The Bad News piles up about the new Turbo
11-02-2009 | 10:14 AM
#61
Rennlist Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,571
Likes: 24
From: Regretfully not at a track... :(
The horsepower claims that people modding the M64 make are irrelevant. If you are looking for raw horsepower then you should be looking at a Corvettte.
The only question we should be asking is: does the new generation car outperform the old? So far everything I have seen suggests that the DFI engine is an improvement on the M64, performance wise.
The only question we should be asking is: does the new generation car outperform the old? So far everything I have seen suggests that the DFI engine is an improvement on the M64, performance wise.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YN7v6edJug
The link above is an example of what an M64 can be tuned to do- 0-300km/h in 18.1sec.... Try keeping up in a 2010 TT or corvette pos for that matter... Better yet, try tuning a new TT to these levels... Then come back and talk something other than the marketing **** they want you to believe.... Ever stopped to wonder why these new engines still aren't in the motorsport cars if they SO MUCH BETTER. They just released a new cup car. It ain't got one
Yet these engines are good enough for some test rig devised by Porsche to show us how good they are. Why simulate the track when you can just go to the track and run endless laps to prove the point like in a race car?Personally, I envy those who got their hands on the last of the 997.1TT. My opinion will only change when the new engine has been around for a few years out of warranty and is still running without incident for its owners... Proof will be in the pudding. Enjoy
Last edited by 911rox; 11-02-2009 at 10:44 AM.
11-02-2009 | 10:35 AM
#62
Rennlist Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,571
Likes: 24
From: Regretfully not at a track... :(
11-02-2009 | 01:18 PM
#63
Advanced
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 60
Likes: 0
I have a feeling these days Porsche only cares about getting these engines thru the warranty period; after that they don't care.
In fact they're probably willing to take their chances and replace more than a few "major malfunctions" under warranty as cost effective in the overall financial picture of the "cheaper-to-build" engine.
My guess: Massive HP/Tq of turbo engine using the new "consumer grade" NA engine as a base just means long term trouble.
IOW, The end of GT1 engine is not without consequences; possibly the end of "Turbo" meaning "sturdy" in Porschephile language.
11-02-2009 | 02:44 PM
#64
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 909
Likes: 0
From: NY
Obviously it would seem that it needs to be spelt out for you genius so here it goes... For 40+ years Porsche have given us incremental increases in power and subsequently in performance... Did you really expect differently this time regardless of the engine being used?? How would they sell the new car if it went slower?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YN7v6edJug
The link above is an example of what an M64 can be tuned to do- 0-300km/h in 18.1sec.... Try keeping up in a 2010 TT or corvette pos for that matter... Better yet, try tuning a new TT to these levels... Then come back and talk something other than the marketing **** they want you to believe.... Ever stopped to wonder why these new engines still aren't in the motorsport cars if they SO MUCH BETTER. They just released a new cup car. It ain't got one Yet these engines are good enough for some test rig devised by Porsche to show us how good they are. Why simulate the track when you can just go to the track and run endless laps to prove the point like in a race car?
Personally, I envy those who got their hands on the last of the 997.1TT. My opinion will only change when the new engine has been around for a few years out of warranty and is still running without incident for its owners... Proof will be in the pudding. Enjoy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YN7v6edJug
The link above is an example of what an M64 can be tuned to do- 0-300km/h in 18.1sec.... Try keeping up in a 2010 TT or corvette pos for that matter... Better yet, try tuning a new TT to these levels... Then come back and talk something other than the marketing **** they want you to believe.... Ever stopped to wonder why these new engines still aren't in the motorsport cars if they SO MUCH BETTER. They just released a new cup car. It ain't got one
Yet these engines are good enough for some test rig devised by Porsche to show us how good they are. Why simulate the track when you can just go to the track and run endless laps to prove the point like in a race car?Personally, I envy those who got their hands on the last of the 997.1TT. My opinion will only change when the new engine has been around for a few years out of warranty and is still running without incident for its owners... Proof will be in the pudding. Enjoy
This Mustang flys and alot of support from aftermaret
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tan0ceLUDpM
The 638hp stock Vette was the fastest at Nurburgring so have to give it some credit at least the factory isnt afraid to give the public some real horsepower for the money.
Now if talking videos lets be fair and show some of the other cars making serious horsepower when going with aftermarket parts.
Corvette ZR1 has the record at Nurburgring
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5gyUCOD-tc
Wild sounding corvette drags 8second 1/4mile
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gL2su...eature=related
On the new 997TT noone has even gave it a chance for tuners to look at it.
On drag times.com there are alot of really modifed 911 turbo running low to mid 6's on the 1/8th mile.
Lower part of the page is the lower hp kits 650 or 700 and the ET's are about the same as the new 2010 911
http://www.dragtimes.com/compare2.ph...ame=Compare%21
2nd page gets more into the 650hp to 700hp kits and they run close to the new 911.
Alot of the 650hp or even the 700hp kits the cars are running close to or same as the new stock 2010 997 in 1/8th mile.Its not the horsepower always that matters it is when the power and torque comes in.
Reading more about those cars the power comes in later so the ET isnt as low.The new 911 power comes in early for a more faster streetable car when stock.
Why would other Porsche owners want too put down the new 911 before it even gets a chance to be tested and see what aftermarket tuners can do with it and also comparing stock to stock also the new car is just plain faster.
Last edited by inactiveuser1; 11-02-2009 at 03:25 PM.
11-02-2009 | 03:33 PM
#65
Drifting
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,199
Likes: 0
From: Houston, Texas
I am surprised at you guys. Especially Toby. Toby has more knowledge about turbo cars than anyone, and thusly the GT1 motor. I have owned 3 GT1 dry sump motors and the cars they were in. I now have the new 09C2S with PDK. The new 9A1 motor is MUCH improved over the cheap 996 motor. The 9A1 motor is the basis on which all the new platforms coming from Porsche will be built. I didnt drink any kool aid with the 996. And I didnt buy this one without doing my due dilegence and researched the hell out of the motor(I am a scientist by trade). The videos on this page demonstrate that the new 9A1 is more than capable under duress . And really the old 996 motor was more than adequate for track work in the context of our basic driving skills that we amateurs possess. Really the point is dry sump or wet sump is can it pick up oil and get it to the motor, in adverse conditions. The video and other documentation that I have read show that to be true. Also the 9A1 is strong enough in stock form to basically do a turbo conversion with out having to change internals for the new TT. That makes it good for everyone. The 9A1 has 40% less parts and has a much lower center of gravity, and its lighter. My C2s Is faster with PDK than the 996 TT. I dont mind you guys arguing Old School but this new motor has alot of lessons learned engineered into it. The old GT1 motor is a GREAT motor and will go down in the annals of Porsche as one of its greatest achievements but dont disparage the new motor because its different. But technology moves on. Before my back surgery I sold my GT3 with much regret because I couldnt get in and out of it. But after the surgery, I was itching to get back my Porsche. I went to the dealer and drove a C2S PDK and was simply blown away. My goal was to get another GT3 or RS. I wanted to stick to the old GT1 motor too. But that all went out the window with this new car.
Remember I have had a 993TT, 996 GT3 and a 997 GT3. So for it to make a impact like that was pretty cool. This new motor coupled with the new PDK (another thing I was never going to get I AM A 6Speed guy!!!) is quite the weapon. The guys I hang around with on RL has always been the Track oriented GT3 guys and some of them are getting C2S to replace the GT3 on the track. This motor I believe is a giant step forward from the 996 NA motor. The GT1 motor was getting abit long in the tooth (see NASCAR) and it is time for Porsche to come up with a more modern sophisticated motor. I think they have done it.
Remember I have had a 993TT, 996 GT3 and a 997 GT3. So for it to make a impact like that was pretty cool. This new motor coupled with the new PDK (another thing I was never going to get I AM A 6Speed guy!!!) is quite the weapon. The guys I hang around with on RL has always been the Track oriented GT3 guys and some of them are getting C2S to replace the GT3 on the track. This motor I believe is a giant step forward from the 996 NA motor. The GT1 motor was getting abit long in the tooth (see NASCAR) and it is time for Porsche to come up with a more modern sophisticated motor. I think they have done it.
11-02-2009 | 03:44 PM
#66
Rennlist Member
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 2,285
Likes: 13
I like different cars not just Porsche.When it comes to GM or Ford with new superchargers they will run faster.Talk about modified Vettes or even Mustangs with new modified superchargers and the aftermarket parts these cars run fast.Mustangs are running 8's in the 1/4mile.
This Mustang flys and alot of support from aftermaret
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tan0ceLUDpM
The 638hp stock Vette was the fastest at Nurburgring so have to give it some credit at least the factory isnt afraid to give the public some real horsepower for the money.
Now if talking videos lets be fair and show some of the other cars making serious horsepower when going with aftermarket parts.
Corvette ZR1 has the record at Nurburgring
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5gyUCOD-tc
On the new 997TT noone has even gave it a chance for tuners to look at it.
On drag times.com there are alot of really modifed 911 turbo running low to mid 6's on the 1/8th mile.
Lower part of the page is the lower hp kits 650 or 700 and the ET's are about the same as the new 2010 911
http://www.dragtimes.com/compare2.ph...ame=Compare%21
2nd page gets more into the 650hp to 700hp kits and they run close to the new 911.
Alot of the 650hp or even the 700hp kits the cars are running close to or same as the new stock 2010 997 in 1/8th mile.Its not the horsepower always that matters it is when the power and torque comes in.
Reading more about those cars the power comes in later so the ET isnt as low.The new 911 power comes in early for a more faster streetable car when stock.
Why would other Porsche owners want too put down the new 911 before it even gets a chance to be tested and see what aftermarket tuners can do with it?
This Mustang flys and alot of support from aftermaret
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tan0ceLUDpM
The 638hp stock Vette was the fastest at Nurburgring so have to give it some credit at least the factory isnt afraid to give the public some real horsepower for the money.
Now if talking videos lets be fair and show some of the other cars making serious horsepower when going with aftermarket parts.
Corvette ZR1 has the record at Nurburgring
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5gyUCOD-tc
On the new 997TT noone has even gave it a chance for tuners to look at it.
On drag times.com there are alot of really modifed 911 turbo running low to mid 6's on the 1/8th mile.
Lower part of the page is the lower hp kits 650 or 700 and the ET's are about the same as the new 2010 911
http://www.dragtimes.com/compare2.ph...ame=Compare%21
2nd page gets more into the 650hp to 700hp kits and they run close to the new 911.
Alot of the 650hp or even the 700hp kits the cars are running close to or same as the new stock 2010 997 in 1/8th mile.Its not the horsepower always that matters it is when the power and torque comes in.
Reading more about those cars the power comes in later so the ET isnt as low.The new 911 power comes in early for a more faster streetable car when stock.
Why would other Porsche owners want too put down the new 911 before it even gets a chance to be tested and see what aftermarket tuners can do with it?
This is a philosophical discussion. I am on the side of lamenting the recent changes in Porsche's outlook though I know I should be accepting of it by now. It's been going the wrong direction since 1998.
11-02-2009 | 03:47 PM
#67
Rennlist Member
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 9,994
Likes: 494
From: 01776
It's thread like this that make me want to boycott the online forums. Then the reality hits that I am a forum addict.
Why do 'people' stir up trouble in threads like this? So called internet trolls are a peculiar type. I will never understand their motives much like I will never understand people that create computer viruses.
My guess is that the same people still enter into pissing contests with people in their circles about 0-60 times and feel the urge to race every boy-racer they see at stop lights.
The answers to these types of issues are always so obvious.
Is the next generation turbo 'faster?' Of course, this has always been the case. Always.
Do all 'enthusiasts' care about Porsche history? It is clear that many do not.
Is PDK faster? Duh! Of course it is. Is it for everyone? Of course not.
Which is better - iron or ceramic?
Which is better - GT-R or Z06 or TT?
Does mod X alter your warranty claims?
Which is better RWD or AWD?
My favorite: Is the 997.1 a POS now that the 997.2 is out?
All I can say is that there are a lot of people here that must make Porsche marketing very happy.
And to all the trolls out there reading this,.... suck it.
Why do 'people' stir up trouble in threads like this? So called internet trolls are a peculiar type. I will never understand their motives much like I will never understand people that create computer viruses.
My guess is that the same people still enter into pissing contests with people in their circles about 0-60 times and feel the urge to race every boy-racer they see at stop lights.
The answers to these types of issues are always so obvious.
Is the next generation turbo 'faster?' Of course, this has always been the case. Always.
Do all 'enthusiasts' care about Porsche history? It is clear that many do not.
Is PDK faster? Duh! Of course it is. Is it for everyone? Of course not.
Which is better - iron or ceramic?
Which is better - GT-R or Z06 or TT?
Does mod X alter your warranty claims?
Which is better RWD or AWD?
My favorite: Is the 997.1 a POS now that the 997.2 is out?
All I can say is that there are a lot of people here that must make Porsche marketing very happy.
And to all the trolls out there reading this,.... suck it.
11-02-2009 | 06:07 PM
#68
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 909
Likes: 0
From: NY
This is the kind of stuff that just perplexes me. All that info...so what? In the real world, I believe the 0- 100 km/hr and 1/8 mi times production cars do are absolutely meaningless...times on the 'ring as well. What limits our cars, no matter what we drive, are 1) our nerve to challenge posted speed limits on the street, and 2) like it or not, our abilities as drivers on the track. I bet fewer than 1% of us on this board, myself included, could come remotely close to maximizing the potential of a 2.5l base Boxster.
This is a philosophical discussion. I am on the side of lamenting the recent changes in Porsche's outlook though I know I should be accepting of it by now. It's been going the wrong direction since 1998.
This is a philosophical discussion. I am on the side of lamenting the recent changes in Porsche's outlook though I know I should be accepting of it by now. It's been going the wrong direction since 1998.
I take the motorcycle to the drags also and being in a car going 0-60mph in 3 seconds is nothing like holding on to a bike going 0-60 under 3 seconds so even those times are alittle boring,I would want more horsepower if they would make it!
11-02-2009 | 06:09 PM
#69
Instructor
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 153
Likes: 0
From: Europe
I thought the original post was provocative, and maybe the replies were predictable. But the answer is very simple.
If you want the latest and the best you will always be chasing the next model.
If you are content with your current, or older model, then you hold onto it.
However, I can't think of a single instance where a new model Porsche has not been better, overall, than the outgoing model. It's what Porsche do best - progressive evolution and step change improvements.
Porsche is, first and foremost, a business - they are competing at the leading edge of their market - their products sell because they are consistently and independently judged amongst the best in their classes.
No one is forcing the new model on anyone. Buyers will make their own choices in their own time.
But it does look like 'sour grapes' if owners of the old model are discrediting the new model before it is even in circulation, and without any substantive evidence.
Far better to reserve judgement and wait and see.
If you want the latest and the best you will always be chasing the next model.
If you are content with your current, or older model, then you hold onto it.
However, I can't think of a single instance where a new model Porsche has not been better, overall, than the outgoing model. It's what Porsche do best - progressive evolution and step change improvements.
Porsche is, first and foremost, a business - they are competing at the leading edge of their market - their products sell because they are consistently and independently judged amongst the best in their classes.
No one is forcing the new model on anyone. Buyers will make their own choices in their own time.
But it does look like 'sour grapes' if owners of the old model are discrediting the new model before it is even in circulation, and without any substantive evidence.
Far better to reserve judgement and wait and see.
11-02-2009 | 06:35 PM
#70
Rennlist Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,571
Likes: 24
From: Regretfully not at a track... :(
I like different cars not just Porsche.When it comes to GM or Ford with new superchargers they will run faster.Talk about modified Vettes or even Mustangs with new modified superchargers and the aftermarket parts these cars run fast.Mustangs are running 8's in the 1/4mile on pump gas.
This Mustang flys and alot of support from aftermaret
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tan0ceLUDpM
The 638hp stock Vette was the fastest at Nurburgring so have to give it some credit at least the factory isnt afraid to give the public some real horsepower for the money.
Now if talking videos lets be fair and show some of the other cars making serious horsepower when going with aftermarket parts.
Corvette ZR1 has the record at Nurburgring
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5gyUCOD-tc
Wild sounding corvette drags 8second 1/4mile
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gL2su...eature=related
On the new 997TT noone has even gave it a chance for tuners to look at it.
On drag times.com there are alot of really modifed 911 turbo running low to mid 6's on the 1/8th mile.
Lower part of the page is the lower hp kits 650 or 700 and the ET's are about the same as the new 2010 911
http://www.dragtimes.com/compare2.ph...ame=Compare%21
2nd page gets more into the 650hp to 700hp kits and they run close to the new 911.
Alot of the 650hp or even the 700hp kits the cars are running close to or same as the new stock 2010 997 in 1/8th mile.Its not the horsepower always that matters it is when the power and torque comes in.
Reading more about those cars the power comes in later so the ET isnt as low.The new 911 power comes in early for a more faster streetable car when stock.
Why would other Porsche owners want too put down the new 911 before it even gets a chance to be tested and see what aftermarket tuners can do with it and also comparing stock to stock also the new car is just plain faster.
This Mustang flys and alot of support from aftermaret
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tan0ceLUDpM
The 638hp stock Vette was the fastest at Nurburgring so have to give it some credit at least the factory isnt afraid to give the public some real horsepower for the money.
Now if talking videos lets be fair and show some of the other cars making serious horsepower when going with aftermarket parts.
Corvette ZR1 has the record at Nurburgring
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5gyUCOD-tc
Wild sounding corvette drags 8second 1/4mile
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gL2su...eature=related
On the new 997TT noone has even gave it a chance for tuners to look at it.
On drag times.com there are alot of really modifed 911 turbo running low to mid 6's on the 1/8th mile.
Lower part of the page is the lower hp kits 650 or 700 and the ET's are about the same as the new 2010 911
http://www.dragtimes.com/compare2.ph...ame=Compare%21
2nd page gets more into the 650hp to 700hp kits and they run close to the new 911.
Alot of the 650hp or even the 700hp kits the cars are running close to or same as the new stock 2010 997 in 1/8th mile.Its not the horsepower always that matters it is when the power and torque comes in.
Reading more about those cars the power comes in later so the ET isnt as low.The new 911 power comes in early for a more faster streetable car when stock.
Why would other Porsche owners want too put down the new 911 before it even gets a chance to be tested and see what aftermarket tuners can do with it and also comparing stock to stock also the new car is just plain faster.
Sure, others run 8sec 1/4 miles etc but they don't also have top speeds well in excess of 300km/h- gearing helps them achieve one and lets them down with the other. And furthermore, they are usually doing it with 8 or 10 cylinders and 7+ ltrs of capacity....
Also, I think you have it the wrong way around, its not a case of Porsche owners putting down the new TT. If you go back to the first post, it was a smart *** that was making inflammatory remarks about earlier generations of TT. My view is simply that for the sort of money people pay for these cars, the new one has some massive shoes to fill and will have to prove itself before many people will accept Porsche's claims...
11-02-2009 | 07:20 PM
#71
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 909
Likes: 0
From: NY
Not disputing the abilities of other manufacturers M928. Simply pointing out that you can take a 3.6lt M64 motor, double its power output and still have a reliable car that goes. As pointed out by a fellow poster, all sorts of rumours about reliability issues are doing the rounds from internal sources, just in tuning this new DFI motor further for GT2 models. Whilst we don't know how true this is, the suggestions alone aren't doing the new motor any favors...
Sure, others run 8sec 1/4 miles etc but they don't also have top speeds well in excess of 300km/h- gearing helps them achieve one and lets them down with the other. And furthermore, they are usually doing it with 8 or 10 cylinders and 7+ ltrs of capacity....
Also, I think you have it the wrong way around, its not a case of Porsche owners putting down the new TT. If you go back to the first post, it was a smart *** that was making inflammatory remarks about earlier generations of TT. My view is simply that for the sort of money people pay for these cars, the new one has some massive shoes to fill and will have to prove itself before many people will accept Porsche's claims...
Sure, others run 8sec 1/4 miles etc but they don't also have top speeds well in excess of 300km/h- gearing helps them achieve one and lets them down with the other. And furthermore, they are usually doing it with 8 or 10 cylinders and 7+ ltrs of capacity....
Also, I think you have it the wrong way around, its not a case of Porsche owners putting down the new TT. If you go back to the first post, it was a smart *** that was making inflammatory remarks about earlier generations of TT. My view is simply that for the sort of money people pay for these cars, the new one has some massive shoes to fill and will have to prove itself before many people will accept Porsche's claims...
That is true the 3.6 M64 motor has been reliable with high horsepower levels and hopefully the new motor will be as good with upgrades if not I can see then why guys would want to keep the 2009 and under.Even now 2007 and up for lets say 90k with maybe 6000 miles or more on them and spending 20k on a good 750hp or 800hp kit might be the way to go.I would have to sit back a year or so to see how the new car is then decide from there what will be best.
I see now where you guys are talking on the post, earlier TT even 996 put out some seriuos power with aftermarket kits as I have looked thru alot of post and drag times to me is interesting since I was into drag cars more and was surprised alot of guys do use the cars for drag use with the earlier 996TT and 997TT.
I was only using the other cars as examples that there will always be something faster no matter what we drive or how we build them thats all a part of racing and also good for competition or it would be boring.I don't looks at another brand as a POS etc as so many manufacturers have something interesting.Thats true the other cars are doing it with 8 or 10 cylinders and when it comes to horsepower per cubic inch or liter the Porsche motor is way up there.
What was interesting was now in the one article seeing Nissan pulling away from the launch control.Hopefully Porsche has theirs sorted out when released and stand behind it under warranty.
11-02-2009 | 11:23 PM
#72
Rennlist Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,571
Likes: 24
From: Regretfully not at a track... :(
Oh boolala, where are you??? No further facts or pearls of wisdom to share with us all??? Or are you busy researching the latest Porsche promotional literature for more FACTS....
11-03-2009 | 01:18 AM
#73
Pro
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 525
Likes: 7
From: Cotati, California
These technical discussions leave out matters of the heart. I was shopping for a new sports car in 1999 and could not bring myself to purchase a 996 - I just could not fall in love with it. When the 997 came around, I fell in love with Porsches again. So while the 996 might have been technically better than the 993, I did not think it was an improvement in matters of the heart. And I buy cars at least as much with my heart as with my brain.
11-03-2009 | 05:14 AM
#74
Instructor
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 104
Likes: 0
From: Los Angeles, CA
A lot of information floating around here (right and wrong). IMHO, you really need to drive a vehicle before you start forming opinions.
Although I don't spend a lot of time on Rennlist (I have over 4,000 posts on Pelican), I'm a current Turbo owner (a mere 930), and I race a Boxster Spec. This means I am a real automotive journalist who just happens to also be a Porsche owner (a rare breed). More importantly, I drove the new Turbo in Europe a couple weeks ago:
http://www.autoblog.com/2009/11/02/2...o-first-drive/
I'm not trying to alter any opinions with my story, but I have real seat time and several thick technical documents on the 997.5 Turbo sitting in front of me (thanks to Porsche). If anyone has any questions just ask... and please drive the car before you bash it!
- Mike
Although I don't spend a lot of time on Rennlist (I have over 4,000 posts on Pelican), I'm a current Turbo owner (a mere 930), and I race a Boxster Spec. This means I am a real automotive journalist who just happens to also be a Porsche owner (a rare breed). More importantly, I drove the new Turbo in Europe a couple weeks ago:
http://www.autoblog.com/2009/11/02/2...o-first-drive/
I'm not trying to alter any opinions with my story, but I have real seat time and several thick technical documents on the 997.5 Turbo sitting in front of me (thanks to Porsche). If anyone has any questions just ask... and please drive the car before you bash it!
- Mike
11-03-2009 | 09:27 AM
#75
Rennlist Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,571
Likes: 24
From: Regretfully not at a track... :(
A lot of information floating around here (right and wrong). IMHO, you really need to drive a vehicle before you start forming opinions.
Although I don't spend a lot of time on Rennlist (I have over 4,000 posts on Pelican), I'm a current Turbo owner (a mere 930), and I race a Boxster Spec. This means I am a real automotive journalist who just happens to also be a Porsche owner (a rare breed). More importantly, I drove the new Turbo in Europe a couple weeks ago:
http://www.autoblog.com/2009/11/02/2...o-first-drive/
I'm not trying to alter any opinions with my story, but I have real seat time and several thick technical documents on the 997.5 Turbo sitting in front of me (thanks to Porsche). If anyone has any questions just ask... and please drive the car before you bash it!
- Mike
Although I don't spend a lot of time on Rennlist (I have over 4,000 posts on Pelican), I'm a current Turbo owner (a mere 930), and I race a Boxster Spec. This means I am a real automotive journalist who just happens to also be a Porsche owner (a rare breed). More importantly, I drove the new Turbo in Europe a couple weeks ago:
http://www.autoblog.com/2009/11/02/2...o-first-drive/
I'm not trying to alter any opinions with my story, but I have real seat time and several thick technical documents on the 997.5 Turbo sitting in front of me (thanks to Porsche). If anyone has any questions just ask... and please drive the car before you bash it!
- Mike
The argument here is more to do with whether the new engine will be as reliable as the old. Regretfully no number of test drives or thick Porsche technical manuals can provide the answer- only time can.
If you like to turn over your vehicles, the new TT will be just fine as its will be gone by the time warranty is up. If you like to hold onto cars for the long term as many (including yourself presumably- 930) do, then the new engine will be a concern until time proves its longevity and reliability. Porsche could certainly help overcome these concerns about reliability by developing and using it in their motorsport division if it is as good as they claim.... This is how its predecesor got it reputation after all, not just because Porsche said so....
Last edited by 911rox; 11-03-2009 at 10:50 AM.