Where are all the Alonso detractors
10-28-2007, 09:25 PM
#766
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10-28-2007, 11:41 PM
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Their technical explanations were often plain wrong. Eg: on hungary: "The drivers wait until the end of the session because there is more rubber on the track and it allows the mechanics to fine tune the car"... wtf, the rubber is pretty much set by 2 practice sessions and 2 qualy sessions, and there are virtually no more adjustment to the car, they did no mention that the reason they wait till the end is because they burn freaking fuel! (coincidently, they are called gas burning laps!). "There was no reason for Alonso to block, the team plan everything to the second, they both would have had time to complete their last lap"... no comments 
. Same for other races, including the explanation of his tranny failure in brasil, lol. "the vibrations (with comment-guy jumping up and down mimicking vibrations) in Hamilton's track-off against Alonso made a valve/sensor jump a gear (or something) so the tranny could not read the gears anymore and had to be re-initiated"... off course, makes perfect sense the tranny was fine for 2-3 laps after his off .
Full of opinion nonesense and speculations on EVERY single race, blatantly biased. Eg: Shower of praises for Hamilton in Japan, NOT a single shot of the accident he caused. Basically not even mentioned.
etc...
They are not unpleasant to listen to. If it's the only channel you can see, then it's better than nothing, but it's not good. Shallow technically and overly biased.
. Same for other races, including the explanation of his tranny failure in brasil, lol. "the vibrations (with comment-guy jumping up and down mimicking vibrations) in Hamilton's track-off against Alonso made a valve/sensor jump a gear (or something) so the tranny could not read the gears anymore and had to be re-initiated"... off course, makes perfect sense the tranny was fine for 2-3 laps after his off . Full of opinion nonesense and speculations on EVERY single race, blatantly biased. Eg: Shower of praises for Hamilton in Japan, NOT a single shot of the accident he caused. Basically not even mentioned.
etc...
They are not unpleasant to listen to. If it's the only channel you can see, then it's better than nothing, but it's not good. Shallow technically and overly biased.
Last edited by Nano; 10-29-2007 at 12:56 AM.
Yep 
10-29-2007, 01:09 AM
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Wow, praises for Alonso (and some back paddling) 
I bet he stays
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/spo...cle2759331.ece
Five reasons why Fernando Alonso and McLaren need to make up, and fast
Edward Gorman, Motor Racing Correspondent
"For some weeks, the majority view in the Formula One paddock has been that Fernando Alonso could not stay for another season with McLaren. Even among hardheaded judges - people who have grown used to indulgent behaviour by prima donna drivers - the feeling is that the Spanish former world champion has stepped beyond the point at which reconciliation is possible.
But is it not in McLaren’s clear interests that, despite Alonso’s conduct, they should keep hold of him? After all, in the amoral world of Formula One, it does not matter what you do in your spare time or even at work, so long as you can win grands prix and at least be in contention to deliver championships. As one insider put it: “In this business, people are very pragmatic.”
Contract
Alonso, after his turbulent first year at the team, is contracted to McLaren for two more years on an annual salary believed to be in the region of £14 million. The team has planned its campaign with him at the heart of it, winning races and titles, and it has attracted sponsors as part of the Alonso package. Backing out of that now will be disruptive and expensive and was certainly not envisaged as an option when the season began. What is more Alonso is an asset to the team which cannot be cheaply traded and reaching a financial settlement with another team for his services will be difficult.
Driver swaps
If Alonso were to leave, the team would lose a formidable competitor to a rival and would get a driver in his place of less ability and experience. Thus, even with the history of bad blood, the team is better off with Alonso inside it than outside it.
The Spaniard may have brought unhappiness, he may have threatened Ron Dennis, the team principal, he may have claimed his own mechanics were nobbling his car, but he is a double world champion with an excellent record on the track and a level of experience that makes him arguably the most complete driver in the sport.
The present thinking envisages Alonso rejoining Renault, his former team, and McLaren doing a straight swap of Alonso for Heikki Kovalainen. Another theory is that Alonso’s place at McLaren might be taken by Nico Rosberg, should a way be found to release him from his contract at Williams. In both cases, McLaren would be getting a talented driver who is less experienced than Alonso and probably less good. With Lewis Hamilton in the other seat, this hardly makes sense.
With Alonso at Renault, the French team, which has struggled this season, will be more potent and could pose a championship threat alongside Ferrari, giving McLaren two teams to battle against rather than one.
Bad blood - does it matter?
Some would argue that whether or not people are getting on with each other is irrelevant in a racing team.
The main thing is results, so long, that is, that the tension does not spill over into hot-headedness on the track. Proponents of this theory point out that, bad as the relationship between Alonso and Hamilton has been, it is nothing like the visceral hatred that developed between two of their predecessors at McLaren, Alain Prost and Ayrton Senna.
Reconciliation
Perhaps the crux of the matter is whether or not reconciliation between Alonso and McLaren is possible. Among those with whom he would have to mend fences would be his own mechanics and race engineers, Hamilton, his teammate, and Dennis and other senior managers. Dennis himself is good at reconciliation but how likely is it that even a thoroughgoing “love-in” behind closed doors at Woking could repair the damage done this season? Hamilton has already said he would prefer it if Alonso leaves and even Dennis has made it clear there is a long way to go to rebuild a sense of trust in the team.
Mutual interest
If there are strong arguments in favour of McLaren keeping Alonso, there are equally strong reasons why the Spaniard himself may want to stay. After all, the door to Ferrari looks shut for at least a year with Kimi Raikkonen and Felipe Massa signed up at Maranello, and none of the alternatives looks appealing. Renault may be uncompetitive again, Toyota have lots of money to offer but no racing record to speak of and BMW Sauber is booked up with Robert Kubica and Nick Heidfeld. McLaren may not produce a competitive car for 2008, but they are surely a better bet for Alonso than anyone else."
I bet he stays
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/spo...cle2759331.ece
Five reasons why Fernando Alonso and McLaren need to make up, and fast
Edward Gorman, Motor Racing Correspondent
"For some weeks, the majority view in the Formula One paddock has been that Fernando Alonso could not stay for another season with McLaren. Even among hardheaded judges - people who have grown used to indulgent behaviour by prima donna drivers - the feeling is that the Spanish former world champion has stepped beyond the point at which reconciliation is possible.
But is it not in McLaren’s clear interests that, despite Alonso’s conduct, they should keep hold of him? After all, in the amoral world of Formula One, it does not matter what you do in your spare time or even at work, so long as you can win grands prix and at least be in contention to deliver championships. As one insider put it: “In this business, people are very pragmatic.”
Contract
Alonso, after his turbulent first year at the team, is contracted to McLaren for two more years on an annual salary believed to be in the region of £14 million. The team has planned its campaign with him at the heart of it, winning races and titles, and it has attracted sponsors as part of the Alonso package. Backing out of that now will be disruptive and expensive and was certainly not envisaged as an option when the season began. What is more Alonso is an asset to the team which cannot be cheaply traded and reaching a financial settlement with another team for his services will be difficult.
Driver swaps
If Alonso were to leave, the team would lose a formidable competitor to a rival and would get a driver in his place of less ability and experience. Thus, even with the history of bad blood, the team is better off with Alonso inside it than outside it.
The Spaniard may have brought unhappiness, he may have threatened Ron Dennis, the team principal, he may have claimed his own mechanics were nobbling his car, but he is a double world champion with an excellent record on the track and a level of experience that makes him arguably the most complete driver in the sport.
The present thinking envisages Alonso rejoining Renault, his former team, and McLaren doing a straight swap of Alonso for Heikki Kovalainen. Another theory is that Alonso’s place at McLaren might be taken by Nico Rosberg, should a way be found to release him from his contract at Williams. In both cases, McLaren would be getting a talented driver who is less experienced than Alonso and probably less good. With Lewis Hamilton in the other seat, this hardly makes sense.
With Alonso at Renault, the French team, which has struggled this season, will be more potent and could pose a championship threat alongside Ferrari, giving McLaren two teams to battle against rather than one.
Bad blood - does it matter?
Some would argue that whether or not people are getting on with each other is irrelevant in a racing team.
The main thing is results, so long, that is, that the tension does not spill over into hot-headedness on the track. Proponents of this theory point out that, bad as the relationship between Alonso and Hamilton has been, it is nothing like the visceral hatred that developed between two of their predecessors at McLaren, Alain Prost and Ayrton Senna.
Reconciliation
Perhaps the crux of the matter is whether or not reconciliation between Alonso and McLaren is possible. Among those with whom he would have to mend fences would be his own mechanics and race engineers, Hamilton, his teammate, and Dennis and other senior managers. Dennis himself is good at reconciliation but how likely is it that even a thoroughgoing “love-in” behind closed doors at Woking could repair the damage done this season? Hamilton has already said he would prefer it if Alonso leaves and even Dennis has made it clear there is a long way to go to rebuild a sense of trust in the team.
Mutual interest
If there are strong arguments in favour of McLaren keeping Alonso, there are equally strong reasons why the Spaniard himself may want to stay. After all, the door to Ferrari looks shut for at least a year with Kimi Raikkonen and Felipe Massa signed up at Maranello, and none of the alternatives looks appealing. Renault may be uncompetitive again, Toyota have lots of money to offer but no racing record to speak of and BMW Sauber is booked up with Robert Kubica and Nick Heidfeld. McLaren may not produce a competitive car for 2008, but they are surely a better bet for Alonso than anyone else."
10-29-2007, 03:00 AM
#770
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It is pretty obvious the author has been reading my post here on rennlist , I was waiting for him to mention the 2 gourds, M3pete and pole position, it would have completed my copyright case against him ...
10-29-2007, 05:25 PM
#773
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10-31-2007, 11:12 AM
#775
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Alonso won't be forced into move
www.itv.com
Wednesday, 31, October, 2007, 13:12
Fernando Alonso’s manager insists the two-time world champion will not be forced out of McLaren in a swap deal against his wishes.
The Spaniard is thought unlikely to remain with the Woking squad into the second year of his contract after a season in which his relationship with team boss Ron Dennis has broken down.
With the 26-year-old’s McLaren future looking bleak, speculation grew towards the end of the season about his likely destination for 2008 – with a return to Renault, in a possible job swap with Heikki Kovalainen, given most credence.
Further rumours have linked Alonso to joining a team on a one-year deal to allow him to join Ferrari in 2009, although both the Scuderia’s driver’s are now signed up on deals that cover that season.
A swap deal involving Williams’ Nico Rosberg has been one such move suggested, but Alonso’s manager Luis García has dismissed these rumours and is adamant his driver won’t be going anywhere without agreeing to it.
"If that's what people are saying then they know more than me,” he was quoted as saying by the Guardian newspaper.
“We have a contract next year with McLaren and that's it.
“Can they sell it? Without our approval, no they cannot."
The deposed world champion’s future is set to become clearer in the coming weeks, after Dennis said McLaren would turn its attention to driver issues in the fortnight after the Brazilian finale.
However the uncertainty looks set to continue for a little longer yet as Garcia says he has no meetings with the British team planned yet.
"Nothing is urgent,” he said.
“We are trying to rest a little.
“I have no special meetings with McLaren scheduled."
Wednesday, 31, October, 2007, 13:12
Fernando Alonso’s manager insists the two-time world champion will not be forced out of McLaren in a swap deal against his wishes.
The Spaniard is thought unlikely to remain with the Woking squad into the second year of his contract after a season in which his relationship with team boss Ron Dennis has broken down.
With the 26-year-old’s McLaren future looking bleak, speculation grew towards the end of the season about his likely destination for 2008 – with a return to Renault, in a possible job swap with Heikki Kovalainen, given most credence.
Further rumours have linked Alonso to joining a team on a one-year deal to allow him to join Ferrari in 2009, although both the Scuderia’s driver’s are now signed up on deals that cover that season.
A swap deal involving Williams’ Nico Rosberg has been one such move suggested, but Alonso’s manager Luis García has dismissed these rumours and is adamant his driver won’t be going anywhere without agreeing to it.
"If that's what people are saying then they know more than me,” he was quoted as saying by the Guardian newspaper.
“We have a contract next year with McLaren and that's it.
“Can they sell it? Without our approval, no they cannot."
The deposed world champion’s future is set to become clearer in the coming weeks, after Dennis said McLaren would turn its attention to driver issues in the fortnight after the Brazilian finale.
However the uncertainty looks set to continue for a little longer yet as Garcia says he has no meetings with the British team planned yet.
"Nothing is urgent,” he said.
“We are trying to rest a little.
“I have no special meetings with McLaren scheduled."
10-31-2007, 11:13 AM
#776
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Lewis on his relationship with Fernanado
www.f1-live.com
The breakdown of the relationship between McLaren's drivers in 2007 was a gradual process, Lewis Hamilton reveals in his upcoming biography, My Story.
In an extract published by The Sun newspaper, the 22-year-old rookie said Fernando Alonso introduced himself to Hamilton and his father in a hotel in Turkey late last year.
"He came by and said: 'Hello, I'm Fernando'," Hamilton, then a GP2 driver, said.
"He was the world champion, he was fighting to win the title for a second time. It really surprised me he had the time to say hello. I was quite impressed with that."
But the Briton speculates that Alonso, months later, took exception to being pushed so hard at McLaren by a rookie.
"I like and admire Fernando, so I was sad and disappointed that, for whatever reason, our relationship did not improve," he added. "But it was not for lack of trying."
Hamilton said Alonso also failed to 'build any bond' with his colleagues, beginning with failing to turn up for a pre-season team training week.
"I thought Fernando would be the one trying to set me an example and show me what to do, not the other way around," he continued.
He said team boss Ron Dennis encouraged Hamilton to try 'extra hard' to make the Spaniard feel welcome.
Cliquez ici...
"Fernando is very quiet," Hamilton said, revealing that he tried building their relationship by playing computer games in Alonso's motor home room.
But by the US Grand Prix in June, Alonso had started to voice his suspicion that Dennis was favouring Hamilton.
And Hamilton added: "After the French Grand Prix someone told me Fernando, who finished seventh, said he was happy the Ferraris had beaten me so I did not take maximum points."
Their relationship then fully imploded in Hungary, when Hamilton refused a team instruction and Alonso famously got revenge by holding up his team-mate in a qualifying pit stop.
"It was like my worst nightmare," Hamilton said, insisting that he 'did not want to fall out with Fernando' as Alonso stopped talking to him.
"I think I am easy to get on with," he argued. "I do not hold grudges but I felt that if he did not want to speak or to have a decent working relationship, that was up to him."
In Turkey they met for peace talks, but Hamilton says he eventually tired of feeling like his efforts to improve their relationship were not being matched by Alonso.
"In the end, I told Ron: 'I tried to speak to him, but I am not going to go out of my way and defocus myself to make him happy. I'm going to focus on my dream'."
"Then, at Spa-Francorchamps, Fernando ran me wide and off the circuit. From then on it was clear anything could happen. If he wanted to be as aggressive, so could I," Hamilton said.
He added: "It was not healthy, but I felt I could be strong and aggressive without taking any unnecessary risks. It was a real pity that things had come to this."
The breakdown of the relationship between McLaren's drivers in 2007 was a gradual process, Lewis Hamilton reveals in his upcoming biography, My Story.
In an extract published by The Sun newspaper, the 22-year-old rookie said Fernando Alonso introduced himself to Hamilton and his father in a hotel in Turkey late last year.
"He came by and said: 'Hello, I'm Fernando'," Hamilton, then a GP2 driver, said.
"He was the world champion, he was fighting to win the title for a second time. It really surprised me he had the time to say hello. I was quite impressed with that."
But the Briton speculates that Alonso, months later, took exception to being pushed so hard at McLaren by a rookie.
"I like and admire Fernando, so I was sad and disappointed that, for whatever reason, our relationship did not improve," he added. "But it was not for lack of trying."
Hamilton said Alonso also failed to 'build any bond' with his colleagues, beginning with failing to turn up for a pre-season team training week.
"I thought Fernando would be the one trying to set me an example and show me what to do, not the other way around," he continued.
He said team boss Ron Dennis encouraged Hamilton to try 'extra hard' to make the Spaniard feel welcome.
Cliquez ici...
"Fernando is very quiet," Hamilton said, revealing that he tried building their relationship by playing computer games in Alonso's motor home room.
But by the US Grand Prix in June, Alonso had started to voice his suspicion that Dennis was favouring Hamilton.
And Hamilton added: "After the French Grand Prix someone told me Fernando, who finished seventh, said he was happy the Ferraris had beaten me so I did not take maximum points."
Their relationship then fully imploded in Hungary, when Hamilton refused a team instruction and Alonso famously got revenge by holding up his team-mate in a qualifying pit stop.
"It was like my worst nightmare," Hamilton said, insisting that he 'did not want to fall out with Fernando' as Alonso stopped talking to him.
"I think I am easy to get on with," he argued. "I do not hold grudges but I felt that if he did not want to speak or to have a decent working relationship, that was up to him."
In Turkey they met for peace talks, but Hamilton says he eventually tired of feeling like his efforts to improve their relationship were not being matched by Alonso.
"In the end, I told Ron: 'I tried to speak to him, but I am not going to go out of my way and defocus myself to make him happy. I'm going to focus on my dream'."
"Then, at Spa-Francorchamps, Fernando ran me wide and off the circuit. From then on it was clear anything could happen. If he wanted to be as aggressive, so could I," Hamilton said.
He added: "It was not healthy, but I felt I could be strong and aggressive without taking any unnecessary risks. It was a real pity that things had come to this."
10-31-2007, 01:25 PM
#777
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The information in the article is the biggest piece of crap I've read. The only thing that makes sense is that Alonso going to another team this year will not net him a WC.
As a fan of Ferrari, I would love for the status quo to remain at McLaren because if you thought you saw fireworks this year, wait until 2008, but think about it. Alonso is not going to be the #1 driver at McLaren. No self respecting double WC is going to play 2nd fiddle to a 2nd year driver.
Second, Alonso is not a threat to challenge McLaren unless he goes to Ferrari and that's not going to happen at least for the next 2 years. Alonso and Renault/Williams/Toyota would be mid-pack runners at best.
Third, from what I saw this year, if you put Nico Rosberg in the McLaren and if it performs as it did in 2007, Hamilton will have his hands full fighting off Rosberg from the WC, let alone Ferrari.
Finally, too much bad blood between all parties -- Alonso, Dennis, Hamilton, etc.
10-31-2007, 01:30 PM
#778
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And it's clear that you and the author are as sensible as Britney Spears at a Las Vegas strip club.
The information in the article is the biggest piece of crap I've read. The only thing that makes sense is that Alonso going to another team this year will not net him a WC.
As a fan of Ferrari, I would love for the status quo to remain at McLaren because if you thought you saw fireworks this year, wait until 2008, but think about it. Alonso is not going to be the #1 driver at McLaren. No self respecting double WC is going to play 2nd fiddle to a 2nd year driver.
Second, Alonso is not a threat to challenge McLaren unless he goes to Ferrari and that's not going to happen at least for the next 2 years. Alonso and Renault/Williams/Toyota would be mid-pack runners at best.
Third, from what I saw this year, if you put Nico Rosberg in the McLaren and if it performs as it did in 2007, Hamilton will have his hands full fighting off Rosberg from the WC, let alone Ferrari.
Finally, too much bad blood between all parties -- Alonso, Dennis, Hamilton, etc.
The information in the article is the biggest piece of crap I've read. The only thing that makes sense is that Alonso going to another team this year will not net him a WC.
As a fan of Ferrari, I would love for the status quo to remain at McLaren because if you thought you saw fireworks this year, wait until 2008, but think about it. Alonso is not going to be the #1 driver at McLaren. No self respecting double WC is going to play 2nd fiddle to a 2nd year driver.
Second, Alonso is not a threat to challenge McLaren unless he goes to Ferrari and that's not going to happen at least for the next 2 years. Alonso and Renault/Williams/Toyota would be mid-pack runners at best.
Third, from what I saw this year, if you put Nico Rosberg in the McLaren and if it performs as it did in 2007, Hamilton will have his hands full fighting off Rosberg from the WC, let alone Ferrari.
Finally, too much bad blood between all parties -- Alonso, Dennis, Hamilton, etc.
A pity your ISP still works ......
10-31-2007, 01:49 PM
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Deny my logic doesn't make sense. How can Alonso possibly stay at McLaren?
BTW, not landbased, I'm mobile, baby!!
BTW, not landbased, I'm mobile, baby!!
11-01-2007, 03:51 AM
#780
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Alonso can turn a steering wheel and some, no question .
However, he will not get number one at Mac unless he is miles ahead of his teammate, highly unlikely judging from this year and he totally alienated himself from the team. Unless the 08 is so superior then anything else he has a tough road ahead of him because at best, his team relations will improve from ice cold to just cold. I think even he realized now that he cornered himself with his antics thru the 07 season.
He likes to jump into the best cars (no surprise, most would do the same )but the Mac/F car are the only game in town currently and he is F'ed if he leaves or if he gets sacked. Toyota or Honda are $$$$ rewarding but career suicide at this point and we all now by now that Alonso ain't no team builder. Renault or Willaims are midfield at best and I would be surprised if BMW is looking for a emotional primadonna.
The good thing of course is that we don't have to listen to his endless whining if he competes in a tail end or midfield car because he is no longer news worthy, like good ol' JV.
However, he will not get number one at Mac unless he is miles ahead of his teammate, highly unlikely judging from this year and he totally alienated himself from the team. Unless the 08 is so superior then anything else he has a tough road ahead of him because at best, his team relations will improve from ice cold to just cold. I think even he realized now that he cornered himself with his antics thru the 07 season.
He likes to jump into the best cars (no surprise, most would do the same )but the Mac/F car are the only game in town currently and he is F'ed if he leaves or if he gets sacked. Toyota or Honda are $$$$ rewarding but career suicide at this point and we all now by now that Alonso ain't no team builder. Renault or Willaims are midfield at best and I would be surprised if BMW is looking for a emotional primadonna.
The good thing of course is that we don't have to listen to his endless whining if he competes in a tail end or midfield car because he is no longer news worthy, like good ol' JV.