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I would agree that this feels more like a BAT car than a C&B car, but most enthusiasts are likely checking all forums. We all know that the hardcore folks are checking BAT more than any other auction sites.
2 years ago I would have said this was a $200k car. it will be interesting where this winds up now. 175?
You guys were right - didn't do so well. $155, RNM - says it was sold after but does not disclose the price.
I don't see either of those cars being worth more than they brought. Both had 4/92 build dates making them early production 718 coded to become 93MY cars. Both have signs of paintwork. I suspect the black car has TMU with more upgrades and needs to be looked into closer. Paint looks off to my eye. Not enough undercarriage and needed photos. Also since it is early it could be factory but the RSA's were the first to receive the smooth paint under the front hood. The red car seems to have it but the black car is definitely crinkle. These might have brought a bit more a few years ago but not in there current condition. The RS is the car of choice these days so I suspect that the RSA will drop a little because of it.
I don't see either of those cars being worth more than they brought. Both had 4/92 build dates making them early production 718 coded to become 93MY cars. Both have signs of paintwork. I suspect the black car has TMU with more upgrades and needs to be looked into closer. Paint looks off to my eye. Not enough undercarriage and needed photos. Also since it is early it could be factory but the RSA's were the first to receive the smooth paint under the front hood. The red car seems to have it but the black car is definitely crinkle. These might have brought a bit more a few years ago but not in there current condition. The RS is the car of choice these days so I suspect that the RSA will drop a little because of it.
RS has been the car of choice for a couple years now. As always, many factors to consider. Was cars and bids really the best place for it?..probably not. Is the whole market seeing some adjustments...I resisted admitting it but it seems like it is to some degree.
As I see it COVID is over and those days came and went, however the right cars will continue to climb and the rest we shall see. I also find the buyer has become far more educated than at the beginning of the craziness. People aren't willing to blindly jump at car because it is an RSA or whatever. They seem to be a bit more selective than before. Like most everything today the direction of people in general is different than just 2 years ago and I think we are back to the winter slump and will see prices rise again come warmer weather. I am still seeing special cars sell for crazy money including a 3.2 cab full restored sell for over $200k recently. I also find that if you are spending over $200k there is so much to choose from and people are realizing that there are many great cars to be had for that much.
I'm going to post mine for sale in the next few weeks in case someone is interested. I'm aware it's going to take a certain type of buyer. It's a 91' with 140k miles ....complete respray, engine rebuild, interior refresh all done about 6k miles ago.
As I see it COVID is over and those days came and went, however the right cars will continue to climb and the rest we shall see. I also find the buyer has become far more educated than at the beginning of the craziness. People aren't willing to blindly jump at car because it is an RSA or whatever. They seem to be a bit more selective than before. Like most everything today the direction of people in general is different than just 2 years ago and I think we are back to the winter slump and will see prices rise again come warmer weather. I am still seeing special cars sell for crazy money including a 3.2 cab full restored sell for over $200k recently. I also find that if you are spending over $200k there is so much to choose from and people are realizing that there are many great cars to be had for that much.
Even the elite cars are taking a hit...bolstered for a long time due to the buyers who are able to afford them, being willing to pay more than the next guy. It's also the season, I'm sure...and politics...and... So many factors. Many sales are low at recent auctions but there sure are some odd ducks that still sell for a lot more than you would think.
Even the elite cars are taking a hit...bolstered for a long time due to the buyers who are able to afford them, being willing to pay more than the next guy. It's also the season, I'm sure...and politics...and... So many factors. Many sales are low at recent auctions but there sure are some odd ducks that still sell for a lot more than you would think.
No doubt times are changing. Right now I see mostly the quality of product IMO that is showing a slump in pricing. I keep hearing people say what a great example and I see just average with hidden issues or past. Or modded cars that everyone loves but isn't everyones taste that RNM. Most of what I see is selling for what I would expect because IMO that is all the car is worth prior to addressing its hidden needs. I don't see many sales recently although more odd ducks actually selling for a premium vs the majority of average cars which RNM lately. Give it till spring and lets see where things land. I don't think we have anything to worry about. If values drop which I doubt it doesn't make the car any less fun. Today I was contacted by 5 people starting 2025 off asking if I knew of any special cars. All were willing to pay market, or a premium for the right color or options. Sadly I have been too busy with other projects to focus on the market. I need to get my 917 finished. I haven't built a good model in along time. Very different than building the real thing. I built most all of these Pocher models when I was in my early teens. I forgot how poor the instructions (more like guide lines than instructions) were and what had to go into making these right. Lego is so much easier but I prefer this. I hope to have it done by the weekend. The ignition wiring is a royal PITA. I can do the work however my eyesight isn't what it used to be and getting everything correct is harder now that I am in my waning years. Time to pull out the magnifier.
Only half done with the engine and I figure it took 6 hours 3 for the wiring. The subframe should be interesting.
Haven’t really been followed as closely the market for 964’s. Glance at the cars I see, but not closely examining them. No cars lately have really blown me away. The wave of RS’s on BaT have kinda passed me by and all run in together at this point. Most look to be cleaned up retired track rats. The Turbo’s seem to be pulling strong and unlike the other variants over the last couple years have gone up. Though it’s hard to say where anything in particular is as the quality of cars is all over the place and the spread between them is enormous. For a Turbo or RS some cars can be double of others because of condition, mileage, spec, etc. If there’s a wave of bad cars then it’s easy to say the market is dropping. Then when a top quality one comes up it blows the others away.
Haven’t really been followed as closely the market for 964’s. Glance at the cars I see, but not closely examining them. No cars lately have really blown me away. The wave of RS’s on BaT have kinda passed me by and all run in together at this point. Most look to be cleaned up retired track rats. The Turbo’s seem to be pulling strong and unlike the other variants over the last couple years have gone up. Though it’s hard to say where anything in particular is as the quality of cars is all over the place and the spread between them is enormous. For a Turbo or RS some cars can be double of others because of condition, mileage, spec, etc. If there’s a wave of bad cars then it’s easy to say the market is dropping. Then when a top quality one comes up it blows the others away.
All relative. Even you stated that you haven't really been paying attention or following closely but go on to say that they are mostly track rats and that the difference in quality is enormous - but the Turbos are going up. I feel like not many of us are looking at this using actual data; rather we are a little tired after these last years and perhaps taking a lazy guess at the market based somewhat on our personal preferences.
I still look at many cars for many people but no where near as many as before. Although my smaller database is because now I just don't bother looking at cars i know are going to be the same old same old POS disguised as a nice car. Very few I am willing to waste my time looking over.
The separation between quality and average is stretching. Nathan has a gorgeous 89 930 on BaT Closing soon. If that car doesn't do well then maybe something is happening but I think it is the time of the season as I watch the snow fall.
I still look at many cars for many people but no where near as many as before. Although my smaller database is because now I just don't bother looking at cars i know are going to be the same old same old POS disguised as a nice car. Very few I am willing to waste my time looking over.
The separation between quality and average is stretching. Nathan has a gorgeous 89 930 on BaT Closing soon. If that car doesn't do well then maybe something is happening but I think it is the time of the season as I watch the snow fall.
I guess my thing is - You can't compare average or even above average cars and the people with the budget/desire to purchase those car vs top tier, concours ones where the average buyer has basically an unlimited car budget. Two different markets, really.
All relative. Even you stated that you haven't really been paying attention or following closely but go on to say that they are mostly track rats and that the difference in quality is enormous - but the Turbos are going up. I feel like not many of us are looking at this using actual data; rather we are a little tired after these last years and perhaps taking a lazy guess at the market based somewhat on our personal preferences.
I look at them, but really haven’t examined them as closely as I’m busy with other stuff at the moment. See how things are at the round of auctions in the next few months which are at Scottsdale and Amelia. Though they aren’t quite as important as they used to be because of platforms like BaT and Scottsdale seems to have been scaled down in recent years. The cars at these live venues however are usually of better quality than what you’d normally get on BaT. Some multi million dollar cars which wouldn’t sell on online auctions in the first place.
Originally Posted by cobalt
I still look at many cars for many people but no where near as many as before. Although my smaller database is because now I just don't bother looking at cars i know are going to be the same old same old POS disguised as a nice car. Very few I am willing to waste my time looking over.
The separation between quality and average is stretching. Nathan has a gorgeous 89 930 on BaT Closing soon. If that car doesn't do well then maybe something is happening but I think it is the time of the season as I watch the snow fall.
Was interested in the car as you know. Decided to pass on this Turbo as my friend talked me out of it saying they aren’t as fun on the roads where I am because of the lag. Also have other cars on my radar that I’m more interested in. The car went for $315k pretty much what Nathan would’ve taken before the auction. Actually was a little bit less than the result.
Wonder if this is the same car as the one in the video. Sold through Bond Group a couple years ago to a user on here. At the time had 13k km and if it is the same car now has 24k km. Same Matter roll bar and strut brace. Only thing that’s different is the RS center caps which one of these wouldn’t have come with. The car in the video has the correct center caps.
I guess my thing is - You can't compare average or even above average cars and the people with the budget/desire to purchase those car vs top tier, concours ones where the average buyer has basically an unlimited car budget. Two different markets, really.
I look at each car as an individual and I start with a 300 point #1 condition car and deduct from there. After helping countless buyers over the last decade I can assure you there are no two buyers alike. Everyone has their one preconceived notion of what they should get for their money. Some are easily parted with it and others can't see a good deal if it slapped them in the face.
Originally Posted by RapidGT
I look at them, but really haven’t examined them as closely as I’m busy with other stuff at the moment. See how things are at the round of auctions in the next few months which are at Scottsdale and Amelia. Though they aren’t quite as important as they used to be because of platforms like BaT and Scottsdale seems to have been scaled down in recent years. The cars at these live venues however are usually of better quality than what you’d normally get on BaT. Some multi million dollar cars which wouldn’t sell on online auctions in the first place.
Was interested in the car as you know. Decided to pass on this Turbo as my friend talked me out of it saying they aren’t as fun on the roads where I am because of the lag. Also have other cars on my radar that I’m more interested in. The car went for $315k pretty much what Nathan would’ve taken before the auction. Actually was a little bit less than the result.
I see more private and small boutique store sales lately than anything. Private sales are bigger now than ever and I am seeing some stellar cars being sold for crazy money. I find very few basic cars are worth looking at anymore. Most are being bought up for conversions and off road 4x4's. I sold my 18 Macan a few weeks back for decent money through a boutique store. Sold in 3 days and I got over market. I think we are just seeing the world settle back into its old routine.
To me it is winter. I have 2 cars I am slowly working on and a model that is taking longer than an engine build. So my focus is on getting ready for spring. Everyone I know seems to be in the same mindset.
I would have pulled the trigger on the turbo. It was a rare beauty. I tried to post on BaT but they won't allow me but Nathan's info was correct as usual.
Off topic but making progress on my winter project. LOL
So much time I spent on details that you don't see but having fun with something other than a real car for the first time since COVID.
I haven't built a good model in along time. Very different than building the real thing. I built most all of these Pocher models when I was in my early teens. I forgot how poor the instructions (more like guide lines than instructions) were and what had to go into making these right. Lego is so much easier but I prefer this. I hope to have it done by the weekend. The ignition wiring is a royal PITA. I can do the work however my eyesight isn't what it used to be and getting everything correct is harder now that I am in my waning years. Time to pull out the magnifier.
