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^ It will be undriveable slammed like that. The body will be too close to the ground. More importantly, there would be zero suspension travel left and springs would have to be so hard (for such a heavy car) to prevent bottoming out that it will be creaking like a MF with such low torsional rigidity. But it may be good looking, from the front.
I have probably been the C8s biggest flag waver here.
I'm not sure you're the C8's biggest flag waver here.. How about you guys beat the living crap out of one another for that title.
That's about all that's left to do in this thread.
Originally Posted by TexasRider
Corvette "quality" has improved in every generation. And I suspect the C8 is better still. The C7 certainly isn't bad by any measure.
I believe when guys are talking incessantly about "quality" here it is related more to luxury. Corvette should be a sports car first and then some luxo bits too if thats what you want . It isn't for everybody . . and it doesn't have to be or make excuses for that. Did they, will they , have some issues? Yes they ALL do and I can say with complete confidence and from experience that Porsche and Ferrari and all the rest does too.
We've already beat the crap out of the subject of quality so again, I have to disagree categorically.
I was on track to get a C7 Grandsport w/A8 transmission but my research (on the Corvette forum) uncovered a giant stack of quality issues for the C7 in general,
plus a smaller stack of quality problems specific to the Grandsport.
In addition, it became painfully obvious to me that GM is likely the worst car company in the world and that owning a GM car under warranty would not be a good experience.
But I also knew the mid-engine C8 was on the horizon so was willing to hang back and see how that rolled out.
Then it was delay delay delay the C8 launch date which I took as a series of very bad signs, so decided to move on and look else where.
It was QUALITY that drove me away.
=> Note - that ended my use of the Corvette forum. I left and I haven't been back. I don't see any purpose in posting about a different car over there. hint hint.
Rambling on and on about the C8 here on the Porsche Forum isn't going to change my mind about my mid-engine Base Cayman w/PDK for a second. I'm in love with that car!
The tried and true DCT PDK makes the car bolt around like lightening. The quality built into the car is leagues above anything GM has ever made.
At some point, I will worm my way into a GT variety of the Cayman.
Originally Posted by .2PDK
Brake by wire should be way down the list of things to "shake out".
That bespoke Tremec DCT should top the list IMHO.
If it proves reliable then GM will have a winner.
If it becomes the new A8t then watch out.
Ding ding +10
Hadn't heard that bit about the brakes and agree it should be less of an issue. Fingers crossed GM can't screw that one up too bad.
That DCT with AFM is a scary proposition. No other car manufacturer has ventured into those waters.. and likely for good reason.
I’ll restate: 911’s have had people talking for 60 years.
Originally Posted by ZDan 2019 - 1964 = 55
2019 - 1953 = 66
Originally Posted by K-A
Pretending not to know about rounding numbers up.
It is not always appropriate to round to a more desirable figure. If your car does 115mph in the 1/4, you can't say "she'll do 120mph in the 1/4". If you have been in business for 55 (or 56) years, you can't say you've been in business for 60 years, because you haven't!
If you are giving a 2-digit number of years, why would you round to 10 year increments? 5,995 might quite reasonably be rounded to ~6,000 (depending on context!) but "rounding" 55 (or 56) years to 60? It just isn't done. It's just as easy to type 55 (or 56) anyway, or you could say "more than 50 years" or "going on 60 years", and then you don't have to be WRONG.
*Anyway*, your whole point is negated because Corvettes have "had people talking" for a longer time than 911s have...
Hard to believe that only 20% of C7 buyers opted for a manual last year. OTOH I suppose that so many people live in the city, and just don't want to go through the hassle of shifting every few seconds.
Corvette folks aren't necessarily automotive enthusiasts. And even many of the ones that are, are more Corvette enthusiasts than general car guys. Also they're quite aged, many want their wife to be able to drive, etc. Some are women who just want a convertible. For many, a Corvette is their first (and only) sportscar purchase, an achievement earned shortly after getting that AARP card. I suspect a surprising portion of owners wouldn't even know how to operate a manual box.
Plus for the C7, many bought into the Chevy marketing BS that the automatic was "quicker than PDK" etc. And then there was the simple fact that the auto slushbox in the C7 was faster than the stick.
But again mostly it's the demos of the buyer. You could make a similar compelling argument for many 911 buyers too.
Originally Posted by ipse dixit
Hard to believe that there were as many as 20% buyers who wanted a MT C7 Corvette.
+1
I doubt that a majority of owners will even appreciate the difference between a DCT and the old slushbox. However that still leaves thousands who do.
Corvette folks aren't necessarily automotive enthusiasts. And even many of the ones that are, are more Corvette enthusiasts than general car guys. Also they're quite aged, many want their wife to be able to drive, etc. Some are women who just want a convertible. For many, a Corvette is their first (and only) sportscar purchase, an achievement earned shortly after getting that AARP card. I suspect a surprising portion of owners wouldn't even know how to operate a manual box.
Plus for the C7, many bought into the Chevy marketing BS that the automatic was "quicker than PDK" etc. And then there was the simple fact that the auto slushbox in the C7 was faster than the stick.
But again mostly it's the demos of the buyer. You could make a similar compelling argument for many 911 buyers too.
+1
I doubt that a majority of owners will even appreciate the difference between a DCT and the old slushbox. However that still leaves thousands who do.
Porsche elitism dripping! You gotta love it ! Time to wake up....
Take a look at some photos from Porsche Club meetings, tell me what the ages look like like to you
Take a look at the amount of miles Corvettes are logging in at tracks around the country including Porsche Club guys using Corvette because it's such a great track car
Take a look at the survey here of how many guys are buying a C8.
Corvette folks aren't necessarily automotive enthusiasts. And even many of the ones that are, are more Corvette enthusiasts than general car guys. Also they're quite aged, many want their wife to be able to drive, etc. Some are women who just want a convertible. For many, a Corvette is their first (and only) sportscar purchase, an achievement earned shortly after getting that AARP card. I suspect a surprising portion of owners wouldn't even know how to operate a manual box.
Plus for the C7, many bought into the Chevy marketing BS that the automatic was "quicker than PDK" etc. And then there was the simple fact that the auto slushbox in the C7 was faster than the stick.
But again mostly it's the demos of the buyer. You could make a similar compelling argument for many 911 buyers too.
+1
I doubt that a majority of owners will even appreciate the difference between a DCT and the old slushbox. However that still leaves thousands who do.
This has to be one of the most uninformed posts I have read on any forum. Almost every comment you make is patently untrue. The Z06 wasn't even offered with the A8 until the C7 came out. So your comment about manual transmissions is a joke. I went for the A8 because I didn't know how bad it was going to be and it was the first time an automatic was offered in the Z06 or ZR1. As to whether we are car guys, another uninformed assumption. If you ever drove a CZ A8 at the track you would know that if you leave it in auto and put it in track mode it shifts very fast. The problem with it is that it overheats in one or two hard laps, not that it can't shift fast. But the PDK is so far superior that it isn't a fair comparison. But it is a POS tranny. Not car guys? The aftermarket business for Corvettes is huge. The performance upgrades for Corvettes range from a simple CAI to twin turbo monsters. I don't know where you are getting this info but if you were even at a single viper/vette HPDE you would see that the range of ages is extremely broad. Main reason, it is much more affordable for more people than the Porsche. Go read some of the forum technical posts on the Corvette Forum and you will see how wrong you are.
If there is a hate towards Porsche owners on the Corvette forums, which I never noticed, it is because of ignorant comments like this. What a joke.
My first Vette was a 59. Sold it when I went to Greenland. My next was a 63 Stingray. Bought both in Tucson. When they 'bloated' them in 68, I walked away. Same for the Thunderbird. Also spoke with a Vette family who had an 08 and a 2013. They said there was no comparison, the 13 was so much better, but I didn't care for the edgy styling. I have a 55 Chev-425 HP big block, a 79 Olds Cutlass Supreme Brougham V8, 2 BMW Z3's and an 03 Boxster. Boy, are the latter 2 different breeds of cats. There are things I prefer in both. The Z's seem to sit higher and have more of a go cart feel whereas the Boxster is larger and more modern feeling. Also have an 08 BMW 528i, and had a Saab and a Audi 5000. Interesting in that every time I sell a European car, I swear I will never buy another, yet here I am. How many of you can relate? I must really be a dumb ***. Love the feel of the 08 though. I only go to the dealer when I have no other option and only own them because I have a friend who has a 'foreign' shop. See, I had an 03 Toyota Avalon which was a rental car. Updated the suspension and other appearance items. Believe it or not, it transformed into a fun car to drive .Made it drive like a different car. I almost preferred it to the 528i on mountain curves. Of course, the 5 would have had it at the limits, but who normally drives there? A Lexus dealer looked at it t 112k miles and said, "You have not has one problem with this car, have you?" Nope. Kinda spoils you, it does. But then there is the new C8 Vette. Drool. Really like it. But.. I'm cheap. I buy private and pay no sales tax in AZ. I have about 12 grand total in both Z3's and the Boxster. I love the art of the deal. Kinda hate it when the deal closes.
So the C8 sucks because the not made anymore 991.1 is lighter and also because of theoretical muh torsional rigidity.
The real sports car's car sports car was almost the VW Mk1 Scirocco as it was around 1500lbs it was doomed when the torsionally more rigid people's sports car Koenigsegg became available along with the more accessible McLarens and even the 919 which was more ridged than a Scirocco even with the best aftermarket sway bars installed.
Not even the Wolfsburg edition upgrade could compete and now the only serious use of the car is for drifters with rock hard high profile 165 tires as we all know drifting wind races, period.
Plus there's that stupid trunk to hold the targa top when they should have made it a hard top that way you could use that trunk in the future to hold your buddy's 991 targa spare parts for when that Decepticon Roof-Goldberg machine craps out post warranty and no one knows how to fix it other than a new crated one from Germany at 5X retail.
So C8 is doomed. It won't sell very many because the depreciation curve will be relatively stepper than a Bugatti and owning one won't get you a Porsche GT allocation anyway to flip to another flipper to sell to a bubble wrapper speculator because it's the last NA manual ever (srsly this time we promise) plus Chevy doesn't even offer glossy black door handles anyway.
Better to just get a base Cayman stripper and reserve ad space now for the year 2045 Robb Report between full page adds for $80,000 watches and $60,000 trained German Shepards while using your track winnings to buy shorts in white New Balance's because that is one sector you don't want to be in when C8 sales crater to their true hypercar competition.
Corvette folks aren't necessarily automotive enthusiasts. And even many of the ones that are, are more Corvette enthusiasts than general car guys. Also they're quite aged, many want their wife to be able to drive, etc. Some are women who just want a convertible. For many, a Corvette is their first (and only) sportscar purchase, an achievement earned shortly after getting that AARP card. I suspect a surprising portion of owners wouldn't even know how to operate a manual box.
Plus for the C7, many bought into the Chevy marketing BS that the automatic was "quicker than PDK" etc. And then there was the simple fact that the auto slushbox in the C7 was faster than the stick.
But again mostly it's the demos of the buyer. You could make a similar compelling argument for many 911 buyers too.
+1
I doubt that a majority of owners will even appreciate the difference between a DCT and the old slushbox. However that still leaves thousands who do.
And just how many Corvette folks do you know? You know that there are hundreds of thousands of Corvette owners, and if you are really active in Corvette clubs, you may know .1% of them. I know fewer than 20 Vette owners. So I'm not about to make a statement that applies to all Vette owners. I can state that your observations do not apply to the majority of Vette owners that I know.
Dang, didn't know my post would generate so much vitriol
Sorry I think some of y'all have thin skin.
Originally Posted by 993NYS
Porsche elitism dripping! You gotta love it ! Time to wake up....
Take a look at some photos from Porsche Club meetings, tell me what the ages look like like to you
Take a look at the amount of miles Corvettes are logging in at tracks around the country including Porsche Club guys using Corvette because it's such a great track car
Take a look at the survey here of how many guys are buying a C8.
Sorry, C7 and C8 charging the game
First, I don't own a Porsche, FWIW.
Yeah Porsches and Vettes, old guys with gray hair. At least the new ones. Why? Because they're the guys with the money to buy them. That's OK.
Definitely tons of owners track their vettes. But for every 1 guy who goes to the track, there are 10 retirees, dentists, plumbers who have never seen a track. That's OK. Not corvette driver has to be a car nut. That's not a slight, that's the truth.
Originally Posted by Canes78
This has to be one of the most uninformed posts I have read on any forum. Almost every comment you make is patently untrue. The Z06 wasn't even offered with the A8 until the C7 came out. So your comment about manual transmissions is a joke. I went for the A8 because I didn't know how bad it was going to be and it was the first time an automatic was offered in the Z06 or ZR1. As to whether we are car guys, another uninformed assumption. If you ever drove a CZ A8 at the track you would know that if you leave it in auto and put it in track mode it shifts very fast. The problem with it is that it overheats in one or two hard laps, not that it can't shift fast. But the PDK is so far superior that it isn't a fair comparison. But it is a POS tranny. Not car guys? The aftermarket business for Corvettes is huge. The performance upgrades for Corvettes range from a simple CAI to twin turbo monsters. I don't know where you are getting this info but if you were even at a single viper/vette HPDE you would see that the range of ages is extremely broad. Main reason, it is much more affordable for more people than the Porsche. Go read some of the forum technical posts on the Corvette Forum and you will see how wrong you are.
If there is a hate towards Porsche owners on the Corvette forums, which I never noticed, it is because of ignorant comments like this. What a joke.
Exactly what was untrue?
Not every Corvette is a Z06
Sounds like I hit the nail on the head with my remark on some folks buying into the Chevy marketing on that A8 in the C7.
I think some of y'all are forgetting that Chevy sells 10,000, 20,000, 30,000, 40,000 of these cars per year. Not every Corvette owner mods their car or watches LMGTE. I doubt a majority of vette owners even knows what HPDE stands for. And that's OK.
Originally Posted by fast1
And just how many Corvette folks do you know? You know that there are hundreds of thousands of Corvette owners, and if you are really active in Corvette clubs, you may know .1% of them. I know fewer than 20 Vette owners. So I'm not about to make a statement that applies to all Vette owners. I can state that your observations do not apply to the majority of Vette owners that I know.
Tons. Been around them my whole life. Been to the club events. Sat through shows. Some of my earliest car memories included my dad's crappy C3 corvette. Wow that thing rode rough, and I remember that from when I was 3 y/o.
Yeah there have probably been a million corvette owners by now. Not every owner joins the club. Not every owner has white hair. Not every owner is a pornographer. Etc.
Never said anything about "all vette owners." Again I think there is some thin skin here.
08-06-2019, 03:34 AM
