Needsdecaf

Just coming here to post a similar article. I'm going to respond to that bogus email and see what they have to say.

Freaking PISSED.

gnat

Meh. Knew there was no way the 13s wouldn't get pulled in.

I'll reserve being pissed until there is actually something concrete to be pissed about. I still expect any "fix" to the CD to be minimal to where the vast majority of drivers won't notice any difference.

visitador

It is called 2016 Porsche Cayenne S. I'll just call PCA to replace my current CD with one of those. They don't have a headache. I don't have one



...wishful Friday afternoon thinking

Needsdecaf

I am pissed about the resale value hit that this will have. Even though I plan on keeping the car a while.

I am also pissed that whatever fix they make will have detrimental effects on economy or performance.

gnat

If you are planning to keep it awhile, then there is nothing to be pissed about the resale hit until you actually go to resell it

You want to talk about Porsche screwing your resale? We bought her 996 new!

As far as any detriments of a fix, I contend that since we already have the AdBlue system we aren't going to notice any change for the most part. A higher rate of AdBlue consumption is probably going to be the biggest issue. Again though, until a fix actually comes down and we know what it does, there isn't much to be gained by being pissed now.

Much better to just keeping driving and enjoying it

endless_corners

This whole thing is such a dog and pony show. Meanwhile the big banks that knowingly sold sub prime mortgages to investors got off scott free.

JRoach

Let's assume this blows over by years end. What will they do with all the product that was lined up to sell/deliver but they couldn't. They wouldn't crush them so will they need to convert them into a MY16. Lets assume the are/were MY16 already and they don't have to cross that bridge. There will still be a few more than normal sitting on the dock, on a boat, at manufacturing or at the dealer. Will they move them at an incentive price and if so what happens to us. Hey, when we buy a car we never really know what the RV will be and if you didn't lease it there is no guarantee but there does need to be some good-will demonstrated.

What do you think is reasonable?
Something like VW did ($1000 in gift cards/vouchers).
Discount on a future purchase.
Cash you out of your current car.

I think the majority of us like our car but we don't want to be taken advantage of. I'd be curious to what CD owners think is fair...maybe even a little more than fair.

Thoughts?

gnat

They won't/can't change the MY on a car that has been built. It's part of the VIN if nothing else.

What has already been sold to customers will be delivered. What are dealer cars will go to the dealers where they'll have to sell them. They'll probably start out with whatever the typical discount the dealer offers, but anything that sits on the lot for more than a month will start to see extra incentives to get it to move.

With the new revelations I also don't expect this to wrap up before the end of the year, though since the stop sale is not mandated VAG can start selling the cars again at anytime.

Izzone

The downfall is when they start heavy discounting cars it will hurt the resale of existing cars....not good

gnat

Only until the backlog is cleared. Once they get back to limited stock they'll remove any extra discounts and be back to normal. Now how long it takes to clear the backlog is another question altogether.

PJ Cayenne

JR- I don't think this will blow over by year end. They haven't even developed a fix or solution for the 4 cyl issue. Plus, they need to work a deal with the EPA, which will take a long time.

Here are my concerns:
1. Will an unmodified CD pass an emissions test?
2. If the answer to #1 is no, what will a modified CD drive like?
3. As far as I am concerned, if a modification causes any, and I mean any drop in performance and fuel economy, that is a non-starter. It is not what I bought. Who determines what a slight or non-noticeable drop in performance will be?
4. Resale value- We don't buy Porsches to save money, we buy them due to the brand's perceived value and reputation. When that value is severely diminished due to fraud, (not a frumpy design, etc), we have a legitimate claim.

Based on what I've heard, with no one telling me I can own and register my Cayenne in the future as it currently performs, it breaks my heart to conclude they need to cash me out. I love this car, but they've screwed us, and it is too much money to ignore.

gnat

PJ, until they change the testing process your Cayenne will continue to pass emissions.

The only question about the future legality of your Cayenne is IF your given state will require any recall to be applied before they will register it. On the Cayenne this will almost definitely be left up to the state to decide rather than the Feds demanding it (the 2.0 will probably get that treatment). Of the states, the only one that consistently force recalls to be performed is California.

So in all likelihood as long as you avoid the dealer you won't have to have any update applied and can enjoy it exactly as it is now.

Any impact will have to be provable which means someone putting it on a dyno before and after. There will be an impact, but I will put money on the average person not being able to tell (they will claim they can tell, but they really can't). Even still, there will be a class action suit and that will be your easiest method to line the pockets of lawyers via this mess.

I just wish people would stop freaking out about all this. Right now we know next to nothing (including if there is an actual violation) so getting upset over worst case scenarios is just silly.

Calm down and go enjoy your car

PJ Cayenne

Yeah, I'm calm. Just the uncertainty that we may have to eat a plate of crap one day is annoying me on what should be a terrific ownership experience.

I wouldn't mind a huge discount on a 991.2, would certainly put a grin on my face. I hear the new 991S is a freakin' missile.

skiahh

Correct. Consumers will see a small token while the lawyers take in millions. And it'll probably start in CA so we'll all be opted in by email, but have to exclude ourselves from the class by written correspondence, written a certain way, on a certain colored paper, folded just so, while hopping on one foot with one eye closed and sipping a specific vintage wine (sorry, I've had a couple of those in the last couple of years; who knows how many have been filtered to the spam folder?). Otherwise, your exclusion will be excluded and you'll get your $100 gift card and no recourse to sue individually for what you think is appropriate compensation.

Personally, if they reduce the performance or mileage of my CD (and presumably all current and future CDs), I would want a full MSRP trade value on a new Cayenne S of equal spec. Assuming I couldn't just avoid the flash all together but continue to have service done at the dealer, should I choose.

mdrobc1213

Just saw it...knew it could be good news. This really sucks! Explains my dealer email on my CD order this AM.
Yeah dealer has already offered to find us a v6 or any other Cayenne model (other than diesel in US stock and do a dealer trade for it) or order a brand new '16 Cayenne.
With the news that now the diesel hit goes all the way back to 2009; yes re-sale value will most definitely take a hit. Remember that is when VW began to strongly push to introduce diesels to the US. First with VW, then Audi, now Porsche. That's a whole lot of vehicles which will take a hit now and be subject to recall. My buddy owns both a VW diesel and BMW diesel and has already gotten offers for the VW gift card and $500 coupon from VW. I find it hard to believe even after the fix that the cars will retain their residuals and be without scar or blemish after the scandal.
True. My '16 CD just hit port in San Diego and will likely just sit dealer says. They won't even take delivery to the dealership with Porsche's stop order. Another forum member says his didn't even make the port and is still on the dock in Emden. With this new change and also now the increased amount of cars and model years...there's very little chance this will blow over and be concluded in a month or so. My best bet is 12 mos especially with the EPA now investigating all diesel models by VW since 2009? Jeezus that's a lot of cars! Add into it govt bureaucracy and you've got the makings of a very long wait to buy one even if they ever let you again.
And that my friend is my real fear. They say they are safe to drive but if they cannot pass new emissions standards or future ones you're screwed as the state licensing folks won't let you register them. If you're in say some place like CA with strict laws then you may be hosed. For example, DOD and AD folks here in AZ were just informed we now have to have all of our vehicles emissions tested to be in compliance with Fed guidelines by Jan 2016 under some AZ ECARS program. Doesn't matter if you're out of state or not; proof of emissions testing (passed) must be done or if checked by EPA (they can do it by polling the database) fines can be levied for each vehicle. Base Commander won't like nor let that happen as its the law he and we must comply with. So if the current and past cars bust the emissions guidelines; tell me again the new cars will be okay? Last I saw VW didn't have a real fix for them yet either and my dealer confirmed that today with what he got from PCA regarding our ordered car! Its the rules and compliance that will kill us and the perceived value of the diesel Cayenne's I am afraid.

From VW
The announcement of a potential fix also confirms the suggestion that different diesel engines implicated in the crisis will require different fixes:

Read more: http://autoweek.com/article/vw-diese...#ixzz3sBFJxdFF

Underlying unsaid here to me is don't expect any fixes anytime soon!
Yeah...think I am gonna have to move to either a different model Range Rover Sport diesel or Mercedes Benz Diesel or move to the v6 model at this point. I don't see this ending anytime soon.