Originally Posted by Yargk

Why do I return to this thread?
Of course, price matters to me and affects the affordability of the car. However, what brings me back to the thread, despite the noise, is that I think the accessibility of these cars matters for what the car is, what it becomes, how it is used, and what community it brings to the brand.

I was a Porsche owner back when the first GT3 was released in Europe and I've been reading the forums about these cars since the release of the 996.2 GT3. These cars being relatively accessible for the first few generations got a lot of people into community and out on track. These people were stripping out the interiors of brand new cars in 2004, just for DE. Is that stupid? yes! Is that fun? hell yes! Everyone assumed the price of the car wouldn't hold, so they instead enjoyed the car. It was a better vibe on rennlist 18 years ago. Not saying it's not fun now, some of that spirit is still here, but it's harder to find.

When the market gets crazy, there are two options.
1. Have a real waitlist that fills up years ahead or have a lottery for the cars. This could be done at a national level instead of dealing with individual dealers. Make it difficult to resell in less than a year. Make it illegal to charge ADM (it is illegal in many countries, this isn't new). While not all enthusiasts will get a car, this will eliminate the flippers to a large degree and create a transparent process that is a little more fair and will keep the brand aspirational instead of exclusive creating more loyal customers for Porsche in good times and bad (especially young ones who might not have patience for dealer games).

2. Allow dealers and flippers to hoard cars and sell them off to effectively the highest bidder. Flippers will sell to flippers, or at least buyers whose calculation of ownership includes getting their money out. Those buyers are motivated to drive less and risk less on their investment. Younger buyers who aren't super-rich and buyers that are more upper-middle class than upper class will be excluded and start looking elsewhere. There will still be GT3s at track days (esp. bay area!) but fewer and the vibe will be a little different.

With the current supply and demand, I don't think we can have as nice a community and cars in the hands of as many enthusiast track day drivers without taking some of the steps in option 1. However, option 1 is incompatible with the ideas of "a dealer and a buyer can do whatever they want, it's America!" Option 1 is better for the brand in the long term because Porsche would be more able to capture market trends when they want (raising prices) or expand their customer base (leave prices low and let people with a slightly wider range of incomes have a chance at buying). And again, option 1 is certainly better for the community and customer experience.

What people don't realize is that option 2 isn't really what people call a "free market" in the strictest sense. In a free market there has to be an agent (seller) who can price the car lower and get more supply to outcompete the competition. With a limited number of cars, the few dealers who sell at MSRP aren't getting hundreds of cars more than the ones who don't, so we are missing a mechanism on the supply side for prices to lower. Each dealer or flipper has only a few cars, so when one decides to sell for a little lower, there isn't much pressure on the other sellers. (Prices can come down, but they take longer) Although they aren't an organized cartel (think diamonds and oil), with few enough cars and similar actions from all sellers (hold and gorge), we effectively have a cartel. This isn't free market capitalism in the version that creates all the things we love about capitalism (efficiencies and innovation!). This is crappy cartel capitalism where a few agents leech on the economy. The version of capitalism that's great is the one that keeps Porsches competing with McLarens, Corvettes, BMWs, Mercs, etc. to create the best products. And for Porsche to be the most competitive in the game at that level, in the long run, they need to rein in their dealers.

Originally Posted by Ascend

I love how its all crickets when I do bother to post photos. Fooled by nimrods once again LOL.


My prediction. "This is your uncle's / dad's car" 😂😂😂

Originally Posted by Ascend

My guess is diablo spent his life saving + 401k on his gt3 so he gets very angry when he is told the obvious fact of gt3 price dropping lol.

Dude, look at what happened to 991.1 gt3. Exact same thing will happen to your investment of life 😂

Originally Posted by Diablo Dude

Yeah, it's been a rough start to the month for me.
And you think I'm worried about the ADM that I paid.
You're comical.

Originally Posted by Yargk

Although they aren't an organized cartel (think diamonds and oil), with few enough cars and similar actions from all sellers (hold and gorge), we effectively have a cartel. This isn't free market capitalism in the version that creates all the things we love about capitalism (efficiencies and innovation!). This is crappy cartel capitalism where a few agents leech on the economy.

Originally Posted by Diablo Dude

Yeah, it's been a rough start to the month for me.
And you think I'm worried about the ADM that I paid.
You're comical.

Originally Posted by Ascend

Good job diablo. Nursing homes are expensive these days. Better save up! 👍