nelsontod

FRUNKenstein

Well, I'm saying an actual negotiated sale price in the $33k-$34k range for that car. It has 105k+ miles, so rather than the mileage, I think the bigger issue between your car and that car is the transmission. Your interior color of Metropol Blue is much nicer than gray, IMHO.

nelsontod

pfbz

I also don't love gray in the 996 generation cars, but not nearly the deal-breaker for most that a tiptronic typically is...

Carlo_Carrera

Some day I will take you for a hot lap around a track in my Tip. You might not change your mind but you will understand how a Tip was meant to be driven.

pfbz

Dock

My guess is that the majority of people consider the Tip a deal breaker because of the lower level of driver involvement it brings to the driving experience.

Carlo_Carrera

I agree for the most part but "driver involvement" is a relative term.

Everyone who has done a hot lap on a track with me in my Tip has felt plenty "involved". I have also found nearly everyone who dismissed Tips has never driven one or has not driven one properly. Just like there is an "art" and a "skill" to driving a manual well there in an "art" and a "skill" to driving a Tip well.

Dock

But not as involved as they would have been driving a manual transmission.

I'm happy for those who like their Tip, but there will be no changing of my mind on which I like more (Tip or manual).

Carlo_Carrera

No, that is your opinion, not everyone's.

Dock

It's not opinion. It's simply a matter of counting the number of physical movements required to change a gear in both cars and comparing the two. There are more physical movements required with the manual.

Additionally, there are more mental activities involved with making a gear change with the manual.

So there are more mental and physical functions required to change gears in a manual, therefore driving a manual requires more involvement by the driver.

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Carlo_Carrera

No, it is completely your opinion.

Physical and mental functions do not equal involvement. Some would say the working of a manual gear box to be laborious, dull and completely uninvolving.

Nyuofa

I'm always looking for slightly lower mileage, and found this one. Not sure if anyone posted this previously.

The owner seems to be a used car dealer. He sent me carfax. 6 owner history. 'PPI report' from a local Euro shop shows that door does not lock with key fob, front bumper may have been repainted. It sucks that this car is so far away. That brown interior is so sexy...

https://bozeman.craigslist.org/ctd/d...633476591.html

Dock

It is not opinion.

Physically using three of your appendages to change gears is a more involved process that using just one of your appendages to change gears. There is also a higher order mental involvement required to control and coordinate the movement of the three appendages than there is to control one appendage.

Open heart surgery is a more involved process for a surgeon than placing two sutures to close a laceration on your arm.

If I did the electrical wiring in your house and in one room used three switches that had to be engaged in a specific order to turn on the ceiling light, and in another room used one switch that simply had to be moved from "off" to "on" to turn on the ceiling light, the three-switch light would be a more involved process to operate than the single switch light. If one enjoyed the involvement of making more switch selections to turn on a single light, they would rather turn the light on and off in the room that required the three switch movements, not the room that required the simple actuation of one switch.

Completing differential equations is a more involved process than answering what 22*19 equals. If someone enjoys the mental involvement of higher order math computations then they would find completing a higher order differential equation more satisfying than completing the multiplication required to answer what 22*19 is.

The higher the number of processes/steps that are required to achieve something, the higher the involvement. It takes just one switch actuation to change gears in a 996 Turbo with Tiptronic transmission, while it takes three control actuations to change gears in a 996 Turbo with a manual transmission. The manual transmission is therefore more involved to operate; it takes more driver involvement to operate than a Tip. For those who enjoy a higher level of driver involvement in operating a transmission, the manual transmission offers more than the Tip transmission.

nelsontod