A place to discuss all things ADM
08-30-2022, 04:34 PM
#2116
I decided to stop playing the ADM game with 992 GT3, GT4RS, and GT3RS.
Went to the used market and bought a 991.2 GT2RS for far closer to MSRP than any of the above mentioned cars.
Went to the used market and bought a 991.2 GT2RS for far closer to MSRP than any of the above mentioned cars.
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08-30-2022, 06:08 PM
#2117
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michaeldorian (08-31-2022)
08-31-2022, 04:48 AM
#2118
Rennlist Member
I must have been out of the loop during those years. 991.2 GT3 RS started at $188k, Weissach package added $18k, mag wheels $13k. I’ve seen them go for just under $200k on BAT back in 2020, but if you have a link showing resale history with prices under MSRP would love to see it. Might keep me from buying one later this year 
08-31-2022, 01:48 PM
#2119
Was in the market just before the explosion in late 2020 / 2021 and they were selling well below MSRP. Especially the 991.1 RS. You could buy those for 160 all day. And I skipped on some .2 RS’s in the 250k MSRP range fully loaded that were listed and sold for near the 200k marker.
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08-31-2022, 01:56 PM
#2120
I certainly agree that the market is very much over inflated right now and that a correction will come but on the flip side I also think pointing to 2020 (or even early 2021) as a metric for “normal” is a mistake. There were so many cars going for ridiculous discounts because everyone was terrified and cash was king. I don’t know much about the RS resale values to be fair - have always liked them but have never been in the market for one and don’t plan on being in it.
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09-01-2022, 07:34 PM
#2122
xx
Last edited by Peruna; 09-12-2022 at 12:12 AM.
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09-01-2022, 08:13 PM
#2123
Race Car
When's these cars collapse, everything is collapsing with them as well. So, I do think it's prudent to wait at this point. The plan released by BoA this week should be the canary in the coal mine that they want those two groups to be the fall guys for the housing collapse.
09-01-2022, 08:42 PM
#2124
Racer
Update/venting - after unnecessary negotiation, I was able to get ADM down to $50k. The challenge then became getting financing - even with very significant equity, no bank or credit union seems to want to finance this vehicle. Porsche Financial approved, but came back with an exorbitant rate. I laughed when the salesperson tried to get me to bite because "there's no prepayment for early payoff" and I could refinance the car (as if there's any chance that rates will go down in the next few years). I have outstanding credit and am very well qualified.
All this is to say that the dominoes are finally falling - this dealer quoted me $100k ADM for the same car in May when it was pre-delivery (just arrived this week). Even with a lower ADM, banks (and even Porsche Financial) seem to think granting these loans is a boneheaded idea.
In an environment with this much uncertainty, I can't imagine many people would jump to pay cash for these depreciating, damageable things. The loans have clearly gotten much more expensive. Looks like the music is finally stopping and I'm more than happy to wait after learning my lesson the hard way.
I also got a firsthand lesson in the effectiveness of the Fed's policy. These types of transactions are exactly what they're trying to discourage. And guess what, it's working well.
I predict a collapse in GT3 prices (992, rippling hard into 991s) within the next 6 months - I think ADM will be gone or minimal and used/flipper cars going for at or below MSRP (depending on production impacts going into winter).
All this is to say that the dominoes are finally falling - this dealer quoted me $100k ADM for the same car in May when it was pre-delivery (just arrived this week). Even with a lower ADM, banks (and even Porsche Financial) seem to think granting these loans is a boneheaded idea.
In an environment with this much uncertainty, I can't imagine many people would jump to pay cash for these depreciating, damageable things. The loans have clearly gotten much more expensive. Looks like the music is finally stopping and I'm more than happy to wait after learning my lesson the hard way.
I also got a firsthand lesson in the effectiveness of the Fed's policy. These types of transactions are exactly what they're trying to discourage. And guess what, it's working well.
I predict a collapse in GT3 prices (992, rippling hard into 991s) within the next 6 months - I think ADM will be gone or minimal and used/flipper cars going for at or below MSRP (depending on production impacts going into winter).
09-01-2022, 08:44 PM
#2125
Advanced
Update/venting - after unnecessary negotiation, I was able to get ADM down to $50k. The challenge then became getting financing - even with very significant equity, no bank or credit union seems to want to finance this vehicle. Porsche Financial approved, but came back with an exorbitant rate. I laughed when the salesperson tried to get me to bite because "there's no prepayment for early payoff" and I could refinance the car (as if there's any chance that rates will go down in the next few years). I have outstanding credit and am very well qualified.
All this is to say that the dominoes are finally falling - this dealer quoted me $100k ADM for the same car in May when it was pre-delivery (just arrived this week). Even with a lower ADM, banks (and even Porsche Financial) seem to think granting these loans is a boneheaded idea.
In an environment with this much uncertainty, I can't imagine many people would jump to pay cash for these depreciating, damageable things. The loans have clearly gotten much more expensive. Looks like the music is finally stopping and I'm more than happy to wait after learning my lesson the hard way.
I also got a firsthand lesson in the effectiveness of the Fed's policy. These types of transactions are exactly what they're trying to discourage. And guess what, it's working well.
I predict a collapse in GT3 prices (992, rippling hard into 991s) within the next 6 months - I think ADM will be gone or minimal and used/flipper cars going for at or below MSRP (depending on production impacts going into winter).
All this is to say that the dominoes are finally falling - this dealer quoted me $100k ADM for the same car in May when it was pre-delivery (just arrived this week). Even with a lower ADM, banks (and even Porsche Financial) seem to think granting these loans is a boneheaded idea.
In an environment with this much uncertainty, I can't imagine many people would jump to pay cash for these depreciating, damageable things. The loans have clearly gotten much more expensive. Looks like the music is finally stopping and I'm more than happy to wait after learning my lesson the hard way.
I also got a firsthand lesson in the effectiveness of the Fed's policy. These types of transactions are exactly what they're trying to discourage. And guess what, it's working well.
I predict a collapse in GT3 prices (992, rippling hard into 991s) within the next 6 months - I think ADM will be gone or minimal and used/flipper cars going for at or below MSRP (depending on production impacts going into winter).
The following users liked this post:
pookiemalibu (09-01-2022)
09-01-2022, 09:46 PM
#2126
Update/venting - after unnecessary negotiation, I was able to get ADM down to $50k. The challenge then became getting financing - even with very significant equity, no bank or credit union seems to want to finance this vehicle. Porsche Financial approved, but came back with an exorbitant rate. I laughed when the salesperson tried to get me to bite because "there's no prepayment for early payoff" and I could refinance the car (as if there's any chance that rates will go down in the next few years). I have outstanding credit and am very well qualified.
All this is to say that the dominoes are finally falling - this dealer quoted me $100k ADM for the same car in May when it was pre-delivery (just arrived this week). Even with a lower ADM, banks (and even Porsche Financial) seem to think granting these loans is a boneheaded idea.
In an environment with this much uncertainty, I can't imagine many people would jump to pay cash for these depreciating, damageable things. The loans have clearly gotten much more expensive. Looks like the music is finally stopping and I'm more than happy to wait after learning my lesson the hard way.
I also got a firsthand lesson in the effectiveness of the Fed's policy. These types of transactions are exactly what they're trying to discourage. And guess what, it's working well.
I predict a collapse in GT3 prices (992, rippling hard into 991s) within the next 6 months - I think ADM will be gone or minimal and used/flipper cars going for at or below MSRP (depending on production impacts going into winter).
All this is to say that the dominoes are finally falling - this dealer quoted me $100k ADM for the same car in May when it was pre-delivery (just arrived this week). Even with a lower ADM, banks (and even Porsche Financial) seem to think granting these loans is a boneheaded idea.
In an environment with this much uncertainty, I can't imagine many people would jump to pay cash for these depreciating, damageable things. The loans have clearly gotten much more expensive. Looks like the music is finally stopping and I'm more than happy to wait after learning my lesson the hard way.
I also got a firsthand lesson in the effectiveness of the Fed's policy. These types of transactions are exactly what they're trying to discourage. And guess what, it's working well.
I predict a collapse in GT3 prices (992, rippling hard into 991s) within the next 6 months - I think ADM will be gone or minimal and used/flipper cars going for at or below MSRP (depending on production impacts going into winter).
@ispool what kind of rates are you getting from PFS? what is the reason banks/credit unions are giving you for not financing the vehicle?
09-01-2022, 10:09 PM
#2127
"In an environment with this much uncertainty, I can't imagine many people would jump to pay cash for these depreciating, damageable things."
This is the part I don't understand. Whether you pay cash or borrow to buy, aren't you taking the same loss for depreciation or damage loss?
This is the part I don't understand. Whether you pay cash or borrow to buy, aren't you taking the same loss for depreciation or damage loss?
09-01-2022, 10:53 PM
#2128
"In an environment with this much uncertainty, I can't imagine many people would jump to pay cash for these depreciating, damageable things."
This is the part I don't understand. Whether you pay cash or borrow to buy, aren't you taking the same loss for depreciation or damage loss?
This is the part I don't understand. Whether you pay cash or borrow to buy, aren't you taking the same loss for depreciation or damage loss?
09-01-2022, 11:16 PM
#2129
Anyone dropping 200k on a toy is inflation really a point of purchase? Not being a pill, but it’s a toy not a need to live ….cars are consumables at this price point it’s a blessing.
09-01-2022, 11:56 PM
#2130
Assuming this is a financial decision, meaning one has the cash but opts to borrow. Where would you invest balance of cash today to avoid paying opportunity cost? Let us know.
The logic of borrowing money to buy a house does not apply to car purchases. Time horizon, nature of the collateral asset, tax benefit are all different. I'd argue you will have more to lose cuz it's a leveraged buy for a depreciating asset (on top of paying interest to borrow).
The logic of borrowing money to buy a house does not apply to car purchases. Time horizon, nature of the collateral asset, tax benefit are all different. I'd argue you will have more to lose cuz it's a leveraged buy for a depreciating asset (on top of paying interest to borrow).