MerlinRS

How does sound and emotion compare between R and 997 RS 4.0?

Footsoldier

Thanks Mika - a good day was had by all!

That's me at 7500km and 4 trackdays now, and the car is getting better and better. Engine and box loosening up and even the exhaust noise has taken on a raspier note.

Like you say, driven properly on circuits, you don't lose out to much, and it's so agile and 'chuckable'. Much less interference from RWS and diff than you can feel in an RS.

On the right kind of road it's a lot less planted and more supple than a GT3 and performance is just the right side of useable in the right circumstances (if still potentially illegal!). Or so I imagine...

hammered it on circuit then jumped in and drove 500miles home, and still wanted to drive back roads for the last 40. Awesome car.

Jrtaylor9

I don't own an R. I've owned a 997 4.0 and the same engine in an R (991 RS). I personally think the 4.0 merger is one of the top emotion engines money can buy (not the top, but it's up there). If there's an all-time emotion-evoking engine ranking out there, it would probably mentioned in most lists. The 9A1 in the R and RS is a GREAT engine; amazing. But it's a little on the stale side compared to a 4.0 mezger, IMO. And it feels like it's missing some low-mid range grunt. I think redline is better experience on the 9a1 esp in pdk......it's violent. Every other aspect I give the nod to mez 4.0.

LaSource

Awesome driving
No point reading about what the car can do in a magazine and not try for yourself. Think too many people miss out on sampling the engineering in these fine cars.

It's a pity the red flag came out so early, think we would have pushed a little more on subsequent laps.

Mika911

Still surprising that the R was that quick around a medium speed track where you'd expect the RS to take advantage of the extra grip and PDK. Both drivers have raced successfully, so you'd expect them to be close in equal cars, probably with Footsoldier having the slight edge.

Will see if the RS driver has any footage... he did have a RaceNav, but not sure he got it to work

LaSource

Don't get me started on that! I seem to recall a number of excuses all round

Agree the 911R looked like a lot of fun at that circuit - I had a prime view and it's not often you get to see a car like that moving dynamically and responding to all kind of forces. Think it looked spot on at Folembray whereas at an F1 circuit like Silverstone it has previously seems a bit more 'strained' (though footsoldier will know better)

Footsoldier

i think that was the perfect kind of circuit, yes.

Silverstone, Spa etc are great, but the R's handling and agility is where it shines, and lots of corners mean you really get into the zone with braking, cornering, power application, and gearshifting. To be fair, the same thing applies to most road cars, unless it's something like a 675LT, 918 (or a GT2RS?) where the sheer speed makes the straights feel short and interesting as well.

The same attributes explain why it's such a good roadcar. Things like a 488 or even a Turbo S pick up speed so fast and so linearly, that you always feel under the limit to a massive extent. The R, like all the classics, feels entertaining at all speeds, and can be driven much closer to its limits than the next level up.

BGB Motorsports

Is there someone else that has driven a 911R that can chime in on how light the clutch feel is with the single mass flywheel? As you may or may not know we completed a conversion on an RS and we are all sitting here wondering why the clutch is so light and in talking to another 911R owner, both the OP and that person and us are all in agreement that it's quite possibly the lightest clutch any of us have ever felt. Yet again this forum could possibly save me from banging my head against a brick wall.

Suitcase

Lighter than my '14 C4, '16 Boxster Spyder and much lighter than 997 RS with lightweight flywheel. Think Jetta.

BGB Motorsports

Thanks! I think we have been chasing a ghost! I talked to Rodger at Orbit & he said Toyota, i say Honda and you say Jetta. The consensus is that's it's too light!

GrantG

Does it have servo assist or something?

CAlexio

It's the SMF.. it makes sense that it's very light.. lightest of any car I've driven except for my grandma's FIAT ****box I use when I'm home.

GrantG

Hmm, 997RS was not light like that with SMF...

Carlos993

A few weekends ago I drove the 993 RS, and then the 997 RS 4.0, and then the 911R, back to back. For the first few seconds in the R, I was taken aback by how light, relatively, the R clutch was compared to the other 2. Very noticeable.

Suitcase

Carlos 993 Isn't that the best? My impressions are this:

I have driven my old 3.6 964 RS back to back with a 3.8 993 RS. I found the 964 to be more more engaging, stiffer, lighter, less street car like. I also preferred the solid (synchros?) gear box in the 964. Although I also remember when it got hot one of the gear balked a little. I found the 993 RS to be "soft."

I have driven the 964 RS next to my delete delete 997.2 3.8 RS. The 964 was light. But I never felt I would trade the 997.2 for the 964. The 997.2 was just so good I every time I parked the car I'd turn back at it and ask my how could they make a car "that good." I use all my cars. Was the answer the the 997.2 was so good because of the delete delete (no A/C/ no radio, no expense spared to make the car as light as possible) order?

I can tell you that on a warm Colorado evening in August I used the 997.2 to go on a date. It began to rain. The cabin fogged up. Windows down and wet, windows up, fan on, windows cracked. It didn't matter. Uncomfortable and Nantucket like fog inside the car. I read a similar experience last year from a British journalist driving a delete delete 911 R from GB back to Stuttgart after their road test. It seems that the delete, delete car over time may retain it's value better than a normally equipped car. And it also depends on where you live. But unless you're putting the car in a personal museum the A/C makes sense in most cases. The cars should be used and driven. AP once said to me that driving a car three times around an industrial park is not driving the car.

The 964 and the 997.2 are gone now. My 911 R has A/C, Bose and LWFW. It is very comfortable to drive. Even the Bose seems better in the R that my other cars. I'd prefer a slightly heavier clutch. Unfortunately I have only driven the car in south Florida. The roads are flat and straight; no place to judge a 911 R. But one day I did get in a 20k 997.2 3.8 RS right after driving my R. This one had air and radio. And although it didn't feel quite as tight as I remember my ex 997.2 I still loved the more race car feel of the 3.8. I suspected it was almost as fast as the R.

When I drove a Porsche owned R around the hills surrounding Weissach last year I felt the R was the best 911 ever. But who knows what I was driving? Maybe it weighed 2500 lbs.? Maybe it had 600hp? Probably not. So I still feel for me the jury is out on the R. I need to use it in a more suitable place. The one thing I will say is that I feel it's a great long distance GT car. I wish that the GT2 type folding CF seat was available in the U.S. so I could easily through more stuff behind the seat for a long road trip.

One more thing. I asked AP if my 997.2 RS was so good because of the delete delete order. He said absolutely not. He was familiar with my exact car. He told me that the modern cars essentially have radiant heat running through them. Where the ambient outside temperature v. cabin temp of an air cooled car was close, there is a "10 degree" (F v. C?, I didn't ask) difference in the liquid cooled cars. He also said that the feel of the added weight is almost undetectable. I ordered the A/C in the R.

So Carlos 993 please let us know what your thoughts were regarding the cars? I have never driven the 997 4.0.