blown engine
11-29-2016, 09:06 AM
#766
Race Director
As usual your workmanship looks flawless and very meticulous Ahsai. Thanks for the detailed pics. When do you think you'll be able to fire up your new motor?
11-29-2016, 10:28 AM
#767
Cruisin'
Join Date: Aug 2016
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So much for the LNE claim that their single row bearings have a 50k service interval. Im assuming it was not the new single row pro version.
Its good to have this info because you never can trust the bluster of the parts suppliers ...
If I were you I would just wait until a good used motor shows up online and keep your old motor to practice on it. The car has 105K miles so there are likely used ones with lower miles.
Its good to have this info because you never can trust the bluster of the parts suppliers ...
If I were you I would just wait until a good used motor shows up online and keep your old motor to practice on it. The car has 105K miles so there are likely used ones with lower miles.
11-29-2016, 12:51 PM
#769
!!!
So much for the LNE claim that their single row bearings have a 50k service interval. Im assuming it was not the new single row pro version.
Its good to have this info because you never can trust the bluster of the parts suppliers ...
If I were you I would just wait until a good used motor shows up online and keep your old motor to practice on it. The car has 105K miles so there are likely used ones with lower miles.
Its good to have this info because you never can trust the bluster of the parts suppliers ...
If I were you I would just wait until a good used motor shows up online and keep your old motor to practice on it. The car has 105K miles so there are likely used ones with lower miles.
Practice? Yes, practice was done in Jake's intensive 4-day engine rebuild class. This is for real, man! I have a spreadsheet that keeps track of the total (staggering) cost down to every single bolt and gasket. It costs about $18k just in parts and machine work to duplicate this engine (including ~$2k acquiring cost for the broken engine for the crank, crank carrier, engine case, and the heads). Now the RND engine looks like a smoking deal because that includes labor and warranty!
The whole point of this adventure is to rebuild an M96 properly with success. The chassis is pristine at 100k miles and it serves as a test mule for the engine.
Right and I can always just sell the chassis as is anyway since it's in such a great shape.
Last edited by Ahsai; 11-29-2016 at 01:28 PM.
11-29-2016, 02:10 PM
#771
Drifting
Thank you for the cost data
"I have a spreadsheet that keeps track of the total (staggering) cost down to every single bolt and gasket. It costs about $18k just in parts and machine work to duplicate this engine (including ~$2k acquiring cost for the broken engine for the crank, crank carrier, engine case, and the heads). Now the RND engine looks like a smoking deal because that includes labor and warranty!"
I also posted my more modest costs for a rebuild .I did not use some of the expensive upgrade parts(like JE pistons) discussed here. Regardless you still need all the tools , equipment and the skills to use them.
What may not be included in the $18k above is the cost of Jake's class+travel+accommodation. And then there is the time. Not just actual assembly time but all the hours on Forums gleaning bits of information to avoid mistakes . This is a commitment few would make if they knew up front what is involved. Now you do know. This Thread is a wonderful addition too Rennlist knowledge about this problematic engine.
The RND option is welcome !
For the rebuilders who assert: "oh, it's a breeze, just slap it together, get 'er done" let's see your rebuild photos !
I also posted my more modest costs for a rebuild .I did not use some of the expensive upgrade parts(like JE pistons) discussed here. Regardless you still need all the tools , equipment and the skills to use them.
What may not be included in the $18k above is the cost of Jake's class+travel+accommodation. And then there is the time. Not just actual assembly time but all the hours on Forums gleaning bits of information to avoid mistakes . This is a commitment few would make if they knew up front what is involved. Now you do know. This Thread is a wonderful addition too Rennlist knowledge about this problematic engine.
The RND option is welcome !
For the rebuilders who assert: "oh, it's a breeze, just slap it together, get 'er done" let's see your rebuild photos !
11-29-2016, 02:11 PM
#772
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by mjberning
So much for the LNE claim that their single row bearings have a 50k service interval. Im assuming it was not the new single row pro version.
Its good to have this info because you never can trust the bluster of the parts suppliers ...
If I were you I would just wait until a good used motor shows up online and keep your old motor to practice on it. The car has 105K miles so there are likely used ones with lower miles.
Its good to have this info because you never can trust the bluster of the parts suppliers ...
If I were you I would just wait until a good used motor shows up online and keep your old motor to practice on it. The car has 105K miles so there are likely used ones with lower miles.
11-29-2016, 02:17 PM
#774
Ahsai
That looks like a fantastic job should purr like a kitten , don't forget a few Valium before you turn the key, it's a nerve racking moment , even if your sure you done it all right , all the best !
That looks like a fantastic job should purr like a kitten , don't forget a few Valium before you turn the key, it's a nerve racking moment , even if your sure you done it all right , all the best !
11-29-2016, 04:27 PM
#776
Former Vendor
Duncan is at the top of those who've attended my classes for the past decade. Duncan has done a better, more thorough job of this task than most professional M96 assemblers I have experienced over the years. In class he was attentive, took awesome notes, and asked great questions. He didn't fall asleep one time during the presentations, but I can't say that about the attendee that sat behind him!
Engine building is 95% attentiveness, and 5% luck.
That said, like Duncan stated its easy to end up with 14-18K in parts for one of these engines at a retail price point. Duncan did discover a unique parts source near the end of his purchasing spree, and he stated that could have saved him around 1K on the parts expenditures, but he had already made his purchases.
I sell an engine a couple of levels above what Duncan has built for around 22.5K, but it does have a few twists, and about 30 more HP, and you can't get that any other way :-) (shameless plug)
Duncan has illustrated what a dedicated individual can do with today's resources. This proves just how far we've developed, and taken the M96 engine over the last decade, since only 10 years ago none of these things were available to the public.
Duncan also got the chance to review my "M96 Definitive Guide"as I saw that he was a perfect beta tester to see just how effective the book can be to an individual like him when assembling an M96 engine.
As for the Troll, well there's one on every thread, I'm just about to wage war on them, stand by and watch what happens in the next few months. You'll be entertained.
Engine building is 95% attentiveness, and 5% luck.
That said, like Duncan stated its easy to end up with 14-18K in parts for one of these engines at a retail price point. Duncan did discover a unique parts source near the end of his purchasing spree, and he stated that could have saved him around 1K on the parts expenditures, but he had already made his purchases.
I sell an engine a couple of levels above what Duncan has built for around 22.5K, but it does have a few twists, and about 30 more HP, and you can't get that any other way :-) (shameless plug)
Duncan has illustrated what a dedicated individual can do with today's resources. This proves just how far we've developed, and taken the M96 engine over the last decade, since only 10 years ago none of these things were available to the public.
Duncan also got the chance to review my "M96 Definitive Guide"as I saw that he was a perfect beta tester to see just how effective the book can be to an individual like him when assembling an M96 engine.
As for the Troll, well there's one on every thread, I'm just about to wage war on them, stand by and watch what happens in the next few months. You'll be entertained.
11-29-2016, 04:37 PM
#777
"I have a spreadsheet that keeps track of the total (staggering) cost down to every single bolt and gasket. It costs about $18k just in parts and machine work to duplicate this engine (including ~$2k acquiring cost for the broken engine for the crank, crank carrier, engine case, and the heads). Now the RND engine looks like a smoking deal because that includes labor and warranty!"
I also posted my more modest costs for a rebuild .I did not use some of the expensive upgrade parts(like JE pistons) discussed here. Regardless you still need all the tools , equipment and the skills to use them.
What may not be included in the $18k above is the cost of Jake's class+travel+accommodation. And then there is the time. Not just actual assembly time but all the hours on Forums gleaning bits of information to avoid mistakes . This is a commitment few would make if they knew up front what is involved. Now you do know. This Thread is a wonderful addition too Rennlist knowledge about this problematic engine.
The RND option is welcome !
For the rebuilders who assert: "oh, it's a breeze, just slap it together, get 'er done" let's see your rebuild photos !
I also posted my more modest costs for a rebuild .I did not use some of the expensive upgrade parts(like JE pistons) discussed here. Regardless you still need all the tools , equipment and the skills to use them.
What may not be included in the $18k above is the cost of Jake's class+travel+accommodation. And then there is the time. Not just actual assembly time but all the hours on Forums gleaning bits of information to avoid mistakes . This is a commitment few would make if they knew up front what is involved. Now you do know. This Thread is a wonderful addition too Rennlist knowledge about this problematic engine.
The RND option is welcome !
For the rebuilders who assert: "oh, it's a breeze, just slap it together, get 'er done" let's see your rebuild photos !
Thanks Pete!
11-29-2016, 04:48 PM
#778
Duncan is at the top of those who've attended my classes for the past decade. Duncan has done a better, more thorough job of this task than most professional M96 assemblers I have experienced over the years. In class he was attentive, took awesome notes, and asked great questions. He didn't fall asleep one time during the presentations, but I can't say that about the attendee that sat behind him!
Engine building is 95% attentiveness, and 5% luck.
That said, like Duncan stated its easy to end up with 14-18K in parts for one of these engines at a retail price point. Duncan did discover a unique parts source near the end of his purchasing spree, and he stated that could have saved him around 1K on the parts expenditures, but he had already made his purchases.
I sell an engine a couple of levels above what Duncan has built for around 22.5K, but it does have a few twists, and about 30 more HP, and you can't get that any other way :-) (shameless plug)
Duncan has illustrated what a dedicated individual can do with today's resources. This proves just how far we've developed, and taken the M96 engine over the last decade, since only 10 years ago none of these things were available to the public.
Duncan also got the chance to review my "M96 Definitive Guide"as I saw that he was a perfect beta tester to see just how effective the book can be to an individual like him when assembling an M96 engine.
As for the Troll, well there's one on every thread, I'm just about to wage war on them, stand by and watch what happens in the next few months. You'll be entertained.
Engine building is 95% attentiveness, and 5% luck.
That said, like Duncan stated its easy to end up with 14-18K in parts for one of these engines at a retail price point. Duncan did discover a unique parts source near the end of his purchasing spree, and he stated that could have saved him around 1K on the parts expenditures, but he had already made his purchases.
I sell an engine a couple of levels above what Duncan has built for around 22.5K, but it does have a few twists, and about 30 more HP, and you can't get that any other way :-) (shameless plug)
Duncan has illustrated what a dedicated individual can do with today's resources. This proves just how far we've developed, and taken the M96 engine over the last decade, since only 10 years ago none of these things were available to the public.
Duncan also got the chance to review my "M96 Definitive Guide"as I saw that he was a perfect beta tester to see just how effective the book can be to an individual like him when assembling an M96 engine.
As for the Troll, well there's one on every thread, I'm just about to wage war on them, stand by and watch what happens in the next few months. You'll be entertained.
Yes, you actually had asked me to wait for July when I was looking for parts but I was not patient enough. Of course then RND euro parts was formed and I've bought a few parts from them since then. They ship fast (i.e., same day you order!) and I was very impressed with their service and info on the website. They show you in real-time how many an item are in the inventory. That's perfect for people who need the parts NOW. The prices are very competitive, approaching Sunset. In fact, I just ordered from them last week (an intake valve).
I was honored to have a sneak preview of Jake's "M96 Definitive Guide" and I just hope it will be published soon! It contains all the info necessary to assemble the M96 and all the silver bullets too. The pictures are awesome that will put mine in shame!
11-29-2016, 05:13 PM
#779
Drifting
"I was honored to have a sneak preview of Jake's "M96 Definitive Guide" and I just hope it will be published soon!
This is very welcome news to someone like me who has many ,many posts mentioning this book and encouraging it's publication.I had given up waiting and did my rebuild without it.
Just imagine how many times Porsche people in future will cite to Jake's reference book. Imagine how many convoluted Threads will be quickly and positively ended by a reference to a page number in that book.
It would improve the technical level of not just Rennlist posts but remove much of the uncertainty in buying an M96-engined car .
Bravo Jake !
I proof read for Gutenburg so am happy to help you for FREE !
This is very welcome news to someone like me who has many ,many posts mentioning this book and encouraging it's publication.I had given up waiting and did my rebuild without it.
Just imagine how many times Porsche people in future will cite to Jake's reference book. Imagine how many convoluted Threads will be quickly and positively ended by a reference to a page number in that book.
It would improve the technical level of not just Rennlist posts but remove much of the uncertainty in buying an M96-engined car .
Bravo Jake !
I proof read for Gutenburg so am happy to help you for FREE !
11-30-2016, 12:23 AM
#780
I have only seen the chapters that cover everything before putting on the heads so that's really only like 30%. I hope the rest of the chapters are as ready!
Last edited by Ahsai; 11-30-2016 at 01:16 AM.