Macboy

Nice discussion about weight. The T ethos is of course the weight. Of course you will not notice slight weight differences. But it’s also about the position of the weight. More weight on top like a sunroof will be more noticeable than a battery. But balance is everything so small weight difference and bringing the balance back tot 50/50 can also be easier felt. An extra passenger is also something all of us should feel a small difference. Also lighter wheels is something most people can feel the effect of because of its low weight position.

The point is that the driving character as a whole will not be affected by minor weight differences. Nobody will like the driving of the T without sunroof but hate it if its equipped. Those are all minimum changes. But I do think that everybody will feel the difference between the lightest possible T (manual, no back seats, carbon roof and carbon buckets, 67l) and the heaviest possible T (all options with PDK and the 18-way seats with backseats and glass sunroof and 90l). This is probably a 100kg difference. Still both will remain equally great cars and the difference should never be a dealbreaker for a road driven car. But we just like our T ethos here.


Great build. Would also add the 90l tank. About the Burmester: just bear in mind that the black look of the car will be pretty messed up by its silver speakers. You can save yourself a lot of money if you buy an after market package. I also usually don’t like aftermarket. But I will never pay so much for Burmester and have my dark interior style ruined.

You are correct that the decklid is completely different. The aero kit deletes the brake light in rear lid as an example of that.

TomTarzian

They need a new car (or an allocation?) to trade and they don't have any. Everything is spoken for. This is a very small dealer with customer service most people only dream about. I'm not kidding. I would rather wait a year--and at my age of nearly 77 a year really matters ;-) --to get a car from them than get one right away from a typical dealer.

God bless you,
TT

TomTarzian

Will you ever get the weight distribution of a production 911 close to 50/50...without putting some really heavy weight in the frunk?

God bless you,
TT

ipse dixit

For a 911 to drive like a proper 911, the weight distribution of the car should not be 50/50.

If you want 50/50, get a Cayman.

(And, no, the 911 RSR does not count, as that is a result of BOP.)

TomTarzian

Amen!

God bless you,
TT

SupraSaiyan

I only own and drive manual and this Carrera T will be a daily so it has to be manual

Gibberish

What are the thoughts on the 992.2 T?
That's if Porsche continues to make the T into the .2,

Will the .2 Start at MY24 after the August factory reopening?

Are we looking at Hybridization of all non GT 911 models?
If so then we would probably loose the MT option.

Would we be loosing the 3.0tt in favour of an n/a Hybrid unit?

Just some thoughts that cropped into my mind last night whilst trying to sleep..

At 1am i concluded;
MY24 now seems very close and with so few T's actually being allocated production numbers would be so small if it only ran upto August 2023 so it's likely to carry onto MY24, but that surely pushes back the 992.2 to MY25.

For the 992.2 with the changes being made and all test mules showing the yellow hybrid sticker it makes me think all non GT 911's will be hybrid, which makes me think a turbocharged hybrid car is going to be very heavy indeed.

Possibly a lighter n/a engine could be used with added hybrid power (70-90bhp) to make up for the lack of turbos?

I know there is a 992.2 thread but it's not as lively as this one 👍

Pivot

My thoughts are that model T has become a tradition at the end of the model cycle, to produce a parts-bin special model that is kitted out as “the best of derivative” for the enthusiasts. Light-weight (1.5 Ton!) marketing spin aside, it is kitted out with attractive, although adding weight options as standard.

Modern production plants can easily produce different models on the same line, and I believe that Porsche has multiple lines (hopefully someone will confirm or correct me). 992.1/.2 has the same body/floorpan, so it will coexist/overlap for few months, until old parts bin is depleted and at that point it will make it even more attractive car. The next T will be in 3-4 years at the end of 992.2 cycle.

I make the above speculations, based on discussions with various SE’s while hunting for a new 911. I realise that US and UK markets have their nuances, but I was told (in UK) that if I place an order for an S and GTS today, I will get it only in 2 years time, it will be 992.2 model and an S is ‘typically’ launched first, followed by the GTS, at least few months later. Then we get GT3, followed by the RS, some heritage specials, and back to the T to run it out as “the best of hit” again.

Incredibly efficient and merciless plan perfected over the last 60 years!

IPA1

https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-cul...wer-explained/

This is a short explainer that puts weight and horsepower into a neat perspective. In our "T" case 100# = plus or minus ~12HP depending on which side of the scale you are on. It also explains the impact on handling and braking pretty well too. Result, I need to up my weight loss goals. Pretty soon I'll have "S" car go, on a "T" bone budget.

Scott P

My point is even people who have done a lot of time on tracks (me) have a difficult time feeling the difference in performance even when I'm carrying a passenger. Of course weight matters, if you could you'd ask Colin Chapman. If you get the T with rear seats then take those seats out (15#) you'd be hard-pressed to notice a drop off in performance or handling. I've modified a few cars: M3, 650GC, 350Z and a 330. I've done countless laps at Watkins Glen so I understand fully, vehicle dynamics. Weight reduction is not the reason I'm buying the T, I'm buying what I consider to be the sweet spot in the lineup without going crazy on expense. I wanted a Base but with no manual available that killed that choice immediately. The T ticks all the necessary boxes for me.

arrivederci

Again well said. A car with a sunroof will not be materially slower than one with a carbon roof...not unless someone here is actually named Max or Lewis and you are planning to enter into some racing series with $$ at stake. Build the car as you want it - they will all be equally fun, responsive, and agile. Driver skill would be the true differentiator at the track on any factory stock T.

My point about modern 911s being heavy - if someone is that weight obsessed, I would suggest a different car.

Gibberish

Interesting take on the overlap, just be going off the 991.1 to 991.2 the base & S carried on through, the GTS typically followed 18 months after.
Wondering whether the T will just carry on with the Base and S into MY24 and 992.2 or will they follow suit of the GTS and push it back 18 months.
I was told earlier last year the .2 will be announced late spring 2023, but since read somewhere it's being pushed to 2024 due to supply issues.. I guess it's just a wait and see. 😉
Anyway... How much weight does the smoking package add?? 😂

6sigma

Part of the T 'ethos' to me is lower cost, along with lower weight. I see the T as the enthusiast value play in the lineup. Not that a $120k (US $) starting price is a cheap car, but it does represent a relative value in the new 911 world. A tarted up T with all the expensive options at $140k or $150k doesn't make sense to me, even though carbon roof, LWBS, etc save weight or add performance. I'd consider a different model (S/GTS, or CPO GT3) if I got too far up the option list on a T. I believe weight does matter, even on a street car, which is another reason to keep the options light. Just my opinion, of course. Porsche has mastered the art of separating money from their buyers!

Pivot

Smoking package is a cunning plan to reduce the GVM, as smoking people are typically lighter than allegedly healthier non-smokers.

FORENN

Thank you. Always helpful.

Many small and even medium-sized dealerships are in this position, and have been for a while now.