Consolidated 991RS thread
12-18-2014, 11:44 AM
#2912
Rennlist Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Wishing I Was At The Track
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http://www.gtspirit.com/112627/gallery/13654/199870/
No tacky fender lips; black wheels rule; baby got back. Tick tock. It's gonna rock.
No tacky fender lips; black wheels rule; baby got back. Tick tock. It's gonna rock.
12-18-2014, 01:15 PM
#2913
Burning Brakes
http://www.gtspirit.com/112627/gallery/13654/199870/
No tacky fender lips; black wheels rule; baby got back. Tick tock. It's gonna rock.
No tacky fender lips; black wheels rule; baby got back. Tick tock. It's gonna rock.
12-18-2014, 06:11 PM
#2915
Nordschleife Master
Seriously, what is the rational for testing in that environment? There won't be one RS driven in those conditions. After all, a car like that is not realistically designed for that kind of application...a Cayenne yes, RS...give me a break!!! Just my .02 worth. 
12-18-2014, 06:15 PM
#2916
Rennlist Member
Cold weather testing. Cold idle enrichment settings, HVACs operation, testing tolerances of suspension in extreme cold climes. Standard prototype testing for virtually all cars these days regardless of sports car or otherwise. All standard practice. They did same with GT3 too. They probably have some mules doing hot weather testing too in Australia or South Africa as we speak...
12-18-2014, 06:29 PM
#2917
Burning Brakes
My dealer told me today that there will be GT2 RS. He actually said we can sit down a spec out the 3 RS shortly. Have a deposit in already. But, he threw me for a loop with GT2 RS which is not that far out(according to him).
12-18-2014, 06:52 PM
#2918
[QUOTE=ScottKelly911;11879591]Greg, I totally agree with much of what you're saying. Racing loads do put on much more stress levels to many components in the suspension. At the same time, race car components are designed for max performance with just enough durability to make it through a race. Look at F1 cars as an example, all suspension parts are basically consumables and replaced after every race.
That's obviously more of an extreme as many other forms of racing suspension pieces are checked and if they're not damaged and/or stressed, will go right back onto the car. That being said, street car suspensions are designed for longevity and sacrifice some performance and weight in exchange for durability. I Don't think an RS style wing is would put the types of stresses on the car in which you've pointed out. If it were one of those giant wings that you see in many of the upper levels of motorsport and during an endurance race, then yeah I wholeheartedly agree with you. But for a HPDE event with an RS Style wing, I just don't see forces being too great for the stock suspension. While we agree on some of these points and maybe not others, I want to say. I do enjoy the conversation and like that it's civil and not name calling. I appreciate that and hope you feel the same. Cheers
This is a great forum and for the most part pretty cordial, the way it should be. None of us are most likely the world experts on whatever topic we are commenting on, but we all have an opinion... makes for interesting conversation.
Regarding the "wing" issue. I certainly would expect that the larger wing we are discussing here may not stress the suspension so much that it immediately snaps - I suspect Porsche has over-engineered the parts to build in a big safety margin. My point is that by increasing the stress the anticipated safety margin has been reduced. Over time, with many track days, it will take it's toll, accumulating to a point where fatigue is possible. Race teams check and replace parts almost every race so the parts they are stressing do not reach fatigue level and break. I suspect that most amateur drivers, using their cars on the street and occasional track work, don't do a crack check of all the suspension parts every time they take the car out for a weekend run at the track. Hopefully the OP here with the wing has the suspension removed, stripped and crack checked regularly by Crawford, it seems they have experience in those areas. Especially in situations like this where the parts are experimental and there is no experience record to anticipate a replacement or service interval.
The balance issues are the owner's purview. His driving style may suit the changes better than stock. I will be interested to see what he has to report as his experience continues with the experimentation.
That's obviously more of an extreme as many other forms of racing suspension pieces are checked and if they're not damaged and/or stressed, will go right back onto the car. That being said, street car suspensions are designed for longevity and sacrifice some performance and weight in exchange for durability. I Don't think an RS style wing is would put the types of stresses on the car in which you've pointed out. If it were one of those giant wings that you see in many of the upper levels of motorsport and during an endurance race, then yeah I wholeheartedly agree with you. But for a HPDE event with an RS Style wing, I just don't see forces being too great for the stock suspension. While we agree on some of these points and maybe not others, I want to say. I do enjoy the conversation and like that it's civil and not name calling. I appreciate that and hope you feel the same. Cheers
This is a great forum and for the most part pretty cordial, the way it should be. None of us are most likely the world experts on whatever topic we are commenting on, but we all have an opinion... makes for interesting conversation.
Regarding the "wing" issue. I certainly would expect that the larger wing we are discussing here may not stress the suspension so much that it immediately snaps - I suspect Porsche has over-engineered the parts to build in a big safety margin. My point is that by increasing the stress the anticipated safety margin has been reduced. Over time, with many track days, it will take it's toll, accumulating to a point where fatigue is possible. Race teams check and replace parts almost every race so the parts they are stressing do not reach fatigue level and break. I suspect that most amateur drivers, using their cars on the street and occasional track work, don't do a crack check of all the suspension parts every time they take the car out for a weekend run at the track. Hopefully the OP here with the wing has the suspension removed, stripped and crack checked regularly by Crawford, it seems they have experience in those areas. Especially in situations like this where the parts are experimental and there is no experience record to anticipate a replacement or service interval.
The balance issues are the owner's purview. His driving style may suit the changes better than stock. I will be interested to see what he has to report as his experience continues with the experimentation.
12-18-2014, 07:41 PM
#2919
Nordschleife Master
Cold weather testing. Cold idle enrichment settings, HVACs operation, testing tolerances of suspension in extreme cold climes. Standard prototype testing for virtually all cars these days regardless of sports car or otherwise. All standard practice. They did same with GT3 too. They probably have some mules doing hot weather testing too in Australia or South Africa as we speak...
Thanks Macca, I appreciate the feedback. You obviously have far more knowledge than I have regarding the testing that goes on, was just curious.
12-18-2014, 11:19 PM
#2920
Sure, after the press embargo has been lifted. That said, it'll likely be late Feb. at the earliest. I love how some dealers claim to have insider info.
12-19-2014, 12:14 AM
#2921
Burning Brakes
Crawford Wing for 991 GT3 Pricing Released Today:
The wing kit comprises;
· One 60” element with a 12” cord
· One 3/8 gurney that is removable
· Left hand and right hand wing end plates
· Left hand and right hand aluminum mounts with carbon covers
· Hardware for the wing to the mounts with an adjusting tool.
· Brake lights in the back of the mounts with a wiring loom
The price of the kit is $2960.00.
Additional Details and Photos posted on:
https://rennlist.com/forums/991-gt3/...l#post11887328
The wing kit comprises;
· One 60” element with a 12” cord
· One 3/8 gurney that is removable
· Left hand and right hand wing end plates
· Left hand and right hand aluminum mounts with carbon covers
· Hardware for the wing to the mounts with an adjusting tool.
· Brake lights in the back of the mounts with a wiring loom
The price of the kit is $2960.00.
Additional Details and Photos posted on:
https://rennlist.com/forums/991-gt3/...l#post11887328
12-19-2014, 10:06 AM
#2923
Rennlist Member
[QUOTE=GregJGT3;11886916]
Greg, well said. 
Greg, I totally agree with much of what you're saying. Racing loads do put on much more stress levels to many components in the suspension. At the same time, race car components are designed for max performance with just enough durability to make it through a race. Look at F1 cars as an example, all suspension parts are basically consumables and replaced after every race.
That's obviously more of an extreme as many other forms of racing suspension pieces are checked and if they're not damaged and/or stressed, will go right back onto the car. That being said, street car suspensions are designed for longevity and sacrifice some performance and weight in exchange for durability. I Don't think an RS style wing is would put the types of stresses on the car in which you've pointed out. If it were one of those giant wings that you see in many of the upper levels of motorsport and during an endurance race, then yeah I wholeheartedly agree with you. But for a HPDE event with an RS Style wing, I just don't see forces being too great for the stock suspension. While we agree on some of these points and maybe not others, I want to say. I do enjoy the conversation and like that it's civil and not name calling. I appreciate that and hope you feel the same. Cheers
This is a great forum and for the most part pretty cordial, the way it should be. None of us are most likely the world experts on whatever topic we are commenting on, but we all have an opinion... makes for interesting conversation.
Regarding the "wing" issue. I certainly would expect that the larger wing we are discussing here may not stress the suspension so much that it immediately snaps - I suspect Porsche has over-engineered the parts to build in a big safety margin. My point is that by increasing the stress the anticipated safety margin has been reduced. Over time, with many track days, it will take it's toll, accumulating to a point where fatigue is possible. Race teams check and replace parts almost every race so the parts they are stressing do not reach fatigue level and break. I suspect that most amateur drivers, using their cars on the street and occasional track work, don't do a crack check of all the suspension parts every time they take the car out for a weekend run at the track. Hopefully the OP here with the wing has the suspension removed, stripped and crack checked regularly by Crawford, it seems they have experience in those areas. Especially in situations like this where the parts are experimental and there is no experience record to anticipate a replacement or service interval.
The balance issues are the owner's purview. His driving style may suit the changes better than stock. I will be interested to see what he has to report as his experience continues with the experimentation.
That's obviously more of an extreme as many other forms of racing suspension pieces are checked and if they're not damaged and/or stressed, will go right back onto the car. That being said, street car suspensions are designed for longevity and sacrifice some performance and weight in exchange for durability. I Don't think an RS style wing is would put the types of stresses on the car in which you've pointed out. If it were one of those giant wings that you see in many of the upper levels of motorsport and during an endurance race, then yeah I wholeheartedly agree with you. But for a HPDE event with an RS Style wing, I just don't see forces being too great for the stock suspension. While we agree on some of these points and maybe not others, I want to say. I do enjoy the conversation and like that it's civil and not name calling. I appreciate that and hope you feel the same. Cheers
This is a great forum and for the most part pretty cordial, the way it should be. None of us are most likely the world experts on whatever topic we are commenting on, but we all have an opinion... makes for interesting conversation.
Regarding the "wing" issue. I certainly would expect that the larger wing we are discussing here may not stress the suspension so much that it immediately snaps - I suspect Porsche has over-engineered the parts to build in a big safety margin. My point is that by increasing the stress the anticipated safety margin has been reduced. Over time, with many track days, it will take it's toll, accumulating to a point where fatigue is possible. Race teams check and replace parts almost every race so the parts they are stressing do not reach fatigue level and break. I suspect that most amateur drivers, using their cars on the street and occasional track work, don't do a crack check of all the suspension parts every time they take the car out for a weekend run at the track. Hopefully the OP here with the wing has the suspension removed, stripped and crack checked regularly by Crawford, it seems they have experience in those areas. Especially in situations like this where the parts are experimental and there is no experience record to anticipate a replacement or service interval.
The balance issues are the owner's purview. His driving style may suit the changes better than stock. I will be interested to see what he has to report as his experience continues with the experimentation.
12-19-2014, 12:01 PM
#2925
Burning Brakes
Crawford Wing for 991 GT3 Pricing Released Today:
The wing kit comprises;
· One 60” element with a 12” cord
· One 3/8 gurney that is removable
· Left hand and right hand wing end plates
· Left hand and right hand aluminum mounts with carbon covers
· Hardware for the wing to the mounts with an adjusting tool.
· Brake lights in the back of the mounts with a wiring loom
The price of the kit is $2960.00.
Additional Details and Photos posted on:
https://rennlist.com/forums/991-gt3/...l#post11887328
The wing kit comprises;
· One 60” element with a 12” cord
· One 3/8 gurney that is removable
· Left hand and right hand wing end plates
· Left hand and right hand aluminum mounts with carbon covers
· Hardware for the wing to the mounts with an adjusting tool.
· Brake lights in the back of the mounts with a wiring loom
The price of the kit is $2960.00.
Additional Details and Photos posted on:
https://rennlist.com/forums/991-gt3/...l#post11887328