What's the best engine oil 996?
#91
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Cheers,
=L=
#93
Drifting
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For the few who have a technical ,rather than emotional interest in this subject, there is data showing the inferiority of Mobil 1 compared to JGDT40. Since this comparison was done the JGDT40 formulation may have been further improved
Just scroll down to the bottom of this page:
http://archive.constantcontact.com/f...087230094.html
There are lots of oils with high ZDDP. Excessive ZDDP will 'poison' the cats. So 'more is better' has limits.For example, Mobil 1 5-40"Turbo Diesel"has more ZDDP than regular Mobil 1.
The question is the balance in the additive package.
I linked an old comparative list some time ago from BITOG for film strength and ZDDP. Motorcraft 5-50 was surprisingly good in that comparison JGibbs was included in the list.
But there is way more to the issue than just two factors in the additive package.
11. 5W50 Castrol Edge with Syntec API SN, synthetic, formerly Castrol Syntec, black bottle = 75,409 psi
zinc = 1252 ppm
phos = 1197 ppm
ZDDP = 1200 ppm
8. 10W30 Joe Gibbs HR4 Hotrod Oil synthetic = 86,270 psi
zinc = 1247 ppm
phos = 1137 ppm
ZDDP = 1100 ppm
3. 10W30 Valvoline VR1 Conventional Racing Oil (silver bottle) = 103,505 psi
zinc = 1472 ppm
phos = 1544 ppm
ZDDP = 1500 ppm
For the oil Geeks only:
http://speedtalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=35836
http://www.intellidog.com/dieselmann/powers~1.htm
http://www.machinerylubrication.com/Read/255/oil-foam
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/motor-oil-101/
Just scroll down to the bottom of this page:
http://archive.constantcontact.com/f...087230094.html
There are lots of oils with high ZDDP. Excessive ZDDP will 'poison' the cats. So 'more is better' has limits.For example, Mobil 1 5-40"Turbo Diesel"has more ZDDP than regular Mobil 1.
The question is the balance in the additive package.
I linked an old comparative list some time ago from BITOG for film strength and ZDDP. Motorcraft 5-50 was surprisingly good in that comparison JGibbs was included in the list.
But there is way more to the issue than just two factors in the additive package.
11. 5W50 Castrol Edge with Syntec API SN, synthetic, formerly Castrol Syntec, black bottle = 75,409 psi
zinc = 1252 ppm
phos = 1197 ppm
ZDDP = 1200 ppm
8. 10W30 Joe Gibbs HR4 Hotrod Oil synthetic = 86,270 psi
zinc = 1247 ppm
phos = 1137 ppm
ZDDP = 1100 ppm
3. 10W30 Valvoline VR1 Conventional Racing Oil (silver bottle) = 103,505 psi
zinc = 1472 ppm
phos = 1544 ppm
ZDDP = 1500 ppm
For the oil Geeks only:
http://speedtalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=35836
http://www.intellidog.com/dieselmann/powers~1.htm
http://www.machinerylubrication.com/Read/255/oil-foam
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/motor-oil-101/
#94
Former Vendor
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I gathered all my own data. I believe nothing of what I hear, and only 1/2 of what I see.
That said, Lubrizol makes the additive packages and formulates the Driven oils, just like they do for the US Military.
Warren Buffet owns Lubrizol, pretty much all development is done with an open checkbook.
The amount of Engineers on staff doesn't mean a damn thing to me.
That said, Lubrizol makes the additive packages and formulates the Driven oils, just like they do for the US Military.
Warren Buffet owns Lubrizol, pretty much all development is done with an open checkbook.
The amount of Engineers on staff doesn't mean a damn thing to me.
#95
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I was getting the creamy butter you so excellently describe in the oil filler tube when I was using Mobil 1 full synthetic 5W 40W so I changed to Motul 8100 X-Cess 5W-40W full 100% Synthetic. The reason I changed was from reading these forums but one main reason was after speaking with a Porsche Mechanic who advised me to get away from Mobil and to use oils being used in Europe. One being Motul.. I found Wayne from Pelican parts pushing the same oil on one of his postings and that made my mind up for me. By the way no matter how many thousands of miles an oil company say their oil will last, I will change my oil at 5000 miles no matter what. Peace of mind has no price tag.
#96
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What about Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Truck 5W-40?
Typical Properties
Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Truck 5W-40
SAE Grade 5W-40
Viscosity, ASTM D 445
cSt @ 40ºC 102
cSt @ 100ºC 14.8
Viscosity Index, ASTM D 2270 151
Phosphorus 1130
Zinc 1250
Mobil's site states it's approved for use in gasoline engines: Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Truck also meets the API SM specification for gasoline engines used in mixed fleets.
http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lub...uck_5W-40.aspx
The advantage? Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Truck 5W-40 can be purchased at Walmart in 5 qt. containers @ $26.00.
Regarding the oil discussions, weather it's Joe Gibbs, Motul, Mobil 1, etc. neither will solve the IMS, cylinder, or other design and manufacturing issues. If anyone can conclusively prove the Porsche recommended fill was the direct cause of any of these failures, I would be extremely impressed. I've ran Mobil both conventional and synthetic in our daily drivers for two decades including BMW and Acura well over 300k and all were running perfect with no engine failures. Of course neither of these have really been known to struggle with engine design (just minor things like rear sub frames falling out on e46 M3's
). In regards to the 996\997 IMS failures, while it is true that the same sealed ball bearing design gives long reliable service life on all four corners, it’s out of its element in an internal engine environment exposed to constant hot acidic oil while trying to maintain its own internal lubricant. Again, bad choices on Porsches part or they would still be using it today. Even with all this, I still love my 996. She just needs a bit more attention.
Typical Properties
Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Truck 5W-40
SAE Grade 5W-40
Viscosity, ASTM D 445
cSt @ 40ºC 102
cSt @ 100ºC 14.8
Viscosity Index, ASTM D 2270 151
Phosphorus 1130
Zinc 1250
Mobil's site states it's approved for use in gasoline engines: Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Truck also meets the API SM specification for gasoline engines used in mixed fleets.
http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lub...uck_5W-40.aspx
The advantage? Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Truck 5W-40 can be purchased at Walmart in 5 qt. containers @ $26.00.
Regarding the oil discussions, weather it's Joe Gibbs, Motul, Mobil 1, etc. neither will solve the IMS, cylinder, or other design and manufacturing issues. If anyone can conclusively prove the Porsche recommended fill was the direct cause of any of these failures, I would be extremely impressed. I've ran Mobil both conventional and synthetic in our daily drivers for two decades including BMW and Acura well over 300k and all were running perfect with no engine failures. Of course neither of these have really been known to struggle with engine design (just minor things like rear sub frames falling out on e46 M3's
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Last edited by Waltheisenberg; 07-09-2015 at 08:35 PM.
#98
Rennlist Member
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I have switched to JG DT40 for all the reasons explained so far.
#99
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I would generally agree with most diesel oils are not suitable for gasoline engines however Mobil clearly defines this as "meets the API SM specification for gasoline engines used in mixed fleets".
#100
Former Vendor
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Ever seen a 7,000 RPM capable diesel engine before?
I've done a lot with diesel oils, for diesel applications. I am currently doing a ton of testing with the Driven DP40 Turbo diesel oil, in my loader, my Deutz tractor, my Duramax diesel GMC 2500 and my M923A2 5 ton military truck. The Deutz has almost 400 hours on the same service fill, and has only consumed 2 quarts the entire time. Last week I cut 40 acres with it in 95 degree heat, which is pretty tough for an aircooled 50HP diesel engine, running it wide open throttle for 12 solid hours.
Most diesel oils have very little inhibitors that fight aeration. Run a diesel oil hard, at high RPM for a couple of minutes (in a gas engine), and drain the oil immediately. You'll think its a German Beer, rather than engine oil.... I have seen the "head" of foam be 4" high with some diesel oils when used in these engines and the oil was quickly drained.
Diesel oils changed dramatically in 2007, when the sulfur level of fuel changed, and thats when a lot of diesel engines started using diesel exhaust fluid, and some saw catalytic converters.
It astonishes me how people will try to outsmart the problem, and spend more time and effort to use the WRONG thing for the application, rather than just buying the proper oil. Its funny when someone spends more money than they try to save by having some convoluted idea.
I have an engine here now that failed due to a polymer conflict between 2 different oils that created hard crystallized material to form in the oil sump, which blocked the oil pick up tube and shut off oil flow to a point where it tossed a connecting rod. That guy didn't listen, even when he was directed to specifically not do exactly what he did. No, that wasn't a Gibbs oil that was used. I am packing it up and sending it home to him, because he thinks he's smarter than anyone else, and he won't listen to me either. We'll see how far he gets with his repair, I bet he gives up after two days. I won't deal with a person like this; because he'll always screw with something, and its easier to be a victim, than a failure.
I haven't paid ANY attention to API ratings in at least the last decade. Once I learned how the ratings are determined, it was just a big joke. Thats pretty much the case with every rating, certification or "recommended" item.
I've done a lot with diesel oils, for diesel applications. I am currently doing a ton of testing with the Driven DP40 Turbo diesel oil, in my loader, my Deutz tractor, my Duramax diesel GMC 2500 and my M923A2 5 ton military truck. The Deutz has almost 400 hours on the same service fill, and has only consumed 2 quarts the entire time. Last week I cut 40 acres with it in 95 degree heat, which is pretty tough for an aircooled 50HP diesel engine, running it wide open throttle for 12 solid hours.
Most diesel oils have very little inhibitors that fight aeration. Run a diesel oil hard, at high RPM for a couple of minutes (in a gas engine), and drain the oil immediately. You'll think its a German Beer, rather than engine oil.... I have seen the "head" of foam be 4" high with some diesel oils when used in these engines and the oil was quickly drained.
Diesel oils changed dramatically in 2007, when the sulfur level of fuel changed, and thats when a lot of diesel engines started using diesel exhaust fluid, and some saw catalytic converters.
It astonishes me how people will try to outsmart the problem, and spend more time and effort to use the WRONG thing for the application, rather than just buying the proper oil. Its funny when someone spends more money than they try to save by having some convoluted idea.
I have an engine here now that failed due to a polymer conflict between 2 different oils that created hard crystallized material to form in the oil sump, which blocked the oil pick up tube and shut off oil flow to a point where it tossed a connecting rod. That guy didn't listen, even when he was directed to specifically not do exactly what he did. No, that wasn't a Gibbs oil that was used. I am packing it up and sending it home to him, because he thinks he's smarter than anyone else, and he won't listen to me either. We'll see how far he gets with his repair, I bet he gives up after two days. I won't deal with a person like this; because he'll always screw with something, and its easier to be a victim, than a failure.
I haven't paid ANY attention to API ratings in at least the last decade. Once I learned how the ratings are determined, it was just a big joke. Thats pretty much the case with every rating, certification or "recommended" item.
#101
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Since we're talking about lubrication what about the best manual transmission oil. I use Liqui Moly 75W-90 GL-5. Wondering if the 75W-140 or a mix of the 90 and 140 would be most effective?
Cheers
Cheers
#102
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https://rennlist.com/forums/997-foru...cant-data.html
My recommendation would be to avoid concoctions of any sort. I know of at least one Subaru forum that highly recommends all sorts of "blends" (Scotty's Cocktail IIRC). And I speak from past experience. My winter DD is a WRX.
LM 75W-90 GL-5 is allright, there are however better suited fluids. See the link above.
Cheers,
=L=
#103
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Ever seen a 7,000 RPM capable diesel engine before?
I've done a lot with diesel oils, for diesel applications. I am currently doing a ton of testing with the Driven DP40 Turbo diesel oil, in my loader, my Deutz tractor, my Duramax diesel GMC 2500 and my M923A2 5 ton military truck. The Deutz has almost 400 hours on the same service fill, and has only consumed 2 quarts the entire time. Last week I cut 40 acres with it in 95 degree heat, which is pretty tough for an aircooled 50HP diesel engine, running it wide open throttle for 12 solid hours.
Most diesel oils have very little inhibitors that fight aeration. Run a diesel oil hard, at high RPM for a couple of minutes (in a gas engine), and drain the oil immediately. You'll think its a German Beer, rather than engine oil.... I have seen the "head" of foam be 4" high with some diesel oils when used in these engines and the oil was quickly drained.
Diesel oils changed dramatically in 2007, when the sulfur level of fuel changed, and thats when a lot of diesel engines started using diesel exhaust fluid, and some saw catalytic converters.
It astonishes me how people will try to outsmart the problem, and spend more time and effort to use the WRONG thing for the application, rather than just buying the proper oil. Its funny when someone spends more money than they try to save by having some convoluted idea.
I have an engine here now that failed due to a polymer conflict between 2 different oils that created hard crystallized material to form in the oil sump, which blocked the oil pick up tube and shut off oil flow to a point where it tossed a connecting rod. That guy didn't listen, even when he was directed to specifically not do exactly what he did. No, that wasn't a Gibbs oil that was used. I am packing it up and sending it home to him, because he thinks he's smarter than anyone else, and he won't listen to me either. We'll see how far he gets with his repair, I bet he gives up after two days. I won't deal with a person like this; because he'll always screw with something, and its easier to be a victim, than a failure.
I haven't paid ANY attention to API ratings in at least the last decade. Once I learned how the ratings are determined, it was just a big joke. Thats pretty much the case with every rating, certification or "recommended" item.
I've done a lot with diesel oils, for diesel applications. I am currently doing a ton of testing with the Driven DP40 Turbo diesel oil, in my loader, my Deutz tractor, my Duramax diesel GMC 2500 and my M923A2 5 ton military truck. The Deutz has almost 400 hours on the same service fill, and has only consumed 2 quarts the entire time. Last week I cut 40 acres with it in 95 degree heat, which is pretty tough for an aircooled 50HP diesel engine, running it wide open throttle for 12 solid hours.
Most diesel oils have very little inhibitors that fight aeration. Run a diesel oil hard, at high RPM for a couple of minutes (in a gas engine), and drain the oil immediately. You'll think its a German Beer, rather than engine oil.... I have seen the "head" of foam be 4" high with some diesel oils when used in these engines and the oil was quickly drained.
Diesel oils changed dramatically in 2007, when the sulfur level of fuel changed, and thats when a lot of diesel engines started using diesel exhaust fluid, and some saw catalytic converters.
It astonishes me how people will try to outsmart the problem, and spend more time and effort to use the WRONG thing for the application, rather than just buying the proper oil. Its funny when someone spends more money than they try to save by having some convoluted idea.
I have an engine here now that failed due to a polymer conflict between 2 different oils that created hard crystallized material to form in the oil sump, which blocked the oil pick up tube and shut off oil flow to a point where it tossed a connecting rod. That guy didn't listen, even when he was directed to specifically not do exactly what he did. No, that wasn't a Gibbs oil that was used. I am packing it up and sending it home to him, because he thinks he's smarter than anyone else, and he won't listen to me either. We'll see how far he gets with his repair, I bet he gives up after two days. I won't deal with a person like this; because he'll always screw with something, and its easier to be a victim, than a failure.
I haven't paid ANY attention to API ratings in at least the last decade. Once I learned how the ratings are determined, it was just a big joke. Thats pretty much the case with every rating, certification or "recommended" item.
Last edited by Waltheisenberg; 07-10-2015 at 12:32 PM.
#104
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Just substitute quick turnaround with global availability.
In fact, based on my real world data I would rather use a specific Amsoil than its Mobil counterpart.
Have fun getting that info from Mobil. I'll be happy to see their comments.
#105
Nordschleife Master
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A question I have is (and I can't believe I'm posting in an oil thread YAY!) if the OP is asking what is the best oil, 1) why is the OP clearly touting M1 and 2) did the OP try to turn this into an IMS thread?
The best thing about M1 is when your making sandwiches and you run out of butter just go out to the garage and scoop some out of your oil fill tube.
The best thing about M1 is when your making sandwiches and you run out of butter just go out to the garage and scoop some out of your oil fill tube.