little comfort at this time. I bet there's plenty of stories of the C4 and possibly others previous.
Look forward to photos. Presume its wash day tomorrow? I'll be doing the same if we get a bit of shade.
Macca - very interesting re the C2 Tip. I had one a few years back and I always found it a bit lacking. Same HP as the manual but I never found it as accessible - though it was mostly motorway miles. The 993 tip was a lot more eager from memory. Had another episode of sellers regret seeing it (the 993 S) at Motorscience the other day - was still looking in mint condition. John's TT was there at the same time - an amazing amount of performance for what that cost!
Look forward to photos. Presume its wash day tomorrow? I'll be doing the same if we get a bit of shade.
Macca - very interesting re the C2 Tip. I had one a few years back and I always found it a bit lacking. Same HP as the manual but I never found it as accessible - though it was mostly motorway miles. The 993 tip was a lot more eager from memory. Had another episode of sellers regret seeing it (the 993 S) at Motorscience the other day - was still looking in mint condition. John's TT was there at the same time - an amazing amount of performance for what that cost!
02-23-2013, 02:21 AM
#1297
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Peter - I know where the car lives if you ever get the urge, just up the road from me in Mt Eden. Spends a lot of time on the street as the guy only has a single garage.
02-23-2013, 02:23 AM
#1298
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Surprised to hear about the Cayman S's clutch, I found they are easier to daily than either of my current cars. Having said that, I'm used to a fairly heavy clutch and not much torque from the M3 and I guess the C4's clutch is on the high pressure system and has quite a different feel to the C2's?
A gen 2 would be a great base for a dual purpose street/track car. Out of the box they're quicker than a 997 GT3 around low power tracks, and with a few suspension/tyre tweaks and a Guard LSD they'd be killer.
A gen 2 would be a great base for a dual purpose street/track car. Out of the box they're quicker than a 997 GT3 around low power tracks, and with a few suspension/tyre tweaks and a Guard LSD they'd be killer.
02-23-2013, 02:24 AM
#1299
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Nik - are you the blue RS2 and Golf GTi man? I always thought you hankered for a 968 CS - the blue one on TM would match the RS2 nice - cheers (Audi-man)
02-23-2013, 02:32 AM
#1300
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Thanks Paul - amazing it's looking so good if it's lived outside. I sold it for a reason though (felt wrong to put commuting miles on it). Had it on track only once at Puke - in fact that was the only time I've met Macca - and it was not a track car. Purely a weekend garage queen. I'll resist temptation but thanks.
02-23-2013, 02:49 AM
#1301
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John. Glad your pleased with your purchase and sad to hear about the fate of the PO. They are burying me in mine so there will be no TM auctions!
Peter. Yes I too was surprised at the pace of the tipo 964 too! The owner has had the car 10 years and he sure knew how to drive the pants off if it. On the Gentle Annies first stage (maybe 16-18km) he fell behind me no more than about 1 km and although that's a fair bit in Targa terms I think it was a very impressive testament to both car and driver. I guess its like anything once you know how it handles you learn to exploit its traits. From a standing start its not a quick car but with three useable automatic gears (1st excluded) you have what you need for most of those roads in which I was using 3rd/4th and 5th (only very occasionally 6th).
I remember your 9932S at Puke. The green one. Lovely condition. That much have been 10 years ago!
Peter. Yes I too was surprised at the pace of the tipo 964 too! The owner has had the car 10 years and he sure knew how to drive the pants off if it. On the Gentle Annies first stage (maybe 16-18km) he fell behind me no more than about 1 km and although that's a fair bit in Targa terms I think it was a very impressive testament to both car and driver. I guess its like anything once you know how it handles you learn to exploit its traits. From a standing start its not a quick car but with three useable automatic gears (1st excluded) you have what you need for most of those roads in which I was using 3rd/4th and 5th (only very occasionally 6th).
I remember your 9932S at Puke. The green one. Lovely condition. That much have been 10 years ago!
02-23-2013, 02:08 PM
#1302
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First wash completed.
Condition consistent with age and mileage.
Ride very compliant. Big tyres help that no doubt. Indonesian made tyres give an idea of how much spirited driving was done in recent years!
No sign of rust. Evidence of paint work. Minor dents on bonnet from overstuffing boot.
Hole in carpet on sill from catching foot exiting the car. All other upholstery good. Left indicator not cancelling.
Parts noted as follows:
Techart spoiler, splitter and combined fog light/brake duct unit.
Ruf brake calipers - not sure if any other Ruf parts but possibles are suspension, primary exhaust bypass and exhaust tips.
Porsche steering wheel.
Tear drop mirrors with electric controls.
High level brake light.
Unidentified 2 piece wheels.
Metal clutch, brake and accelerator pedals.
Aftermarket handbrake lever and gear ****.
Condition consistent with age and mileage.
Ride very compliant. Big tyres help that no doubt. Indonesian made tyres give an idea of how much spirited driving was done in recent years!
No sign of rust. Evidence of paint work. Minor dents on bonnet from overstuffing boot.
Hole in carpet on sill from catching foot exiting the car. All other upholstery good. Left indicator not cancelling.
Parts noted as follows:
Techart spoiler, splitter and combined fog light/brake duct unit.
Ruf brake calipers - not sure if any other Ruf parts but possibles are suspension, primary exhaust bypass and exhaust tips.
Porsche steering wheel.
Tear drop mirrors with electric controls.
High level brake light.
Unidentified 2 piece wheels.
Metal clutch, brake and accelerator pedals.
Aftermarket handbrake lever and gear ****.
02-23-2013, 02:15 PM
#1305
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Guys, I will put a pause on new seats. I need to get some experienced eyes on this car as Sean suggested and see where to take it. There are too many variables and the base fact is that at my driving level I could take it to Hampton Downs today and have a great time without doing a thing.