cvtbenhogan

I think the 991 is hot. Oddly, the 991 C4 butt isn't as pronounced as in the 997.

kellen

What oil should I use????

In all seriousness drive them and buy what you like. Obviously the 991 is going to have updated nav and more features, which as I get older I appreciate more, especially after my girlfriend just got an E class. Makes me want some newer technology! Wish my 997 had a heated steering wheel, cooled seats, nav in the dash, rear camera and built in bluetooth. But not worth it to me to upgrade at this time.

StormRune

Yeah, it's interesting since the additional width between a 991 C4 & C2 is pretty much the same additional width between a 997 C4 & C2. I have a 991 C4S now and previously had both a 997 C4 and a C2S.

Without really digging into to it, my observation is that on the 997 C4 models the extra body width occurs more at the horizontal top of the fender then proceeeds in a sharper/rounder curve downward and drops with a more vertical line (compared to the 991 C4) down to the wheel opening, giving a more meaty-looking hip.

On the 991, the extra body width at the horizontal top of the fender doesn't come out as far, then curves down earlier and proceeds downward at somewhat more diagonal angle to the wheel opening. The overall width difference at the wheel opening is the same, it is just a bit more rounded off so it appears less substantial.

StormRune

Just for grins, I hunted around and found two C4 images from almost identical angles on opposite side of the car so that we could do a side-by-side comparison.

What is most apparent to me is the more diagonal section on the 991 just above the wheel well lip where the arrows are pointing. I know it's subtle in a way, but I think the difference definitely impacts the feel of the hips. You can see definite angle changes just above the wheel into the diagonal and then again at the top of the diagonal. The 997 is more continuously curved.

mikes70

I must say that for the longest time I had a hard time telling the difference between the two,. The first "clue" was the the side view mirrors, 997on the upper edge, the 991 on the door, then the rear tailight, 991 more pointy. But that last pic, I've never seen before, that's where I like the 991 more, didn't know what it was, but now I do, the "a$$"...

Suitcase

I have had many 911s.' I purchased a '14 C4 Coupe MT with 14k for $65k with CPO. I use it as my DD, drive the crap out of it and love it. Yesterday I was in my R. Ok, the R is something else. But I must say that the base 991 C4 is a great car. I previously owned four 997s'; '05 C2, '08 C4 Cab, '11 GT3, and '11 GT3RS. The 997 does feel smaller and more old school but other than the 3.8 RS (which is brilliant) I'll take my base 991 C4 all day long..including the 3.8 GT3. And as far as the base car goes, it more fun to drive a slow car (which it's really not) fast than a fast car slow. Note: Put it in sport and turn off the traction control on a dry day.

Fined

These threads are tired indeed. It's once every 3 months if not more. It's been discussed to death. A brief google search would reveal that.


In any case. It's all in what you want out of your 911. For me the only 991 that could get close to what I want out of my 911 is the GT3. All of the differences to design of the body of 991 are not welcomed. Only the chassis and drivetrain are improvements I'd value. I was also bored driving 991 and 991S. I would not own either of those two cars even at a steep discount.

Additionally.. trying to quantify the impact of the size of the 991 over 997.2 by use of exact dimension differences misses the point almost entirely. My perception is that the car looks significantly larger. That's not a problem with my perception, its a matter of the lines of the car and its design. Being both an artist and an engineer I fully grasp the nature of spatial relationships with regard to perceived visual size and weight. (note I don't speak of weight in terms of pounds or kilograms here). I'd say banging the drum about how it's "only an inch here and two inches there" just speaks to an individuals inability to grasp that our perceptions of space and visual weight do not hinge upon real dimension. This is how optical illusions in art and architecture work. So please.. put the drum down about how its just an inch here and two inches there. It's facile.

Valkuri

Not that I plan to part company with it, but: This just convinced me a little bit more to keep my '03 C4S.
Slightly tight for anyone who's BMI is >mid 20's. And, for anyone whose weight begins with a '2'?
Forget it.
Which makes it ever so slightly more exclusive in a way that $ cannot buy.
So long as I keep going to the gym and avoid the dessert table, that is…

Were I to get another, it would be an air cooled 911/912, or perhaps (Heresy!!) a 356 cabriolet replica, but with a Porsche engine.
It's not a 'real' Porsche: But, it's not a six figure garage queen, either.

starvational

Interesting...what made you move from the 997 GT3 and GT3RS and into a base 991 C4? I wouldn't mind driving the GT3 slow or fast any day of the week

Ynot

Like size, it's something people want to feel good about with what they currently have. If no one told you that it's electric steering, 90% of people out there will not be able to tell the difference. Steering is still direct and goes where you point it.

lol, that is very true, why is all American Muscle Car so huge compared to the European ones? Well just look around and your answer is in front of you.

Like electric steering, people need to complain about something to make them feel better.

3.) Performance, the new 991.2 is in the hyper car performance category
4.) Chassis, feels so much more stable than the 997
5.) Personally, I just think it looks better, subjective of course, especially the 991.2. The 997 is like the cute girl next door. The 991.2 is like that super model on the catwalk.

Same here, I think 991 looks great, the more I see it the more I like it.

I've said this a few times. I would had traded mine in a long time ago if I didn't spend so much on my 997. My 997 is very unique and I made it exactly the way I like it. Financially, it doesn't make sense to trade it in. The new 991.2 is a beast and I really want one. I might trade the 981 for one in a couple of years. Anyone who hasn't driven it should. It's insanely fast, makes my 997 TPC turbo feels slow in comparison.

vern1

^^^ but but but my 997 is sooo much rawer and visceral and analogue!! oh and its 1" shorter!!

Ynot

I wouldn't be going around telling everyone you are an inch shorter. I'ma stallion like my car.

vern1

No honestly its just my car that's shorter - you know, like shrinkage

Hey I love my car as much as the next guy and god knows I have sunk enough dough in to it with the rebuild but I always find these 997 vs whatever threads humorous esp when guys get bent out of shape about it

So you know what, I repent. Don't search, just fire away!!!

Suitcase

First I want to say theses are only my impressions. I certainly don't want to offend anyone because all of the cars being discussed are fantastic. I love 997's. I found that the 997.2 GT3 and the 997.2 GT3RS to be very different cars. The GT3 was very fast and maybe similar to the 997.1 3.6 RS. Somehow I just never bonded with the car. Or maybe I was already spoiled by the RS. I owned the RS first and possibly expected too much of the GT3. The 997.2 RS is a just a phenomenal car. It felt right in every way. I'd get out, walk away, and turn back asking myself how could it be that good?

Now the 991 C4. In 2012 I purchased a 12k Riviera Blue '98 C2S with 12k. This is a car I normally would have used sparingly; a Sunday car. I think we all understand some cars you drive anywhere and others are saved for Sunday.

Then there was a big change in my life. On that day I sat staring at the "Blue Streak" and said "what the ****, drive the car." And so it became my daily driver. For three years this very rare 993 was left outside, left at airports, driven anywhere and saw and additional 45,000. miles. During that time The Blue Streak was one of the best parts of my life and really kept me going through some tough times.

Then my life settled somewhat. I decided to retire the the "Blue Streak" as a DD. One day at my dealership I saw a one owner, '14 MT 991 C4, with GTS front bumper, duck tail and full Tubi. I thought it would make an excellent DD and it has. I've gotten very used to Bluetooth, Nav, Bose or maybe I'm just old. I consider it an incredible privilege to be fortunate enough to drive any of these cars everyday.

PS. The 993 photo is recent and after its tenure as a daily driver.

rodH

OK, so now I am confused. Most people that I hear talk about driving a "slow car fast" as being more fun than driving a "fast car slow", are referring to really light wt car that lacks refinement and wt, and have manual shifting, hydraulic steering, short wheelbase, etc, etc... In other words, a car that many refer to as being extremely "analog" (the new buzz word) or require more driving engagement, gives more road "feel" and feedback and is more "visceral" (Did I use all the words?). This to many refers to cars like the Miata, BRZ, S2000, 964, 993, E30 M3, etc.....

The confusing part to me is that you are relating it to a modern car (991 base vs a 997) that has more driver isolation, electric steering, larger, longer wheelbase, larger wheel diameter, which all add to the car being much "smoother" and much more refined.

In my opinion, you can't have it both ways, you can't call a car that is based on a platform that can handle 500HP and is also more refined and say it is "more fun to drive" slow. To me this doesn't work and is out of line with the logic of this discussion.

Now, if one said they would take a base 991 PDK over a 997 GT3 "everytime", and that they plan to use the vehicle for driving 60 miles in LA traffic every single day, that makes much more sense to me.

The 997 6MT in any form (C2S, 4S, GT3, etc....) is going to give a more "fun factor" of a canyon drive than the base 991 because it is smaller, closer wheelbase, hydraulic steering, etc... After all, the reason Porsche said they even produced the R is due to the complaints from Porsche-philes that the 991 lacked the driver involvement and feel of the older cars. This is why they completely re-engineered the steering, manual gear box, 4 wheel steering (handles more like a shorter wheelbase car). This is why so many, me included, LOVE the idea of the R. This is also why it is very curious to me that an R owner (assuming you love the car) would prefer a base 991 to a GT3 997 (the GT3 is significantly faster off the line, breaking, handling, track times, etc..and provides much more "feel" like a 911R would).

Saying that, this doesn't mean I do NOT like the 991. My brother has one, my dad has one and it drives more like a 997 than ANY car on the market and I think that some of the criticism of the hydraulic steering, increased size, modernism of the car is over played a little bit. Yes, the 997 may have more of that stuff, but it isn't has HUGE as everyone makes it out to be in my opinion.

I do prefer the smaller look of the 997, shorter wheelbase, more classic lines, etc... But I also absolutely LOVE the 911R and also really like the GT3.