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The cylinders have no ovalization, crankshaft geometry is perfect, as much as surfaces: the man who is taking care of engine parts doesn't have any doubt, the mechanical lifters are way better than the hydraulics.
What a nice view!
amazing 1
amazing 2
amazing 6
Shiny heads
The man from the shop is saying the connecting rod bearings and connecting rod bushes are in "as brand new shape and size", the engine, he told me, must have had a very tranquil life and regular service intervals during its life before becoming a submarine.
I don't know what to do, if change them anyway, or not.
Hello, I am following your thread since the begining ,
I have both reinforcements 96550173900grv and 96550174000grv new.
I have bought them @ €150 both. I see today they are @ €143 each + shipping
If you have paid todays price, and can return them against other parts you need, I will send you mine from Paris for the same price I got them 150 shipped.
Sincerely, I am not trying to hack your thread, But I would be honored to 'in a form' offer a small gesture to your limoncella
I do not sell parts , I am in finance
If not, no problem, I'll find something to send you to be part of your project, for free
courage
the exact picture of the ones I have are in this thread
Because they have to be adjusted. Recurring revenue!
But he is not the mechanic, he owns the rectifying shop.
He was telling me that it isnt so uncommon that some dirt goes into the hydraulic lifter, while mechanic system is more reliable.
Hello, I am following your thread since the begining ,
I have both reinforcements 96550173900grv and 96550174000grv new.
I have bought them @ €150 both. I see today they are @ €143 each + shipping
If you have paid todays price, and can return them against other parts you need, I will send you mine from Paris for the same price I got them 150 shipped.
Sincerely, I am not trying to hack your thread, But I would be honored to 'in a form' offer a small gesture to your limoncella
I do not sell parts , I am in finance
If not, no problem, I'll find something to send you to be part of your project, for free
courage
Thank you very much geolab, it would be great sharing something coming with such a positive spirit/intention! Maybe you have the LSD for the cup cars ?
(Just kidding)
I paid 200 euro for both, but I will also need the RS upprights (BBI?) and then another pair of cup tie rods, plus many many other things, like for example the RECARO SPG seats, even though I really don't know if my bottom fits the standard version, while the XL seems to be so big.
I fit perfectly in the pole position ABE/TÜV, but they arent made in fireproof material and they don't have same grey finish on the shoulders.
Last edited by nothingbutgt3; 06-08-2020 at 05:40 PM.
For my 993 track engine I modified the 993 hydraulic lifters to mechanical. It was a bit of work but I am hoping we did our homework and got it right. I also removed the power steering pump and installed a cup style electric pump in the frunk. You will need to cap off the back of the cam where the pump assembly attached. Patrick motorsports sells one for this purpose. IIRC the cams of the 993 don't allow the freeze plugs used on the 964 engine. The 964 engine will be different port sizes and uses 9mm vs 8mm valves and guides. I believe they use a different alloy as well. The cam towers of the 964 are different and they don't have the oiling for the 993 lifters but run tubes for splash oiling for the rockers. Although my rockers are now mechanical I will be using the oil formerly used to feed the lifters to lubricate the rockers but pluged the holes to where the lifters were amongst some other small mods.
These are my modified mechanical 993 forged rockers left vs stock mechanical cast 911 rockers right.
Freeze plugs? Now the cams are in the shop, could you give me more details regarding the mods to be done?
This just keeps getting better and better. Why isn't anyone sponsoring his build yet? This is so cool. truly a car that's back from the dead.
thank you Will, it would be very welcome finding some support, because this isn't my field at all, I am learning a lot, and I must confess it is what I wanted from the very beginning to be personally envolved in every part of the process.
For example sooner or later I'll be facing the gearbox rebuild: I found the company that could provide me the reproduction of the G50.32 gears, it is a company very well known here in Italy, providing gears for porsche historical Les Mans cars, with helyx teeth, cementation and rectification process, but they do it only if I order at least 5 gearsets, this is what is truly expensive.
I am leaving this as last thing to be done, maybe in the meanwhile it would jump out another way to go.
Someone tells me it is not a bad solution having 5 sets, because I can take 2 and sell the other 3, he thinks this would be a way to sponsor the project by myself, but it is not my field, I have no idea if someone would be interested.
Sometime I tell myself, with prices of Porsche spare parts always increasing and the fact that gears aren't like "prosciutto di parma" than once is sliced must be eaten shortly, otherwise after some time must be thrown in the litter bin, it is only a matter of time before someone calls me for buying a set. Someone told me not to be nervous about that, but that I have to consider it as a sort of investment, which is not what I am doing with this car...or maybe yes, but not in a material way, in a knowledge related way is definitely an investment.
I am a beginner, but just 2 years ago I couldnt enter a rectification shop knowing precisely what to say and being able to have a conversation with the responsible craftsman, understanding perfectly what he is telling and making livetime considerations.
Of course having a professional to deal with is very important, but I also noticed it is very important knowing what is crucial to be done and what not. It helps a lot.
Meanwhile 99% I found the supplier for the suspension package, something really top end in my opinion, which speaks by itself about the comrpomiseless approach guiding me in this rebuild.
More expense, more time to finish line, let's see.
I particularly am not a fan of the hydraulic lifters. They eliminate the mechanical sound the engine makes. If you are lazy about changing your oil it will cause issues and require a second filter to prevent issues. I have seen them need replacing as early as 60k miles which is about the same expense as having a valve lash done every 15-20k. Although the upper valve cover on the 993 requires the removal of the power steering pump to access the right upper valve cover making valve lash adjustments difficult in the car. The earlier engines only had a 6 nut vs 8 bolt pattern to hold them in place.
I had to have the tops of the rockers machined flat removing the area where the hydraulic lifter hat is. Had custom made sleeves with a flange and step to match the internal contour of the rocker and threads to hold the tappet in place. then the remianing holes where the oil that feed the lifter welded shut to prevent any oil pressure loss. It was a bit of work but a huge savings over the other options. The 993 forged rockes modified to mechanical saves about .8 pounds of weight vs the cast units.
I particularly am not a fan of the hydraulic lifters. They eliminate the mechanical sound the engine makes. If you are lazy about changing your oil it will cause issues and require a second filter to prevent issues. I have seen them need replacing as early as 60k miles which is about the same expense as having a valve lash done every 15-20k. Although the upper valve cover on the 993 requires the removal of the power steering pump to access the right upper valve cover making valve lash adjustments difficult in the car. The earlier engines only had a 6 nut vs 8 bolt pattern to hold them in place.
I had to have the tops of the rockers machined flat removing the area where the hydraulic lifter hat is. Had custom made sleeves with a flange and step to match the internal contour of the rocker and threads to hold the tappet in place. then the remianing holes where the oil that feed the lifter welded shut to prevent any oil pressure loss. It was a bit of work but a huge savings over the other options. The 993 forged rockes modified to mechanical saves about .8 pounds of weight vs the cast units.
Thank you for your answer Cobalt, in my case I am going to use 964 rocker arms, will they need to be reworked as well?
the craftsman from the rectifying shop has seen the gearbox gears and LSD gears and they are not usable anymore, so this, together with bodywork, will be the part more expensive to rebuild.
I can reuse the gearbox case, the engagement levers and probably also the synchros together with the LSD case and body.
But are the synchros same for G50.32 and G50.21, apart from strength of the material?
Thank you for your answer Cobalt, in my case I am going to use 964 rocker arms, will they need to be reworked as well?
the craftsman from the rectifying shop has seen the gearbox gears and LSD gears and they are not usable anymore, so this, together with bodywork, will be the part more expensive to rebuild.
I can reuse the gearbox case, the engagement levers and probably also the synchros together with the LSD case and body.
But are the synchros same for G50.32 and G50.21, apart from strength of the material?
I would assume unless you buy one of the forged sets designed for these engines the factory ones won't work unless you plug up the oiling holes. The 993 units are force fed oil through the shaft and the earlier version is splash oiled. There are two holes in them designed to oil the rocker and shaft by the oiling rails which shoot oil towards them and whatever else is splashed around. I guess isntead of welding you can replace the brass bushing with a new one that has no holes. It wouldn't cost that much.
thank you Will, it would be very welcome finding some support, because this isn't my field at all, I am learning a lot, and I must confess it is what I wanted from the very beginning to be personally envolved in every part of the process.
For example sooner or later I'll be facing the gearbox rebuild: I found the company that could provide me the reproduction of the G50.32 gears, it is a company very well known here in Italy, providing gears for porsche historical Les Mans cars, with helyx teeth, cementation and rectification process, but they do it only if I order at least 5 gearsets, this is what is truly expensive.
I am leaving this as last thing to be done, maybe in the meanwhile it would jump out another way to go.
Someone tells me it is not a bad solution having 5 sets, because I can take 2 and sell the other 3, he thinks this would be a way to sponsor the project by myself, but it is not my field, I have no idea if someone would be interested.
Sometime I tell myself, with prices of Porsche spare parts always increasing and the fact that gears aren't like "prosciutto di parma" than once is sliced must be eaten shortly, otherwise after some time must be thrown in the litter bin, it is only a matter of time before someone calls me for buying a set. Someone told me not to be nervous about that, but that I have to consider it as a sort of investment, which is not what I am doing with this car...or maybe yes, but not in a material way, in a knowledge related way is definitely an investment.
I am a beginner, but just 2 years ago I couldnt enter a rectification shop knowing precisely what to say and being able to have a conversation with the responsible craftsman, understanding perfectly what he is telling and making livetime considerations.
Of course having a professional to deal with is very important, but I also noticed it is very important knowing what is crucial to be done and what not. It helps a lot.
Meanwhile 99% I found the supplier for the suspension package, something really top end in my opinion, which speaks by itself about the comrpomiseless approach guiding me in this rebuild.
More expense, more time to finish line, let's see.
You may want to contact Matt at Guard Transmission to discuss gear and LSD options. Matt is very knowledgeable and helpful in working through options. I believe he is GT Gears on RL. https://www.guardtransmissionllc.com
I am really considering to introduce a downgrade (which in the fact for a sport use is an upgrade) using the mechanical rocker arms, but it seems for some kind of reason the stuff must remain a mistery, if someone have detailed info in regard to "what must be done" to make a good and reliable job, and this must remain secret matter, it would be welcome to recieve the support material/instruction privately.
I think it would be nice to upgrade its original engine going for a crankshaft balance, 964 mechanical lifter, steering pump removal, together with Varioram intake, its DME and 3-1 optimised primaries with x-pipe and mapping.
The more obscure part seems to be the necessary reworking process to be done in order to make the 964 mechanical lifters work . So far I found only infos on FVD (and here, thank to Cobalt), where they say one must upgrade also the camshafts to sportier ones, but why, the original 993 camshafts are not going to work fine or for hp gain?
From FVD website:
Mechanical Rocker Arm Kit 993 / 993 TT / 993 GT2 - With Oil Lubricated Rocker Shafts
Say good bye to that 993 hydraulic lifter flat spot in the higher rpm´s with our Mechanical Rocker Arm Kit. This is a complete retrofit kit ready for installation.
This kit includes custom oil lubricated shafts that include oil holes specifically placed on each shaft to ensure constant oil pressure for superior reliability.
We also suggest our Sprocket Wheels Kit FVD10550000 , in order to more accurately time the camshafts. This kit must be paired will with Sport camshafts for Mechanical Rocker arms and not with the original 993 camshafts.
I don't understand if all of the above is suggested as for an organic upgrade, or if it is suggested, but not mandatory, otherwise the 964 rocker arms would fail.
On this website they are very professional, but not everyone is a mechanic and is able to know so accurately the way engines work: I mean, better you tell the story compleately instead of just half way, they aren't necessarily talking to professionals!
06-08-2020, 03:50 PM
