Overdraft

Lewis...funny you mentioned that about Clarkson......when watching the last episode of this season's Top Gear - and his commentary as he drove the new V12 Vantage - it was really quite somber....disheartning. couldn't get a read on if that was directed at the great British marque falling out of British hands, him/ his career or the industry in general - it was......well almost sad.

TT Gasman

If it has an oil pan it's a wet sump.

ltc

With governments mandating increased fuel economy, car companies have been forced to 'skew the curve' a bit in order to both meet the average AND produce high hp/faster cars.
It has worked until now (companies merging to simply acquire other companies with more fuel efficient models, car companies producing hybrids and diesels, etc) , but it not known if can continue before government regulations change to prevent this manipulation in average fuel economies.

Worst case: supercars begin to die off like the dinosaur.
Best case: car companies produce more smaller fuel efficient cars to offset a fewer number of higher hp supercars.
Median case: the governments simply attach a very high 'carbon tax' to all supercars.

boolala

Wet sump, dry sump who cares? Oh yeah, that's right,the "enthusiasts." LOL.

Porsche has demonstrated that their "integrated dry sump," wet sump, whatever you want to call it 997.2 engine does not suffer from oil starvation but to the "enthusiasts" results don't matter. Performance doesn't matter. The only thing that matters is that they have deluded themselves into thinking that the M64 is the end of modern racing engine development. You haven't been merely drinking the Kool Aid folks, you've been drinking it out of a garden hose. You've seen the video:

Tacet-Conundrum

[QUOTE=boolala;7036199]Wet sump, dry sump who cares? Oh yeah, that's right,the "enthusiasts." LOL.

Porsche has demonstrated that their "integrated dry sump," wet sump, whatever you want to call it 997.2 engine does not suffer from oil starvation but to the "enthusiasts" results don't matter. Performance doesn't matter. The only thing that matters is that they have deluded themselves into thinking that the M64 is the end of modern racing engine development. You haven't been merely drinking the Kool Aid folks, you've been drinking it out of a garden hose. You've seen the video:

[/QUOTE

That setup is awesome. WHOA!!!

ltc

So, exactly when is yours scheduled to be delivered?

TT Gasman

Lewis, he just doesn't understand. He sounds like a Porsche car salesman.

TB993tt

I guess we should be grateful that there are lots of people like this (the vast majority) who will sip Porsche's Kool Aid and believe every tid bit which Porsche Marketing throws their way...... It will keep the company in business and surely that has to be a good thing.

911/Q45

Try riding that baby after a couple of six packs!

ltc

It's simply due to the fact that people buy (or lease) Porsches for different reasons.
One person may want to own an M64 derived car simple due to the design and history.
Another person could care less if it was a 911 diesel...if it's new and its fast, that's all that matters.

I am just old and stubborn I suppose...dry sumps were invented and raced for a reason; it just seems like a better lubrication system...if the new integrated dry sump (wet) system is actually better, then congratulations to Porsche.

inactiveuser1

Worked on drag cars and they have systems called dry sump that are tied into the oil pan system.They are external tanks that keeps the oil level up under cornering or for example drag car carrying the wheels and oil goes away from the pickup.Cars needing a low oil pan for ground clearance that don't hold as much oil have the dry sump system with the oil pan.For the Corvette they use a dry sump system with oil pan best explained at:
http://www.motorauthority.com/blog/1...stem-explained
or direct video also at:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMkre...layer_embedded

boolala

Please don't confuse these people with facts.

inactiveuser1

As to number 3) about no driver input with the launch control is more used so there might not be as much stress on the transmission compared to (torque braking) and nothing to do with not having any driver input.
I don't think the idea of PDK with launch control is less driver involvement its to protect stress on the car compared to (torque braking) but will see how it stands up under use.
Not sure how their launch control is setup if its fluid in the trans from forward and reverse going against each other but:
On drag cars you put in the transmission what they call a trans brake.
The fluid from forward and reverse are controlled against each other at the same time so the car wont move with the throttle to the floor.
That way there is no stress on the drivetrain as fluid from forward and reverse are against each other to hold the car in place.
Without a trans brake and torque braking is stress on drivetrain.
Also this way the car won't creep forward when at the lights on a drag strip also as when torque braking.Would like to see if the new 911 turbo is setup like a transbrake but may have more to it because the stall speed is probably up more with launch control engaged than if flooring it without the launch control engaged.
Trans brake old drag car tech stuff.
Theres an article for those who havent see trans brakes in drag cars at:
http://www.hotrod.com/techarticles/d...ech/index.html

OldGuy

I am surprised at you guys. Especially Toby. Toby has more knowledge about turbo cars than anyone, and thusly the GT1 motor. I have owned 3 GT1 dry sump motors and the cars they were in. I now have the new 09C2S with PDK. The new 9A1 motor is MUCH improved over the cheap 996 motor. The 9A1 motor is the basis on which all the new platforms coming from Porsche will be built. I didnt drink any kool aid with the 996. And I didnt buy this one without doing my due dilegence and researched the hell out of the motor(I am a scientist by trade). The videos on this page demonstrate that the new 9A1 is more than capable under duress . And really the old 996 motor was more than adequate for track work in the context of our basic driving skills that we amateurs possess. Really the point is dry sump or wet sump is can it pick up oil and get it to the motor, in adverse conditions. The video and other documentation that I have read show that to be true. Also the 9A1 is strong enough in stock form to basically do a turbo conversion with out having to change internals for the new TT. That makes it good for everyone. The 9A1 has 40% less parts and has a much lower center of gravity, and its lighter. My C2s Is faster with PDK than the 996 TT. I dont mind you guys arguing Old School but this new motor has alot of lessons learned engineered into it. The old GT1 motor is a GREAT motor and will go down in the annals of Porsche as one of its greatest achievements but dont disparage the new motor because its different. But technology moves on. Before my back surgery I sold my GT3 with much regret because I couldnt get in and out of it. But after the surgery, I was itching to get back my Porsche. I went to the dealer and drove a C2S PDK and was simply blown away. My goal was to get another GT3 or RS. I wanted to stick to the old GT1 motor too. But that all went out the window with this new car.
Remember I have had a 993TT, 996 GT3 and a 997 GT3. So for it to make a impact like that was pretty cool. This new motor coupled with the new PDK (another thing I was never going to get I AM A 6Speed guy!!!) is quite the weapon. The guys I hang around with on RL has always been the Track oriented GT3 guys and some of them are getting C2S to replace the GT3 on the track. This motor I believe is a giant step forward from the 996 NA motor. The GT1 motor was getting abit long in the tooth (see NASCAR) and it is time for Porsche to come up with a more modern sophisticated motor. I think they have done it.

TB993tt

OG
I had asked RS about the new motor and what the "script" was a couple of months ago when I picked the GT2 up.
They stated that whilst having dinner with a friend who is a current Porsche engineer working on the DFI GT2 engine he told them that they were having big problems "making it reliable" at the 550hp level....

That is as "from the horses mouth" as I could ever get !!!!

RS are concerned obviously because they said to tune the DFI turbo at all looks like it will require some major internal work (rods etc) (just to go to the 550+ level) and the price will mean that it will be a completely different prospect than the GT1 based motors....

Whilst I also have an inbuilt distrust of Porsche Marketing BS, the above is what I am basing my sceptisism on....

For Porsche the new DFI turbo is the correct way to go IMO, I have 3 good friends who all have turbos and they will doubtlessly buy the new one and love it and run it during its warranty period and not care a hoot if it needs any replacement parts/engines...... It is change in Porsche Philosophy which I am mourning, also being an old fart as ltc says above I have grown up with indestructable 911 engines and am sad to see the change, but........

It may well be that RS and others actually take it on and race the DFI turbo motor and end up re-engineering the DFI turbo with rods and other strengthening componentry and it ends up a far better unit than the GT1 but for now we can do some mourning