ParkslopeDope

I have an 08 C2S and the puff of smoke on a cold start is completely normal for these cars, either after having not driven it for a while or after a short trip and then restart, only worry if it continues to smoke after start.
If it were an indication of anything, it would likely be a bad AOS, not scoring (which i had checked on mine and is in great condition) so as others have mentioned just do a thorough PPI and avoid the speculation.
good luck!

Airheader911

I have requested the porsche dealer who is conducting the ppi to start with the boriscope inspection. If scoring is found , PPI will end at that. I will follow up with the specific instructions to conduct from the bottom. I guess that will cost me an oil change as well. Rather spend a little more to know with certainty the condition.
So if there is no bore scoring is it something that can be avoided with regular oil changes and warming the car properly ?

HenryPcar

I applaud you for taking the extra effort to make sure the PPI is done to your instructions. However, other than being physically there to make sure that they did the bore-scoring examination to your methodology, there will always be some doubt whether your instructions are adhered to. In this case the PPI is going to be done by the same dealer that wants to sell you the car and secondly your line of contact is either with the salesman or the service writer, not the actual technician that will perform the task. I know it is a touchy situation. One of the reasons that if I want to do things right I do it myself.

plpete84

I was in a similar situation as you. Had a PPI with a bore scope and although the shop I used is well respected in the area and works on your basic 911s as well as race and cup cars I requested that I be sent images. It's still something that could potentially be faked so you're always take a bit of a leap of faith there but as long as you're direct and polite in what you want I'll give the benefit of the doubt. In the end, during a future oil change come spring, I'll still be popping off the sump to see with my own eyes. Another thing you can ask to look for is some data from Durametric. I asked for things like cam deviation to check for IMS issues and Rough Running report on all cylinders + fuel trim value at idle, which can be helpful in understanding the bore scoring issue. Obviously a picture is worth a thousand words but having multiple data points is always helpful.

Doug H

Yeah, the last thing a dealer want to find is scoring in a car that it trying to sell. I would definitely want to see pictures so there is no concern about the possibility of them reported no scoring concern for an acceptable amount of scuffing or some bs like that. I think with pictures, one should be reasonably safe.

plpete84

I'm genuinely curious where all this will lead and if Porsche will ever be held responsible and what it would mean to the company, especially now that we are seeing this affect car from multiple generations - 996, 997 and I think I might have seen some failures from 991 but don't quote me there. This also includes the Cayman and Boxter cars using same engines. First it was the IMS and now this. In many cases, IMS failed quite early on. My car had a failure at 25k miles per previous owner who got a new engine. Once replaced he also replaced the IMS with a LN unit and effectively solved the problem. This would not be the case here as the new engine would be just as susceptible because of the material used in bores. The scope of where the scoring is also showing is quite broad. Cars with 40k miles have it as well as cars with 80k.

This issue is popping up more and more and that's from people that have actually diagnosed it properly and found scoring. When I say diagnosed it properly I mean visual evidence. Not smoking or ticking noises. With that said, I bet there are many others that either don't know anything about the issue, those that know and 'think' the don't have it and those that know and 'think' they have it but don't really have visual evidence to support it. If you fall into any of these camps and already own the car and change your own oil, all that it takes is a $30 bore scope from amazon and some patience during next oil change. Drop the sump and take a look. I suppose the only saving grace here is that the failure can progress slowly over time and would not manifest itself in a catastrophic failure like an IMS in pieces making it's way through the engine giving you time to find the best course of action.

Airheader911

I should have been more clear. The PPI is being done by the local P dealer. The car is being sold by an independent unrelated user performance car dealer . I should receive an independent inspection but now I an doubtful they will do it from below as recommended. I bet they just pull a plug and go in the top. It's hard to get anyone to do anything right let alone a dealer that advised bore score inspection is not normally a part of a PPI and will cost extra

G.I.G.

I think there is some confusion here. Just so we're all clear, is the car you're having PPI'd at the dealer being sold by a private party? That was my impression. Regardless, you always want to have a PPI performed by a 3rd party, not a dealer or shop that is also trying to sell the car. And definitely request images.

I think the general consensus is some "streaks" or "scuffs" in the cylinders are not uncommon in these engines. My #6 cylinder had a few of those in the images that were provided by the reputable Porsche indy that performed my PPI. They weren't concerned by the streaks, nor were the others that I consulted before I bought the car. I've had the car for a year and a half now and put 8k miles on the car since then. I've had multiple UOA's with great results, and no other signs of bore scoring. The car has been great.

If you do decide to move forward with this car, I would install a low temperature thermostat. Lot's of threads here as to why this is important and how it can possibly prevent bore scoring. It's cheap insurance.

Best of luck and please keep us posted.

G.I.G.

Thanks for the clarification. I was drafting my last response as you wrote this.

Fullyield

I live in S.Florida too. Consider using 5W-40 or 5W-50 oil because of heat and humidity here. The 0W-40 oil is too light for South Florida even though it is always on sale at Walmart.

rtl5009

just use DT40 or Motul XCess and call it a day. Change every 6 mo.

Carreralicious

I use Mobil 1 5W-50. I wanted to try out the Motul product, but check out the virgin oil analysis on both below. Motul uses no Moly at all while M1 does. I don’t want to add Moly as a separate additive to oil that is supposed to have all the right ingredients in the first place.

VOA on Motul 8100:
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/th...s-5w40.252563/

VOA on M1 5W-50:
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/th...sample.142430/

soin

i have ticked the YES box as a new owner of a 997.1 c2s tip, bought on the 9th november, borescoped by Porsche main dealer reportedly fine and already on a re-sleeved engine
drove it 300 km home and went through a litre of oil, sooty tailpipe and bumper, smoke on cold start etc. re borescoped by another indy shop, to find cylinder 3 scored all round the wall
car sent back to seller who has had Porsche take second look whom then agreed on damage and advised rebuild at $24k

selling dealer is talking about a rebuild at their cost or trade on another vehicle or refund i guess

twice on the same car
can't make this **** up

rtl5009

Do you know who sleeved it and what the sleeves are?

HenryPcar

I wouldn't dick around further with this car. Since the dealer offer you several options, I'll accept the refund and start over again.