Garmin Automated Coaching
01-06-2021, 08:46 PM
#691
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The real time coaching feedback is based on THAT SESSION ONLY.
But, you can do go to Session Review and select voice coaching to focus on specific objectives revealed as the greatest potential improvements. That is a REALLY good tool.
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-Peter Krause
www.peterkrause.net
www.gofasternow.com
"Combining the Art and Science of Driving Fast!"
Specializing in Professional, Private Driver Performance Evaluation and Optimization
Consultation Available Remotely and at VIRginia International Raceway
-Peter Krause
www.peterkrause.net
www.gofasternow.com
"Combining the Art and Science of Driving Fast!"
Specializing in Professional, Private Driver Performance Evaluation and Optimization
Consultation Available Remotely and at VIRginia International Raceway
01-07-2021, 12:38 PM
#693
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A friend at Garmin lent me one of their test units to use at recent race weekend. I see the immense value of what this thing can provide. Especially for the DE driver. My feelings are identical to LV. Mounting the unit in an area that was not obstructive of direct view meant that it would take my eyes away from the view and easily could drift off line. I also do not like radio chatter and felt the live voice command to be distracting when trying to manage a race car such as GT3 Cup.
The unit did provide excellent feedback and I can see a definite benefit in having one in a race car, I think it just wasn't for me. I don't know, I guess Im just one of the old farts that prefers the rotary dial bag phones I found that I made my best gains at any track by reviewing data/video with a coach and going through briefing the tasks at hand before track, debriefing the tasks executed or not executed, then explaining/teaching, and repeat. The lessons I learned by instruction, then trial and error seemed to ingrain the technique/skill so that I can use those same lessons at the next track. It felt better than having an artificial voice say go faster into the turn. It was annoying and I just couldn't "open my mind" as Peter mentioned. Therein was the problem for me. I literally was in an argument with her on track. Im in the car to get a break from my regular world, yet found myself arguing with this artificial woman in my race car. Granted, I could buy 5 of these things for the price of weekend race coaching. But, there is something "real" I gain from the experience of coaching. The Garmin felt so un-natural and artificial. I can see it making me faster quicker, but I just did find it a good method for my goals with this hobby. Does that make sense? Im not going pro. I just want to go faster and learn how to feel the car at the edge. Getting pro coaching and reviewing data/video is fun, and for me, there is no other substitute. If a coach wasn't in the picture, then I think it could provide useful outside of the car and paralleled with data/video from the car.
The unit did provide excellent feedback and I can see a definite benefit in having one in a race car, I think it just wasn't for me. I don't know, I guess Im just one of the old farts that prefers the rotary dial bag phones I found that I made my best gains at any track by reviewing data/video with a coach and going through briefing the tasks at hand before track, debriefing the tasks executed or not executed, then explaining/teaching, and repeat. The lessons I learned by instruction, then trial and error seemed to ingrain the technique/skill so that I can use those same lessons at the next track. It felt better than having an artificial voice say go faster into the turn. It was annoying and I just couldn't "open my mind" as Peter mentioned. Therein was the problem for me. I literally was in an argument with her on track. Im in the car to get a break from my regular world, yet found myself arguing with this artificial woman in my race car. Granted, I could buy 5 of these things for the price of weekend race coaching. But, there is something "real" I gain from the experience of coaching. The Garmin felt so un-natural and artificial. I can see it making me faster quicker, but I just did find it a good method for my goals with this hobby. Does that make sense? Im not going pro. I just want to go faster and learn how to feel the car at the edge. Getting pro coaching and reviewing data/video is fun, and for me, there is no other substitute. If a coach wasn't in the picture, then I think it could provide useful outside of the car and paralleled with data/video from the car.
The Catalyst will work great for some folks. The Apex for others. Other people want more data and then it's AiM or MoTeC, or even the few Race Technology stalwarts. For others it's just video. If you don't try things out you don't learn and advance.
01-08-2021, 07:28 AM
#694
Back at Sebring this weekend with the Garmin, I am looking forward to seeing how much I can learn with the unit and it will be used in a new car for the first time.
01-08-2021, 07:34 AM
#695
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Have fun, but don't listen to the coach, or you'll end up in the wall at turn 1, where the coach keeps telling you to track out further, as you are barely hanging onto the outside rumble strips!
Last edited by WP0; 01-08-2021 at 07:35 AM. Reason: sp.
01-08-2021, 09:29 AM
#696
This time round I am hoping for improvements.
01-08-2021, 10:59 AM
#697
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The driver drives the car, the coach doesn’t.
I am am assuming you are using the Advanced Coaching option under Audio choices? You should be.
I am am assuming you are using the Advanced Coaching option under Audio choices? You should be.
01-09-2021, 12:28 PM
#699
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I recently used mine at Sebring and did not have that experience in T1. No mention of track limits there. But interestingly, it told me to track out further in T15 which I thought was strange as I have MANY, MANY laps here with many top coaches and this never came up. I tried it and it worked! In essence it forced me to think less about setting up for the second half of the combination corner between 15 and 16 and instead release the brake sooner and simply carry speed all the way to track edge. Improvement confirmed with "your best" in my ear in the following laps.
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DHI (01-09-2021)
01-09-2021, 02:47 PM
#700
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Beautiful example of "opening your mind," and one of the reasons why even some of the best coaches tend to repeat conventional wisdom rather than focusing on optimizing individual performance...
01-10-2021, 05:06 PM
#703
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That depends entirely on the Region hosting the DE. Not a National issue, AFAIK.
I have not experienced an restrictions myself, attending more than two dozen different PCA regions holding events since the device was introduced mid-September last year. Granted, my experience is with advanced solo or instructors running the Garmin Catalyst, but I don't travel much, anymore.
I can see potential with two concerns I've heard for scruts and tech folks to cast a dark eye.
One is the on-screen display showing a lap time, even if it's one of the smallest measures displayed in the corner of the screen. The major measure is a plus/minus (better or worse) and the color (red/green) than your previous best performance. I have addressed this before, but the display of a lap time in the car is not "public," cannot be compared to others and is NO different than the information that Porsche Precision Track App or Sport Chrono has displayed for more than ten years! Not "timing," per se. Merely a SELF GENERATED performance measure.
The other is the suction cup mount, but since the included suction cup mount is large, has a positive locking mechanism and is comparable and compatible with the well-regarded RAM 1" B-ball mount hardware allowed in most Regions, no one I know has specifically made a complaint or registered a concern about the Catalyst mounting hardware, even in a race car.
Me? I've not run into any of several of the finest DE programs PCA Regions run who have an issue, as long as the behavior of the driver is as expected and required. Nothing, with regard to the Catalyst. I use the Catalyst, just as I use many, many other systems, as aids to the private coaching i provide, and no one I've worked with has registered or heard of a concern.
But, I have heard of Regions in the hinterlands repeating the two concerns I mentioned and registered objections to many, many years ago.
Fortunately, most all the folks and Regions I work with are at the leading edge of instruction, recognizing that adults driving their cars can make the decision on their own on the inclusion (or not) of tools that will help them improve, in the car and on the track.
I have not experienced an restrictions myself, attending more than two dozen different PCA regions holding events since the device was introduced mid-September last year. Granted, my experience is with advanced solo or instructors running the Garmin Catalyst, but I don't travel much, anymore.
I can see potential with two concerns I've heard for scruts and tech folks to cast a dark eye.
One is the on-screen display showing a lap time, even if it's one of the smallest measures displayed in the corner of the screen. The major measure is a plus/minus (better or worse) and the color (red/green) than your previous best performance. I have addressed this before, but the display of a lap time in the car is not "public," cannot be compared to others and is NO different than the information that Porsche Precision Track App or Sport Chrono has displayed for more than ten years! Not "timing," per se. Merely a SELF GENERATED performance measure.
The other is the suction cup mount, but since the included suction cup mount is large, has a positive locking mechanism and is comparable and compatible with the well-regarded RAM 1" B-ball mount hardware allowed in most Regions, no one I know has specifically made a complaint or registered a concern about the Catalyst mounting hardware, even in a race car.
Me? I've not run into any of several of the finest DE programs PCA Regions run who have an issue, as long as the behavior of the driver is as expected and required. Nothing, with regard to the Catalyst. I use the Catalyst, just as I use many, many other systems, as aids to the private coaching i provide, and no one I've worked with has registered or heard of a concern.
But, I have heard of Regions in the hinterlands repeating the two concerns I mentioned and registered objections to many, many years ago.
Fortunately, most all the folks and Regions I work with are at the leading edge of instruction, recognizing that adults driving their cars can make the decision on their own on the inclusion (or not) of tools that will help them improve, in the car and on the track.
01-10-2021, 05:26 PM
#704
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That depends entirely on the Region hosting the DE. Not a National issue, AFAIK.
I have not experienced an restrictions myself, attending more than two dozen different PCA regions holding events since the device was introduced mid-September last year. Granted, my experience is with advanced solo or instructors running the Garmin Catalyst, but I don't travel much, anymore.
I can see potential with two concerns I've heard for scruts and tech folks to cast a dark eye.
One is the on-screen display showing a lap time, even if it's one of the smallest measures displayed in the corner of the screen. The major measure is a plus/minus (better or worse) and the color (red/green) than your previous best performance. I have addressed this before, but the display of a lap time in the car is not "public," cannot be compared to others and is NO different than the information that Porsche Precision Track App or Sport Chrono has displayed for more than ten years! Not "timing," per se. Merely a SELF GENERATED performance measure.
The other is the suction cup mount, but since the included suction cup mount is large, has a positive locking mechanism and is comparable and compatible with the well-regarded RAM 1" B-ball mount hardware allowed in most Regions, no one I know has specifically made a complaint or registered a concern about the Catalyst mounting hardware, even in a race car.
Me? I've not run into any of several of the finest DE programs PCA Regions run who have an issue, as long as the behavior of the driver is as expected and required. Nothing, with regard to the Catalyst. I use the Catalyst, just as I use many, many other systems, as aids to the private coaching i provide, and no one I've worked with has registered or heard of a concern.
But, I have heard of Regions in the hinterlands repeating the two concerns I mentioned and registered objections to many, many years ago.
Fortunately, most all the folks and Regions I work with are at the leading edge of instruction, recognizing that adults driving their cars can make the decision on their own on the inclusion (or not) of tools that will help them improve, in the car and on the track.
I have not experienced an restrictions myself, attending more than two dozen different PCA regions holding events since the device was introduced mid-September last year. Granted, my experience is with advanced solo or instructors running the Garmin Catalyst, but I don't travel much, anymore.
I can see potential with two concerns I've heard for scruts and tech folks to cast a dark eye.
One is the on-screen display showing a lap time, even if it's one of the smallest measures displayed in the corner of the screen. The major measure is a plus/minus (better or worse) and the color (red/green) than your previous best performance. I have addressed this before, but the display of a lap time in the car is not "public," cannot be compared to others and is NO different than the information that Porsche Precision Track App or Sport Chrono has displayed for more than ten years! Not "timing," per se. Merely a SELF GENERATED performance measure.
The other is the suction cup mount, but since the included suction cup mount is large, has a positive locking mechanism and is comparable and compatible with the well-regarded RAM 1" B-ball mount hardware allowed in most Regions, no one I know has specifically made a complaint or registered a concern about the Catalyst mounting hardware, even in a race car.
Me? I've not run into any of several of the finest DE programs PCA Regions run who have an issue, as long as the behavior of the driver is as expected and required. Nothing, with regard to the Catalyst. I use the Catalyst, just as I use many, many other systems, as aids to the private coaching i provide, and no one I've worked with has registered or heard of a concern.
But, I have heard of Regions in the hinterlands repeating the two concerns I mentioned and registered objections to many, many years ago.
Fortunately, most all the folks and Regions I work with are at the leading edge of instruction, recognizing that adults driving their cars can make the decision on their own on the inclusion (or not) of tools that will help them improve, in the car and on the track.
Thank-you for your usual prompt and well-articulated response Peter !!
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ProCoach (01-10-2021)
01-10-2021, 05:34 PM
#705
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I will say that the latest, if not imminent, Garmin Catalyst update has the potential to turn off the on-screen lap time readout, with just a touch of the screen. The AiM Solo/Solo 2 and the VBOX OLED have that capability now.
Thank you for your kind words, @DHI! See you at the track!
Thank you for your kind words, @DHI! See you at the track!