Definitive 991 GT3 Thread
12-10-2012, 03:44 PM
#166
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Thread Starter
Ive been led to understand PDK in both variants. I understand directly from a factory source we are talking a 9000 rpm limiter on both variants. I know there are many skeptics among us but I have been led to believe by Porsche insiders that the 991 GT3 is going to be a game changer on so many levels as to effectively re create the genre as we have known it in the past. Effectively like the shift from 2.7/964/993 RS to GT3 in 1999. I think what you will see here is a car more akin to the R35 GTR and then some. Fast, comfortable, easy to drive with a breath of talent beyond anything before and some quite remarkable performance stats (0-100 in 3.6/3.8 seconds, Ring time in 7.20s etc). If you want noisy, tricky pedal car feel buy older 911 or better still own both! The global markets and competitors are moving the game on and Porsche will join suite....
12-10-2012, 05:50 PM
#167
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^ So is the thought also that it will have PDCC and PTV standard, with no option to delete them?
12-10-2012, 06:03 PM
#168
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I think you will find PDK standard along with PTV and possibly the dynamic engine mounts. I believe PDCC may remain an option. The price has been increased to reflect not only the shift in pricing form Porsche across the whole 991 vs 997 range (some of which will be exchange rate derived) but also because with inclusion of PDK (a 5+k usd option) and some of the other technologies such as PTV, the rear suspension toe in steering tech etc the base price had no option but to increase significantly on the out going model.
The factory source I quote also made comment that the PDK gearbox in the 991 GT3 variant will be unlike the standard 991S. The indication given is that software changes have been made to increase dynamic performance when mated to the 450bhp+ GT3 engine with its higher revving character. Electronic steering software will also see a small revision. All indications given were that this really will be a super car.
This (2013) is Porsches 50th anniversary of the 911 and marks the beginning of participation in lL Mans using the 991 GT3 RSR early next year - the first time they have fielded cars in this competition for 15 years!
I don't think they will leave any stone un-turned with the 991 GT3+RS variants over the next 24 months.
The game is moving on. The purists will as always lament the passing of older more organic technologies and the Motor Noters will no doubt take a dig at the PDK and electric steering (once again) but the fact remains the car will likely win a bunch of accolades and many magazines sports car of the year award. For 140k usd you et a well optioned Porsche with credentials that will but all but the truly exotic stuff (twice the price) like the 458 Italia to shame.
Bring it on I say. If you dont like it - easy. Keep your existing car or do the right think and put a 964 or 993 in your garage as a weekend hairy chest car to prove to yourself on a Sunday morning you are still alive. At all other times I suspect you'll find the ease of access of the 991 GT3+RS astonishingly addictive in real life conditions and with the PDK you now have one less arguement from the wife ("honey its automatic, even you can take it for a drive and get some enjoyment from it" LOL!).
The factory source I quote also made comment that the PDK gearbox in the 991 GT3 variant will be unlike the standard 991S. The indication given is that software changes have been made to increase dynamic performance when mated to the 450bhp+ GT3 engine with its higher revving character. Electronic steering software will also see a small revision. All indications given were that this really will be a super car.
This (2013) is Porsches 50th anniversary of the 911 and marks the beginning of participation in lL Mans using the 991 GT3 RSR early next year - the first time they have fielded cars in this competition for 15 years!
I don't think they will leave any stone un-turned with the 991 GT3+RS variants over the next 24 months.
The game is moving on. The purists will as always lament the passing of older more organic technologies and the Motor Noters will no doubt take a dig at the PDK and electric steering (once again) but the fact remains the car will likely win a bunch of accolades and many magazines sports car of the year award. For 140k usd you et a well optioned Porsche with credentials that will but all but the truly exotic stuff (twice the price) like the 458 Italia to shame.
Bring it on I say. If you dont like it - easy. Keep your existing car or do the right think and put a 964 or 993 in your garage as a weekend hairy chest car to prove to yourself on a Sunday morning you are still alive. At all other times I suspect you'll find the ease of access of the 991 GT3+RS astonishingly addictive in real life conditions and with the PDK you now have one less arguement from the wife ("honey its automatic, even you can take it for a drive and get some enjoyment from it" LOL!).
12-10-2012, 06:41 PM
#169
If Porsche is reading this, then make the 991 GT3 crowd happy by enabling Left Foot Braking (LFB) on the new PDK only gt3 - with only 2 pedals I would definitely convert to left foot braking.
12-10-2012, 06:56 PM
#170
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Nothing addictive about pdk. Porsche didn't invest all the money into developing a 7 speed manual for nothing. I bet we will in fact see a manual 991 gt3. Porsche is still using a rear engine car with round headlights. Not exactly supportive of trend followers.
12-10-2012, 07:51 PM
#171
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My preference is manual, but I might be able to live with PDK (probably whining in the process). PTV could be more of an issue because, to me, it borders on cheating and I'd rather get the car through corners myself, using my own inputs (but conceding having LSD). PDCC I might be able to live with too, but not sure it's needed if the car corners relatively flat anyway, plus I don't mind a little lean.
12-10-2012, 09:02 PM
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Having had 6 Porsches, 5 modern waterpumpers and currently a 964 3.6T, modern technology gets the nod in accessibility and every day usability. A proper garage requires both variants.
12-10-2012, 10:09 PM
#173
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Like you, I also have the feeling that this car will be something special. We'll know soon enough....
12-11-2012, 07:24 AM
#174
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Ive been led to understand PDK in both variants. I understand directly from a factory source we are talking a 9000 rpm limiter on both variants. I know there are many skeptics among us but I have been led to believe by Porsche insiders that the 991 GT3 is going to be a game changer on so many levels as to effectively re create the genre as we have known it in the past. Effectively like the shift from 2.7/964/993 RS to GT3 in 1999. I think what you will see here is a car more akin to the R35 GTR and then some. Fast, comfortable, easy to drive with a breath of talent beyond anything before and some quite remarkable performance stats (0-100 in 3.6/3.8 seconds, Ring time in 7.20s etc). If you want noisy, tricky pedal car feel buy older 911 or better still own both! The global markets and competitors are moving the game on and Porsche will join suite....
1. 7:20 - sorry - this is just ridicoulous..the 918 has done barely better yet, in an interview Mr Preuninger said: the new 991 GT3 will be around the 997.2GT3RS level - tested by sport Auto on the ring at 7:33. The is no road car so far that has been tested (by independent testers) with less than 7:24. And youre telling me the new GT3 with 460HP can dust a MP4-12..and an Aventador?
2) 9000 rpm - depends how you inteprete it - 9000 will definately not be the beginning of the "red zone" - at 9000 - you will be already deeply in red zone.
12-11-2012, 11:32 AM
#175
Drifting
I think you will find PDK standard along with PTV and possibly the dynamic engine mounts. I believe PDCC may remain an option. The price has been increased to reflect not only the shift in pricing form Porsche across the whole 991 vs 997 range (some of which will be exchange rate derived) but also because with inclusion of PDK (a 5+k usd option) and some of the other technologies such as PTV, the rear suspension toe in steering tech etc the base price had no option but to increase significantly on the out going model.
The factory source I quote also made comment that the PDK gearbox in the 991 GT3 variant will be unlike the standard 991S. The indication given is that software changes have been made to increase dynamic performance when mated to the 450bhp+ GT3 engine with its higher revving character. Electronic steering software will also see a small revision. All indications given were that this really will be a super car.
This (2013) is Porsches 50th anniversary of the 911 and marks the beginning of participation in lL Mans using the 991 GT3 RSR early next year - the first time they have fielded cars in this competition for 15 years!
I don't think they will leave any stone un-turned with the 991 GT3+RS variants over the next 24 months.
The game is moving on. The purists will as always lament the passing of older more organic technologies and the Motor Noters will no doubt take a dig at the PDK and electric steering (once again) but the fact remains the car will likely win a bunch of accolades and many magazines sports car of the year award. For 140k usd you et a well optioned Porsche with credentials that will but all but the truly exotic stuff (twice the price) like the 458 Italia to shame.
Bring it on I say. If you dont like it - easy. Keep your existing car or do the right think and put a 964 or 993 in your garage as a weekend hairy chest car to prove to yourself on a Sunday morning you are still alive. At all other times I suspect you'll find the ease of access of the 991 GT3+RS astonishingly addictive in real life conditions and with the PDK you now have one less arguement from the wife ("honey its automatic, even you can take it for a drive and get some enjoyment from it" LOL!).
The factory source I quote also made comment that the PDK gearbox in the 991 GT3 variant will be unlike the standard 991S. The indication given is that software changes have been made to increase dynamic performance when mated to the 450bhp+ GT3 engine with its higher revving character. Electronic steering software will also see a small revision. All indications given were that this really will be a super car.
This (2013) is Porsches 50th anniversary of the 911 and marks the beginning of participation in lL Mans using the 991 GT3 RSR early next year - the first time they have fielded cars in this competition for 15 years!
I don't think they will leave any stone un-turned with the 991 GT3+RS variants over the next 24 months.
The game is moving on. The purists will as always lament the passing of older more organic technologies and the Motor Noters will no doubt take a dig at the PDK and electric steering (once again) but the fact remains the car will likely win a bunch of accolades and many magazines sports car of the year award. For 140k usd you et a well optioned Porsche with credentials that will but all but the truly exotic stuff (twice the price) like the 458 Italia to shame.
Bring it on I say. If you dont like it - easy. Keep your existing car or do the right think and put a 964 or 993 in your garage as a weekend hairy chest car to prove to yourself on a Sunday morning you are still alive. At all other times I suspect you'll find the ease of access of the 991 GT3+RS astonishingly addictive in real life conditions and with the PDK you now have one less arguement from the wife ("honey its automatic, even you can take it for a drive and get some enjoyment from it" LOL!).
Sorry, but I think your post is complete bs..one can discuss about preferences and changes - but there are two main issues:
1. 7:20 - sorry - this is just ridicoulous..the 918 has done barely better yet, in an interview Mr Preuninger said: the new 991 GT3 will be around the 997.2GT3RS level - tested by sport Auto on the ring at 7:33. The is no road car so far that has been tested (by independent testers) with less than 7:24. And youre telling me the new GT3 with 460HP can dust a MP4-12..and an Aventador?
2) 9000 rpm - depends how you inteprete it - 9000 will definately not be the beginning of the "red zone" - at 9000 - you will be already deeply in red zone.
1. 7:20 - sorry - this is just ridicoulous..the 918 has done barely better yet, in an interview Mr Preuninger said: the new 991 GT3 will be around the 997.2GT3RS level - tested by sport Auto on the ring at 7:33. The is no road car so far that has been tested (by independent testers) with less than 7:24. And youre telling me the new GT3 with 460HP can dust a MP4-12..and an Aventador?
2) 9000 rpm - depends how you inteprete it - 9000 will definately not be the beginning of the "red zone" - at 9000 - you will be already deeply in red zone.
9k RPM is probably doable. The 458 Italia revs to 9k, and the sharkwerks 3.9l cars rev to 8800. With PDK preventing over-revs, they may just get there. Long-term reliability remains to be seen, as we've discussed.
12-11-2012, 03:40 PM
#177
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Thread Starter
Thats just the point. Porsche didnt invest all that money in a 7 speed manual. They invested in a 7 speed PDK and ensured a manual box could be also achieved from the original design brief.
Sorry for the typo. 7.20 should read 7.28s for the Ring time. If we assume the 991 GT3+RS will be wearing more track oriented rubber than the 991S then this is entirely achievable. The 918 by the way is already proving it will be quicker than 7.20 infact on factory test driver has been gear saying it may well be a 7.15 car!
The 991 GT3 will eclipse the outgoing GT3RS. Assuming its packed wit PDK Id expect it to be a few seconds quicker around the Ring. Its likely to be lighter than the outgoing car or no heavier at least given the transmission choice. The RS variant will probably be 2-3 seconds quicker again through tyre choice, weight and geometry settings.
Sorry for the typo. 7.20 should read 7.28s for the Ring time. If we assume the 991 GT3+RS will be wearing more track oriented rubber than the 991S then this is entirely achievable. The 918 by the way is already proving it will be quicker than 7.20 infact on factory test driver has been gear saying it may well be a 7.15 car!
The 991 GT3 will eclipse the outgoing GT3RS. Assuming its packed wit PDK Id expect it to be a few seconds quicker around the Ring. Its likely to be lighter than the outgoing car or no heavier at least given the transmission choice. The RS variant will probably be 2-3 seconds quicker again through tyre choice, weight and geometry settings.
12-11-2012, 04:13 PM
#178
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Thats just the point. Porsche didnt invest all that money in a 7 speed manual. They invested in a 7 speed PDK and ensured a manual box could be also achieved from the original design brief.
Sorry for the typo. 7.20 should read 7.28s for the Ring time. If we assume the 991 GT3+RS will be wearing more track oriented rubber than the 991S then this is entirely achievable. The 918 by the way is already proving it will be quicker than 7.20 infact on factory test driver has been gear saying it may well be a 7.15 car!
The 991 GT3 will eclipse the outgoing GT3RS. Assuming its packed wit PDK Id expect it to be a few seconds quicker around the Ring. Its likely to be lighter than the outgoing car or no heavier at least given the transmission choice. The RS variant will probably be 2-3 seconds quicker again through tyre choice, weight and geometry settings.
Sorry for the typo. 7.20 should read 7.28s for the Ring time. If we assume the 991 GT3+RS will be wearing more track oriented rubber than the 991S then this is entirely achievable. The 918 by the way is already proving it will be quicker than 7.20 infact on factory test driver has been gear saying it may well be a 7.15 car!
The 991 GT3 will eclipse the outgoing GT3RS. Assuming its packed wit PDK Id expect it to be a few seconds quicker around the Ring. Its likely to be lighter than the outgoing car or no heavier at least given the transmission choice. The RS variant will probably be 2-3 seconds quicker again through tyre choice, weight and geometry settings.
Now, why exactly would they do both if they only intended on offering one of them???
12-11-2012, 04:33 PM
#179
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Thread Starter
Wanna911. Isnt what you've just said and I said the same thing?
a.928. Its ok I think your response to my post is complete bs too. Apart from picking up on a typo (you will see in earlier posts and posts over on the rennteam board I state 7.28 numerous times) and some kind of fluffy ambiguous statement regards the 9000 rpm limit I dont see any value you added to the debate.
The 9000 rpm limit came form a factory porsche employee. The Ring time is my pure supposition based on research including recent interview with W. Rohl on the 918 proto lap times in recent EVO issue.
We can rant on all we like here. Proof will be unveiled in just over three months and then you can flame me all you like.
a.928. Its ok I think your response to my post is complete bs too. Apart from picking up on a typo (you will see in earlier posts and posts over on the rennteam board I state 7.28 numerous times) and some kind of fluffy ambiguous statement regards the 9000 rpm limit I dont see any value you added to the debate.
The 9000 rpm limit came form a factory porsche employee. The Ring time is my pure supposition based on research including recent interview with W. Rohl on the 918 proto lap times in recent EVO issue.
We can rant on all we like here. Proof will be unveiled in just over three months and then you can flame me all you like.
12-11-2012, 04:59 PM
#180
Drifting
Provided the 991 RS gets the Mezger, do you think there is any room for development beyond 500 hp in a warrantied, street legal car? Assuming the car remains at 4.0 liters displacement. (Higher redline like your 3.9 build, better breathing - 200 cell cats vs. the 300 cell in the RS 4.0, etc.)