tradervic

Can't wait...

mooty

always arguing.
buy something
go drive it
peace

arena-RTR

That's what my guess is: Power kit 3.8 liter, 420 hp, pdk, more aero... outrageous price tag. I'm guessing $120k+

2slow2speed

$120K for the car with the specs that you described would be interesting given that many features that don't come standard on a GT4 would probably be available by default on a RS model. (Bucket seats, full leather/alcantara, carbon trim etc, deviated belts, etc)

BTW: I'm not sure if the definition of PDK-S implies an e-diff like the one on the 991GT3.

I would buy a car like the one that you described for 120K without having second thoughts, that been said current GT4's going for 10-25K over MSRP on the other hand makes zero practical sense, most of those cars probably won't even see the track.

jphughan

To my knowledge, in all of Porsche's cars that are available with an LSD of any kind, a manual transmission car always gets a mechanical diff and a PDK car always gets a (superior) electronic diff because the latter is driven by the PDK pump. That's why the LSD option is called PTV on MT cars and PTV+ on PDK cars (the software to brake the inside rear wheel on turn-in is included on both options). PDK-S as far as I know refers only to the beefier hardware for the GT3 and the different ratio setup that changes 7th to a top speed gear rather than a fuel economy gear.

As for the track comment, AP says that 80% of GT cars see at least some track time -- why would you figure the GT4 would be any different?

2slow2speed

FYI, on P-cars a diff on the PDK cars does not automatically imply an e-diff, for example the diff on the Cayman R with PDK is mechanical and not actually variable like a true e-diff like the one on the 991GT3/GT3RS.

I'm not sure how long you have been around the P-car scene, there are plenty of GT car owners who never track their cars, a regular GT4 without a markup is probably going to be a lot more likely to be tracked than someone who is dropping an additional 10K-25K on a GT4, that is how many track days, track wheels, track tires, brake pad sets?

FORENN

If the GT4RS comes PDK only, you can expect GT4 prices to continue to stay high. I'm excited or the RS, but if doesn't come with a proper 6MT, I'll most happily just keep my GT4. I can't imagine I'm alone.

jphughan

I agree completely, but Porsche doesn't need to heed my opinion since $120K would put it beyond the car budget I'm allowing myself. Even my barely under $100K GT4 build is pushing what I'm willing to allow myself to spend, but I'm going to because this car is just that special for me. But frankly I've got other priorities in life too and a finite amount of dollars available to support them, and the GT4 is plenty of car for me anyway, especially given that I will be DDing it at least for a while.

mooty

i didn't care for 991GT3, i drove one for 40 min, bought one.
i drove an RS. believe me you will want both gT4 and RS. it's not a car, but an item most ppl simple cannot comprehend yet, i certainly do not. i just want it. it's THAT good.

i dont have a bunch of H pattern RS in warehouse, i haven't' driven them much after i tried the PDKS thing..... and thats just for street use.

for track, i would never again drive H pattern, so someone pls buy my H pattern cayman race car show on avatar.

usctrojanGT3

I tried but Porsche doesn't want my money...

usctrojanGT3

Given that the 991.2 GT3 is going to 500hp with a base of $140ish+, they can bump the GT4 up to 420-425hp with more aero and PDK for $120s no problem. It will only make this Porsche sickness of mine worse.

jphughan

Sorry, should have clarified that my PDK and e-diff relationship pertained to the 991 and 981.

I'm about to be a first-time Porsche owner, but I've lurked around Rennlist for a while and (granting that Rennlist is very likely a biased sample) what I've read is consistent with the statistic that 80% of GT cars see some track time. To me, paying a markup would be even MORE reason to go track the car and get your money's worth by experiencing the car in the setting for which it was designed. If you look at markup dollars as so many fewer sets of pads and tires, you're doing it wrong IMHO. Either reduce some other item on your budget to cover the markup, or conclude that it's better to be able to enjoy the hobby (track time) than to have a particular car that was so expensive to obtain that you can no longer afford to use it as intended.

But yes, I still recognize that there will be GT4 owners who will only ever use their cars on the street and maybe even relegate them to garage queen duty. That makes me sad that such great cars are going practically or completely unused, especially given the likely population of prospective owners who want and can afford a GT4 and would track it but simply can't get their hands on one, but that's the world for you I guess.

2slow2speed

Sigh, we are getting Off Topic.

Ooops correction, confused myself as well, 981 range is fully mechanical diff regardless of PDK vs manual, remember that since the 981 tranny is the same as the one on the 987, and the PDK LSD for the 987 also works for the 981 cars.

Here is the excerpt from the 981 configurator when PTV is selected:

Here is the except from the 991GTS configurator:

Here is the excerpt for PTV for the 991 GT3

A true e-diff like the one that is used on a F458, the newer C7 vettes, and the 991GT3/GT3RS uses an external pump to dynamically control the amount of lockup that a differential provides.



In regards to a GT4 been used for the track, true track rats would easily spend 10K on wheels/tires/real floating hat rotors/pads/harness bar/harnesses, etc, etc.

I'm like mooty I spec the minimum on my cars, and mod them to abandon if necessary. Since I don't need useless crap for cars that I take to the track.

I also consider cars that I take to the track track fodder, mentally prepared to walk away from them without blinking an eye because stuff happens all the time at track events that are outside of your control. I take great care of the cars in regards to preventive care since I want the cars to last a long time with reduced risk of various modes of failure.

FYI: Dealers hate vehicles that have seen track time since they can't be traded in and be sold as CPO vehicles due to the inherent unknown liabilities, they also hate configurations that are tailored for trackwork like having bucket seats. Many of them would rather sell a GT car to someone who won't track the car, since there are so many upsides for them by doing so.

A vehicle that has seen track time will depreciate immediately, even a P-car, that 10K markup is gone the minute that you take a car to the track. If you have been lurking around rennlist as you claim, then you should know that from the 996GT3 days a GT car that has seen tracktime is valued at a lower price than a car that has never seen the track.

2slow2speed

+1

jphughan

You're right about the 981, but here's Porsche's own page about PTV+ on the 991S (also mentions the base 991) that clearly says that cars equipped with PTV get PTV+ if PDK is also equipped and that PTV+ includes an e-diff: http://www.porsche.com/usa/models/91...plus-ptv-plus/

I don't pay particular attention to sale prices of cars until I'm interested in buying one, so I don't presume to know the sale price factors of 6GT3s, but I never claimed otherwise with regard to the depreciation impact of track time -- but if you let depreciation dictate what you do with your car, then why bother owning the car at all?