Orthojoe's track build journal
09-21-2015, 02:33 AM
#1321
New update:
1) I'm done with TrofeoR. Did a double duty track day yesterday with Ben and the tires gave out after the first session. There is still tread left on the tires, but the rear doesn't grip worth a darn anymore. It looks like once you hit the wear bars, you can say goodbye to grip and you end up with oversteer because the front are still gripping fine. Checked tire temps and they were even all of the way around: front, rear, middle, inner, outer all about 155F. I really miss running NT01 tires. Good all of the way to the end. I drove my buddy's Cayman GTS on NT01 for a few laps and had way more fun in his car than the GT3. New N spec MSPC2 are back on the car as of today. I haven't been on N spec MSPC2 since February. I hope the magic returns with those tires. My buddy wore out his dunlop sport maxx race OEM tires on his GT3 and ran Trofeo R for the first time yesterday too. He was underwhelmed as well. I'm never running Trofeo R again. Too fussy with tire temps and pressures. This is what the tires look like after 500 track miles/5 track days.
Fronts look fine and grip fine:
The rears still have some tread but are down to the wear bar
1) I'm done with TrofeoR. Did a double duty track day yesterday with Ben and the tires gave out after the first session. There is still tread left on the tires, but the rear doesn't grip worth a darn anymore. It looks like once you hit the wear bars, you can say goodbye to grip and you end up with oversteer because the front are still gripping fine. Checked tire temps and they were even all of the way around: front, rear, middle, inner, outer all about 155F. I really miss running NT01 tires. Good all of the way to the end. I drove my buddy's Cayman GTS on NT01 for a few laps and had way more fun in his car than the GT3. New N spec MSPC2 are back on the car as of today. I haven't been on N spec MSPC2 since February. I hope the magic returns with those tires. My buddy wore out his dunlop sport maxx race OEM tires on his GT3 and ran Trofeo R for the first time yesterday too. He was underwhelmed as well. I'm never running Trofeo R again. Too fussy with tire temps and pressures. This is what the tires look like after 500 track miles/5 track days.
Fronts look fine and grip fine:
The rears still have some tread but are down to the wear bar
09-21-2015, 02:45 AM
#1322
Hey Joe, when the MPSC2 heat-cycle out after 5 or 6 days, is it catastrophic like the TrofeoR too, or just lower peak G's but still controllable driving / fun at the track?
09-21-2015, 10:28 AM
#1323
Rennlist Member
Joe what lift do you have? It looks like a great setup with two bridge jacks as well to get all four up at once?
09-21-2015, 11:17 AM
#1325
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
Thanks, Sam!
09-21-2015, 11:31 AM
#1326
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good discussion but one thing I don't read in here is how do you guys know how to change your set up from the MPSC2 to the Trofeo R? How do you know what changes to make? Tire construction may be different but I'd have a hard time figuring out how to change set up betyween two different brands of tires.
09-21-2015, 11:40 AM
#1327
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
good discussion but one thing I don't read in here is how do you guys know how to change your set up from the MPSC2 to the Trofeo R? How do you know what changes to make? Tire construction may be different but I'd have a hard time figuring out how to change set up betyween two different brands of tires.
09-21-2015, 12:23 PM
#1329
Hello Joe, I have run Tro R's on stock alignment. I liked them better than MPSC2, they feel more like a slick. when the MPSC2 gave up, the fronts went completely while rears were still good. Difference in alignment? I had L Keen drive the car at Atlanta MotorSports Park, he said just leave it as is. Granted its not Road Atlanta, but he was within a few tenths as fast a time in the 3 than his one-lap-of-America winning GTR. Feedback was the car is supper comfortable to push hard. The tires at that time were MPSC2 with 3 track days. They did give up after his stint.
09-21-2015, 12:27 PM
#1330
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Hello Joe, I have run Tro R's on stock alignment. I liked them better than MPSC2, they feel more like a slick. when the MPSC2 gave up, the fronts went completely while rears were still good. Difference in alignment? I had L Keen drive the car at Atlanta MotorSports Park, he said just leave it as is. Granted its not Road Atlanta, but he was within a few tenths as fast a time in the 3 than his one-lap-of-America winning GTR. Feedback was the car is supper comfortable to push hard. The tires at that time were MPSC2 with 3 track days. They did give up after his stint.
09-21-2015, 12:28 PM
#1331
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
Orthojoe's track build journal
Originally Posted by 452gt3
What rear toe setting are you using and are you setting it with the key on?
Originally Posted by hughp3
Hello Joe, I have run Tro R's on stock alignment. I liked them better than MPSC2, they feel more like a slick. when the MPSC2 gave up, the fronts went completely while rears were still good. Difference in alignment? I had L Keen drive the car at Atlanta MotorSports Park, he said just leave it as is. Granted its not Road Atlanta, but he was within a few tenths as fast a time in the 3 than his one-lap-of-America winning GTR. Feedback was the car is supper comfortable to push hard. The tires at that time were MPSC2 with 3 track days. They did give up after his stint.
09-21-2015, 02:03 PM
#1332
The 2 different setups I've run with these tires have been -2.9F/-3.0R and -2.7F/-2.4R. Tire temps with the latest setup have been fine. I'd be curious to see what you recommend, but suggesting 5 extra seconds from only an alignment is crazy talk. Even if it was true, I'm not interested in a tire that is that fussy.
ps: I did a lap time at Nurburgring 10 seconds faster then a factory driver (I believe it was Walter Röhrl) with bone stock 997GT3 mk2 only with race alignment and TrofeoR tires. With factory settings on Cup2s I was 6 seconds slower then Walter. If it comes to Porsche setup I know what I'm talking about.
09-21-2015, 02:36 PM
#1333
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
Orthojoe's track build journal
Originally Posted by krisa9977
It is not crazy talk it is the fact that I know for sure. Obviously you need a proper driver to get those 5 seconds off.
ps: I did a lap time at Nurburgring 10 seconds faster then a factory driver (I believe it was Walter Röhrl) with bone stock 997GT3 mk2 only with race alignment and TrofeoR tires. With factory settings on Cup2s I was 6 seconds slower then Walter. If it comes to Porsche setup I know what I'm talking about.
ps: I did a lap time at Nurburgring 10 seconds faster then a factory driver (I believe it was Walter Röhrl) with bone stock 997GT3 mk2 only with race alignment and TrofeoR tires. With factory settings on Cup2s I was 6 seconds slower then Walter. If it comes to Porsche setup I know what I'm talking about.
09-21-2015, 03:04 PM
#1334
Also your camber depends on your right height. Lower your car, you need more negative camber.
09-21-2015, 03:12 PM
#1335
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
Orthojoe's track build journal
Originally Posted by krisa9977
I did not drive Trofeos on 991GT3, I only drove them on 997GT3, but the starting point for Trofeo R is the same as for Cup2s. Because of active rear steering on 991GT3, you need about -0.7 more negative camber for the rear then if you drove 997GT3. I tried to turn off rear active steering and rear end felt like you put slicks in rear.
Also your camber depends on your right height. Lower your car, you need more negative camber.
Also your camber depends on your right height. Lower your car, you need more negative camber.