billyg

J, yep, here's hoping for a trade in program with the value set at a much higher price for the ugly beast that was once a sexy catch. Hey, if the compensation isn't there for whatever reason then I'll jump ship and I won't be the only one. The brand to some like me is tarnished.

skiahh

Valid point. However, until just the last couple of days, the whole question of whether there will be a fix in the near future has been a big sucking black hole. Hell, for all we know, it still is and we're just hearing internet rumors that aren't true.

But until dealers know for sure, why would they put money out on inventory they can't resell?

I haven't heard anyone even speculating on what Porsche is doing for dealers stuck with new CDs. Have they stopped requiring plan payments? Have they forgiven interest payments? Have they promised to make them whole once the selling ban is lifted? And that's for new units!

Has PCNA even considered the impact of the stop sale of used units? The trade in impact, the ripple effect of people who may have wanted to trade up from their CD to something else or a new CD?

I have to think that somewhere, some business analyst team is working on all of this, but obviously, none of us (including our dealers, apparently) are privy to any of it!

mdrobc1213

Brand may be tarnished a tad bit but I think the diesel engine as a whole will cause the most issue and loss here. Folks will look at the diesel Cayenne's and VW Touregs and Audi's as somewhat tarnished based on what has occurred and price them accordingly meaning a loss in valuation when at some point these cars are traded for newer models no matter what the brand chosen by the owner. Yes I know some folks say we'll keep our CD forever and they love their Cayenne diesels...and that is great..we love our Cayenne v6 too which we got instead of our unobtainable 2016 CD...but honestly at some point these folks will also look for a newer car/vehicle and at this point they can just hope that trade values and perceptions have rebounded by then. So far even at this point other than the fix VW/Porsche has done nothing to address this aspect of the "fix" for these cars as the last few posts suggest. There's a reason they're agreeing to buy back to 2.0L diesels and its probably due to the final acknowledgement that they just can't make these folks totally whole with respect to their cars.

visitador

I have already seen potential buyers (in this and other forums) trying to scoop a good buy.

I know some of us will never trade their CDs and use them till kingdom come and any loss of value is unimportant. But for the rest of us who are thinking of trading/selling them for something else, we'll take a higher hit in resale value than otherwise.

So? Well, I know some of us hate even hearing the word "attorney." But the EPA/CARB has them representing the government's interest (which may not align with ours). VW/POA/Audi has their own interests to defend. The 2.0 engine owners have their own interests. We have our own.

Short of stepping out of the class action lawsuit, I would suggest contacting one of the lead plaintiff attorneys in the class action to express our concerns. At least make them work a bit for the amount of $$$ that they'll get in attorney fees.

skiahh

Class action lawsuits benefit only the attorneys. The piddly amount each class member gets may as well be nothing, in the end.

If I am co-opted into a class, I'll immediately exclude myself and, if necessary, pursue my own legal action.

As far as trades go, if people are planning on keeping CDs, that will keep them off the market, making those that remain, that much more valuable in the secondary market, I would think. People still want these vehicles. Some may be interested now because they think there is blood in the water and they can steal one (and maybe they can, right now), but in the long run, I don't think that'll be the case once the fix is developed (barring any performance or efficiency hits).

visitador

In the current news cycle, the leaked info. is that the solution is software fix + new catalytic converter (if necessary) + some form of compensation. The issue that we are all interested is what form of compensation. Anyone can opt out of the class but unless you are an attorney with your own billable hours, good luck trying to find one to pursue your own case on a contingency basis.

What I am trying to say is that we can influence the "some form of compensation" part by posting here or emailing those attorneys what we think would be fair compensation.

deilenberger

I'd generally agree with that assessment - but those of us who were included in the 955 plastic cooling pipes Class-Action did get more then piddly. It wasn't a huge amount - but $500 isn't going to be tossed away - especially since going after Porsche for a $2,000 claim individually just isn't going to happen. Some people were fully compensated - others less - depends on your warranty status and who did the work. Admittedly - the attorneys made the bulk of the settlement - something like $35,000,000.

sclemmons

There is an amazing number of new 2015-2016 Cayenne Diesels on Cars.com. Are those cars that are awaiting sale or no longer available?

mdrobc1213

Likely dealers trying to finally clear residual inventory and recouped some of their losses. Many had lots of vehicle sitting in lots and at port they couldn't sell and we're not very happy! All too financial hits!

Who knows...I think anyone buying one now is taking a risk. No one knows what the future entails and what the residual values will do. For now the diesels are NOT being included in any MY17 or I hear MY18 plans for vehicles planned for entry into the US across the board. They may never truly recover here in the US for perceptions reasons which the scandal didn't help any. So buying one is an risk just hope buyers are properly informed!

Interesting late take on the spectrum of issues caused by the scandal
http://www.thecarconnection.com/news...in-455-million

Searcher356

I don't think dealers can liquidate any inventory of NEW CDs. Some mega-dealers have tried titling demos with enough miles in another Brand of their group, but they have been caught and stopped, too. So several have just made all of their diesel inventory into their loaner fleet. It didn't work to move them from "demo" into "used" status to avoid the stop sale, either - they were stopped. A friend just had his purchase of a '16 Demo stopped last month.
Taking CDs on trade shouldn't be a problem for them if the unit was sold before the Stop order, and in some markets the diesels appear to be bringing a premium due to the shortage. Don't know if that is true, or will continue to hold.
We bought a 2015 Lease Return, and everybody thinks that it should pass all sniff tests, but we'll see. We haven't seen the title yet, and our first temporary tag has been extended, so there seems to be a bit of a SNAFU. It was leased thru Porsche Finance, so that may be a complicating factor.
We'll just have to see!
CARB is holding us all - dealers, factory and drivers - hostage, and they are loving it. Now if they would just get out of the way we'd be able to get some closure.

chsu74

I made an offer on a 15 CD with 14K miles for $18K under list and was refused. They wanted $14K under list..

alexaqui

^^^ This is the real impact those of us who considered dumping our cars are facing. This is a significant impact on the value of the car.

The only redeeming thing in all of this is that the car itself is incredible and reliable (so far). It makes owning it longer not really that bad. Given Porsche's complete and utter lack of ANY form of communication and their elitist approach to their limited edition cars, I am sure they are going to make us pound sand for cash. In the end, given the "let's turn Porsche into BMW of 15 years ago" approach of VW, I'm sure they don't care about us.

skiahh

Maybe I'm missing something here, but the "^^^This" is a positive sign for value.

It's a used (CPO, likely) car with 14K miles that the dealer held out for $4K MORE than the offer.

I'm not sure what would be normal for a 1 year old car with 14K miles, but $14K below MSRP doesn't sound like it's out of line to me.

visitador

I wonder what the lawyers discussed this morning.

[edit: looks like the same. Judge saying substantial progress reached and 3.0 engines undergoing testing of the "fix"? So, nothing has changed.]

gnat

Actually as skiahh pointed out, this is a good thing.

Right now is probably the best time to sell a CD if you refuse to get caught up in the hysteria since the majority of "available" cars are locked up at Porsche dealers with PCNA refusing to let them be sold. So right now the availability is artificially low.

Once PCNA releases the stop sale is when we'll see values tank for awhile as there is a flood of options on the market which will take some time to sell. I expect to see some crazy deals on essentially new CDs when the cork pops as the dealers are going to be wanting to staunch the bleeding as fast as they can. The simple fact is that baring any help from PCNA dealers are under water on all CDs in their name at this point. Even if they could sell at full list they'll be losing money, so I fully expect them to trade cash for a quick sale.