Definitive 991 GT3 Thread
12-03-2012, 07:03 PM
#151
I just hope they figure out how to get better gas mileage out of the Metzger, because currently in race trim, both the R8 LMS and 458 GT3 spec with their DFI are much better on fuel consumption. That's a problem when your race car is built for endurance racing. Weissach knows this, and I'm sure they will address it, as it's one of the current car's biggest weaknesses
12-03-2012, 07:55 PM
#152
Drifting
The rest of the text is speculation from Rennteam.
12-03-2012, 11:27 PM
#153
Rennlist Member
Yes, it's call BOP (balance of performance). This year it worked in reverse. The 458 ended up with a smaller fuel cell to balance out it's performance with the 911 and Vantage in the WEC. With the new vette likely to have a DFI engine as well, maybe Porsche and AS will ask for a larger fuel in 2013?
The good news is that the 991 chassis should be considerably lighter than the outgoing model, so additional fuel loads should't be as much of an issue now, but it's going to continue to be an uphill battle. I'm sure a DFI will makes it way into the Porsche equation, when is just the question.
12-04-2012, 06:25 AM
#154
Burning Brakes
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I just hope they figure out how to get better gas mileage out of the Metzger, because currently in race trim, both the R8 LMS and 458 GT3 spec with their DFI are much better on fuel consumption. That's a problem when your race car is built for endurance racing. Weissach knows this, and I'm sure they will address it, as it's one of the current car's biggest weaknesses.
The problem is more on the chassis side than on engine, or fuel consumption. The question is whether the 991 RSR can catch up ..or beat the rest. It wont be easy.
Any of you proposing that the 9A1 engine could also be used for 24 h racing..havent understood the basics of race engines. You think Porsche took this decision if there could have been a cheaper option?
12-04-2012, 10:54 AM
#155
Drifting
Right, it's the same reason why the GT2 RS didn't use the 9A1 engine from the gen 2 turbo, but instead the 3.6 Mezger...
12-04-2012, 07:08 PM
#156
Interview with Andreas Preuninger...
Interview with Andreas Preuninger from Auto Motor und Sport...
...thanks to "blueflame" for the selected quotes and all due credit to AMS and Andreas Preuninger!
Andreas Preuninger, Project Manager GT models, on the philosophy and the future of GT3 and RS...
"With full conviction: The next RS is wow!"
What comes after the 911 GT3 RS 4.0?
Preuninger: The 4.0 is to be regarded as a special model in which many racing parts are mounted. We were sure to have pulled out all the stops to send worthy of the series 997 in retirement. But a year later we had new ideas on how to make it even better, even faster.
And 2013, which can be found in the new GT3?
Preuninger: Our philosophy is to reach the next GT3-based model the performance of the previous RS. At 991 GT3, we focus initially on the RS 3.8.
Is designed to parallel the very next RS model?
Preuninger: First of all, the GT3 is a fascinating sports cars. In general, the development of a GT3 with a strong forward runs for RS-version based on it. In the current case, the task is more difficult, because we had a full model change. Moreover, the differentiation between GT3 and RS is always great. Until next RS is still a bit to go (Editor's Note: 2014), but I can already say with full conviction: The RS is just "wow".
Is from the rear engine concept actually get so much?
Preuninger: The technology goes on. At 991 GT3 we have intensively discussed the points, how much and what electronic systems can be used in the car without compromising the unfiltered driving experience. It is extremely important to maintain the high emotionality in GT3.
For example, with rear axle steering and PDK?
Preuninger: If the foster system dynamics without imposing on drivers, they come. Every technical detail but it must be a clear win for the car without compromising its identity. And if we were to offer a PDK gearbox for, then it would be fantastic spot to fit a purist concept like the 911 GT3.
Plays the racing during development also play a role?
Preuninger: Absolutely. RS models are the homologation in motorsport. In the development of road and racing cars, the same people are involved - this is a symbiosis for decades.
(Source: Auto Motor und Sport, 29 November 2012)
"With full conviction: The next RS is wow!"
What comes after the 911 GT3 RS 4.0?
Preuninger: The 4.0 is to be regarded as a special model in which many racing parts are mounted. We were sure to have pulled out all the stops to send worthy of the series 997 in retirement. But a year later we had new ideas on how to make it even better, even faster.
And 2013, which can be found in the new GT3?
Preuninger: Our philosophy is to reach the next GT3-based model the performance of the previous RS. At 991 GT3, we focus initially on the RS 3.8.
Is designed to parallel the very next RS model?
Preuninger: First of all, the GT3 is a fascinating sports cars. In general, the development of a GT3 with a strong forward runs for RS-version based on it. In the current case, the task is more difficult, because we had a full model change. Moreover, the differentiation between GT3 and RS is always great. Until next RS is still a bit to go (Editor's Note: 2014), but I can already say with full conviction: The RS is just "wow".
Is from the rear engine concept actually get so much?
Preuninger: The technology goes on. At 991 GT3 we have intensively discussed the points, how much and what electronic systems can be used in the car without compromising the unfiltered driving experience. It is extremely important to maintain the high emotionality in GT3.
For example, with rear axle steering and PDK?
Preuninger: If the foster system dynamics without imposing on drivers, they come. Every technical detail but it must be a clear win for the car without compromising its identity. And if we were to offer a PDK gearbox for, then it would be fantastic spot to fit a purist concept like the 911 GT3.
Plays the racing during development also play a role?
Preuninger: Absolutely. RS models are the homologation in motorsport. In the development of road and racing cars, the same people are involved - this is a symbiosis for decades.
(Source: Auto Motor und Sport, 29 November 2012)
12-04-2012, 08:16 PM
#157
Race Director
".....the Ferrari also has a direct injection engine, which means that it can complete the six hours on four stops (starting the race on a full tank and finishing with an empty one). Porsche cannot achieve this same feat, nor can Aston Martin."
12-04-2012, 09:03 PM
#158
Quote:
Originally Posted by a.928
Well that is exactly wrong - Manthey had since about three years always less pit stops for refueling than many of its competitors in the 24 hours races. One reason why the 997 GT3RSR was still somehow competitive this year was because it used less fuel !
Interesting. Your assertion is 180 degrees out from Michael Cotton's "European Windows" column in the October Panorama. Talking about the Porsches and Ferrari 458 he writes:
".....the Ferrari also has a direct injection engine, which means that it can complete the six hours on four stops (starting the race on a full tank and finishing with an empty one). Porsche cannot achieve this same feat, nor can Aston Martin."
Originally Posted by a.928
Well that is exactly wrong - Manthey had since about three years always less pit stops for refueling than many of its competitors in the 24 hours races. One reason why the 997 GT3RSR was still somehow competitive this year was because it used less fuel !
Interesting. Your assertion is 180 degrees out from Michael Cotton's "European Windows" column in the October Panorama. Talking about the Porsches and Ferrari 458 he writes:
".....the Ferrari also has a direct injection engine, which means that it can complete the six hours on four stops (starting the race on a full tank and finishing with an empty one). Porsche cannot achieve this same feat, nor can Aston Martin."
12-05-2012, 11:06 AM
#159
Burning Brakes
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no worries..but I was trying to say that on a race car so many elements are important. There is no use of having the best engine if it fails in the right moment, there is no use of the best engine when a team picks the wrong tires etc.
Also, we have to be honest, in this season the 997 GT3 RSR had ofeen bad luck..crashed out by others. etc.
Im still confident the 991 RSR with Mezger engine can win - put differently, if this doenst change anything..then its probably tim eto givbe up flat 6 racing anyway. Quite a few experts say that you cannot really win without a flat 6 in todays times...no matter if DFI or not..
Also remember this years Le Mans..Porsche 997.2 GT3RSR held for quite some time the second place before a tire blew...so to say that it has/had no chance is not correct either.
all the best,
12-09-2012, 07:20 PM
#160
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Rear wheel steering. . . . . hmmmmm. I know the rear wheel steering spec has been out for a while, but that should give the purists one more reason not to purchase the new GT3 along with engine choice. I'm more interested in how the new chassis behaves than debating dry sump motors.
Apparently they were tight lipped on transmission choice.
I remain on the wait list and am looking forward to driving the new cayman launch car when it arrives.
Oh and was told the turbo will be in the 180k range. Eeeks.
12-09-2012, 08:11 PM
#162
Must be PDK only then, too much lock down on transmission information trying to hide it until they unveil the car, if a manual were coming we'd already know about it or seen it on a mule. That's too bad, I wanted the option.
12-09-2012, 08:32 PM
#163
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Don't post in this particular often but lurk quite a bit.
IMHO, Porsche will make a big mistake if they release a 9A1 equipped street GT3 but still run a Metzger in the race cars. As someone posted previously, might as well call it a GTS (now that that moniker has been diluted).
IMHO, Porsche will make a big mistake if they release a 9A1 equipped street GT3 but still run a Metzger in the race cars. As someone posted previously, might as well call it a GTS (now that that moniker has been diluted).
12-09-2012, 09:26 PM
#164
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Don't post in this particular often but lurk quite a bit.
IMHO, Porsche will make a big mistake if they release a 9A1 equipped street GT3 but still run a Metzger in the race cars. As someone posted previously, might as well call it a GTS (now that that moniker has been diluted).
IMHO, Porsche will make a big mistake if they release a 9A1 equipped street GT3 but still run a Metzger in the race cars. As someone posted previously, might as well call it a GTS (now that that moniker has been diluted).
Might as well call it the -- 'Porsche Carrera GT3 Edition.'
12-10-2012, 12:08 PM
#165
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Given the shroud of secrecy on transmission choice I would concur that it's going to be PDK only. If so, one has to wonder if the 3 pedal GT car will be resurrected as a transmission choice in the upcoming RS. That would be typical Porsche.