991.2 Cobb Accessport, post your results
03-20-2020, 02:01 PM
#302
COVID -19 Perspective Disclaimer: Posting this below as a positive form of distraction in these very difficult times we are all in. We all have more pressing concerns so this stuff while trivial is also just the right thing to keep us hoping for sunnier days. With that said:
My review of recent Cobb AP do-it-yourself download for 17' 991.2 Base w/ PDK. Loaded the Off-the-Shelf Stage 1 93.
Order experience: very easy online, simple location on website and add-to-cart was a breeze. I also called Cobb and s/w sales agent and got some answers to a few questions I had, being nervous about an expensive DIY software product that purportedly turns your base Carrera into a S or GTS on power and speed. Polite and knowledgeable, they were ready for my FAQs. Took about 6 days to arrive at the door. UPS required signature - did not like that because if I wasn't home and missed it I would've been upset.
Delivery experience: Packaged well, the quality of the AP itself and the cords are high and add confidence that this product is sophisticated. The instruction booklet is excellent and truly set forth in a brief and efficient way. Could it really be that simple? Yes, read on.
Install experience: I followed Cobb's sales agent's advice to connect a 20 amp battery charger minutes before installing the AP to the car. That was easy and reassuring - zero issues. With the battery charge level hovering consistently at 13.2 V I went ahead with the AP install. The plug connects easily to the AP and easily to the purple female connector on my car's ECU under the driver's side dash - stupidly simple. I followed the directions on the AP screen (tells you to switch the key to the on (but not running) position and from there it prompts you with a few more easy to follow steps and then commences the download, showing a % status bar along the way. ***Note, during this time, all the dash warning lights are going on and off and all sorts of failure messages are popping up and going away in the message dash cluster screen - this is normal Cobb assured and natural part of the ECU reflash. Don't panic here. It took about 15 minutes or so to complete successfully. Says that when you are done. The possessed dash lights all resolved and back to normal state. I unplugged everything and put the AP away.
Driving experience: I followed the directions to wait a min or so and then started the car drove away right after the install was done. The engine "rough" feeling and sounding for a few minutes - as if you got a new exhaust and there was some odd vibrations on revs over 4k. I was told by Cobb rep this would happen and not to worry it would go away after a few minutes and a few miles driven - it totally did. It was gone before I noticed again. Whew.
I let the engine warm nicely by driving slow around town for a few min until the oil temp was up past the blue zone (as I always do), then I started to dip my foot in the throttle a bit, first in normal mode. Right away, I noticed that I suddenly had more wind-up torque even at partial throttle. The car surged forward in a faster way than stock with the same throttle press distance. Nice. Cobb AP noticed! I began to press harder and harder, feeling how the PDK now interacted with the new higher boost level. Was it still linear? Yes, but. But what? It's a little different now, hard to put a finger on it though, I'm still processing this in my head and will update further when I drive more. For now, my initial impression is that you now notice that your car has turbos, for real. S and GTS cars always had a bit of lag before the heavy power delivery and now so does the Base. Although not as fast, the beauty of the Base Carrera was it's awesome linear power delivery with perfectly calibrated PDK rhythms. It's no longer as silky smooth now with Stage 1 93 running. But it is very noticeably faster now - the car has been transformed to a more frenetic and fast machine, delivering the feel in your hands and butt that the car has serious boost thrust now. And your speedo quickly shows speeds way faster than you used to be at at the same throttle input in the same gear. You're flying now. From a launch at the light perspective, the car is a rocket now, even partial throttle pull-away is amusing as you leave the cars behind in the dust, literally. The traction control intervention is more there now than stock - actually I barely ever noticed any TC when stock. I then drove in Sport mode for a while and the car is a certified animal. PDK and more boost and it's a ball of fun. A whole different car now, my brakes are now working ever harder as I'm asking more from them from all the throttle and speed fun.
So far my only small issue is that there is now a slight delay when you press the pedal down hard before the boost comes on and the car flies ahead, like, duh, it actually has turbos now. But again, Base owners never had any lag really, so it's a bit more boy-racer-ish now. Nice that with the COBB AP you can always uninstall if you want.
Do you stage 2 on the BASE? no way. no need. if you still need more power (in your head), turn off your TC once to invoke sport PSM or off completely - good luck, you'll realize how much power you always had. Stage 1 is perfect for Base owners. I'll update more as I go.
My review of recent Cobb AP do-it-yourself download for 17' 991.2 Base w/ PDK. Loaded the Off-the-Shelf Stage 1 93.
Order experience: very easy online, simple location on website and add-to-cart was a breeze. I also called Cobb and s/w sales agent and got some answers to a few questions I had, being nervous about an expensive DIY software product that purportedly turns your base Carrera into a S or GTS on power and speed. Polite and knowledgeable, they were ready for my FAQs. Took about 6 days to arrive at the door. UPS required signature - did not like that because if I wasn't home and missed it I would've been upset.
Delivery experience: Packaged well, the quality of the AP itself and the cords are high and add confidence that this product is sophisticated. The instruction booklet is excellent and truly set forth in a brief and efficient way. Could it really be that simple? Yes, read on.
Install experience: I followed Cobb's sales agent's advice to connect a 20 amp battery charger minutes before installing the AP to the car. That was easy and reassuring - zero issues. With the battery charge level hovering consistently at 13.2 V I went ahead with the AP install. The plug connects easily to the AP and easily to the purple female connector on my car's ECU under the driver's side dash - stupidly simple. I followed the directions on the AP screen (tells you to switch the key to the on (but not running) position and from there it prompts you with a few more easy to follow steps and then commences the download, showing a % status bar along the way. ***Note, during this time, all the dash warning lights are going on and off and all sorts of failure messages are popping up and going away in the message dash cluster screen - this is normal Cobb assured and natural part of the ECU reflash. Don't panic here. It took about 15 minutes or so to complete successfully. Says that when you are done. The possessed dash lights all resolved and back to normal state. I unplugged everything and put the AP away.
Driving experience: I followed the directions to wait a min or so and then started the car drove away right after the install was done. The engine "rough" feeling and sounding for a few minutes - as if you got a new exhaust and there was some odd vibrations on revs over 4k. I was told by Cobb rep this would happen and not to worry it would go away after a few minutes and a few miles driven - it totally did. It was gone before I noticed again. Whew.
I let the engine warm nicely by driving slow around town for a few min until the oil temp was up past the blue zone (as I always do), then I started to dip my foot in the throttle a bit, first in normal mode. Right away, I noticed that I suddenly had more wind-up torque even at partial throttle. The car surged forward in a faster way than stock with the same throttle press distance. Nice. Cobb AP noticed! I began to press harder and harder, feeling how the PDK now interacted with the new higher boost level. Was it still linear? Yes, but. But what? It's a little different now, hard to put a finger on it though, I'm still processing this in my head and will update further when I drive more. For now, my initial impression is that you now notice that your car has turbos, for real. S and GTS cars always had a bit of lag before the heavy power delivery and now so does the Base. Although not as fast, the beauty of the Base Carrera was it's awesome linear power delivery with perfectly calibrated PDK rhythms. It's no longer as silky smooth now with Stage 1 93 running. But it is very noticeably faster now - the car has been transformed to a more frenetic and fast machine, delivering the feel in your hands and butt that the car has serious boost thrust now. And your speedo quickly shows speeds way faster than you used to be at at the same throttle input in the same gear. You're flying now. From a launch at the light perspective, the car is a rocket now, even partial throttle pull-away is amusing as you leave the cars behind in the dust, literally. The traction control intervention is more there now than stock - actually I barely ever noticed any TC when stock. I then drove in Sport mode for a while and the car is a certified animal. PDK and more boost and it's a ball of fun. A whole different car now, my brakes are now working ever harder as I'm asking more from them from all the throttle and speed fun.
So far my only small issue is that there is now a slight delay when you press the pedal down hard before the boost comes on and the car flies ahead, like, duh, it actually has turbos now. But again, Base owners never had any lag really, so it's a bit more boy-racer-ish now. Nice that with the COBB AP you can always uninstall if you want.
Do you stage 2 on the BASE? no way. no need. if you still need more power (in your head), turn off your TC once to invoke sport PSM or off completely - good luck, you'll realize how much power you always had. Stage 1 is perfect for Base owners. I'll update more as I go.
Only my humble opinion, but reading this confirms my fear (we need more fears now!) that I will lose some of the #1 love of mine on the base engine, and that is the glorious linear power. In the city, you truly don't "need" more power than the base. But I absolutely love the linear feel and how the power comes on...it's addictive. That is my big concern about doing the COBB is that you will lose some of that for the sake of more power. Thank you for your comprehensive review, very well done.
03-20-2020, 02:11 PM
#303
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Give it more miles Robdokwon since I think you will be see the perceived lag disappear, or mostly go away - please report back after 100-200 more miles.
03-20-2020, 03:43 PM
#304
I will give it more time and miles and report back - I'm open minded.
Nicholas - you sound just like I did before I placed the order. I love the driving feel of the base 991.2 - I test drove every freakin model, 5 times, and nothing felt as direct and slot-linear as the Base model with PDK. It's like the purest car ever, I know what you mean. I wouldn't say that characteristic is gone, it's just amped up now with faster spooling boost thrust that pushes you back in your seat harder. As for city driving, yeah, the Base is more than fast.
Here's why I went ahead with the tune anyway: I call it the "Dad" test. My dad weighs 220 pounds, all his life. Every time I got a new "fast" car over the years (disclaimer, I'm talking about real-world cars, not exotics, c'mon man), I would be loving life, driving myself, wife, friends around, whoever and impressing them with speed they could feel. Then a few weeks later, my dad would come by and I would take him for a ride. And that fat-*** 220lb'er would literally turn my car into a slow-*** POS. There's something about my father's 220 lbs that's basically equal to placing a 400 lb anvil in your car. The man legitimately destroys 0-60 times in every car he ever sits in. Not sure how he does it (unwittingly!) but all the accel feel in a car is GONE once he sits in for a ride. GONE. So, as fast as the Base Carrera is, I am preparing for a ride with my father in advance. Cobb** your stage 1 better pass the dad weight-add test!! LOL
My dad would even kill the accel in an 812 Superfast, just sayin' - there's a reason most F1 drivers are all thin and lean and short. It matters.
Nicholas - you sound just like I did before I placed the order. I love the driving feel of the base 991.2 - I test drove every freakin model, 5 times, and nothing felt as direct and slot-linear as the Base model with PDK. It's like the purest car ever, I know what you mean. I wouldn't say that characteristic is gone, it's just amped up now with faster spooling boost thrust that pushes you back in your seat harder. As for city driving, yeah, the Base is more than fast.
Here's why I went ahead with the tune anyway: I call it the "Dad" test. My dad weighs 220 pounds, all his life. Every time I got a new "fast" car over the years (disclaimer, I'm talking about real-world cars, not exotics, c'mon man), I would be loving life, driving myself, wife, friends around, whoever and impressing them with speed they could feel. Then a few weeks later, my dad would come by and I would take him for a ride. And that fat-*** 220lb'er would literally turn my car into a slow-*** POS. There's something about my father's 220 lbs that's basically equal to placing a 400 lb anvil in your car. The man legitimately destroys 0-60 times in every car he ever sits in. Not sure how he does it (unwittingly!) but all the accel feel in a car is GONE once he sits in for a ride. GONE. So, as fast as the Base Carrera is, I am preparing for a ride with my father in advance. Cobb** your stage 1 better pass the dad weight-add test!! LOL
My dad would even kill the accel in an 812 Superfast, just sayin' - there's a reason most F1 drivers are all thin and lean and short. It matters.
03-20-2020, 03:52 PM
#305
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The purest car ever would have a manual.
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Stevelev (03-21-2020)
03-20-2020, 04:27 PM
#306
Wrong. Depends on the car in question. The 991.2 does not feel right with a stick. I am a manual Purest myself. But the operational feel of the stick shift with the 3 L turbo in the base Carrera did not feel as sublime and natural as it does in the 991.1. The PDK is telepathically mated to the 991.2 platform. In almost all of the previous Porsche’s I would always get a stick. But it’s not the best solution for the 991.2.
The other reality is there is absolutely zero way anyone can shift a manual transmission as fast as the PDK in the 991.2 generation can. So in terms of crisp and linear power delivery to the wheels, in and out of acceleration and braking, the dual clutch transmission is light years more instant and direct than rowing gears with the clutch. Again, I say this as a manual loving car enthusiast. It’s just the raw hard facts.
that said, my point has absolutely nothing to do with how much fun it is to drive a manual transmission, which I would agree is a much more involving and satisfying experience overall. In the 991.1 naturally aspirated engine the manual shifter is an amazing experience and I would choose that over PDK every day of the week. But the PDK was much better matched with the newer turbo engines in the 991.2.
The other reality is there is absolutely zero way anyone can shift a manual transmission as fast as the PDK in the 991.2 generation can. So in terms of crisp and linear power delivery to the wheels, in and out of acceleration and braking, the dual clutch transmission is light years more instant and direct than rowing gears with the clutch. Again, I say this as a manual loving car enthusiast. It’s just the raw hard facts.
that said, my point has absolutely nothing to do with how much fun it is to drive a manual transmission, which I would agree is a much more involving and satisfying experience overall. In the 991.1 naturally aspirated engine the manual shifter is an amazing experience and I would choose that over PDK every day of the week. But the PDK was much better matched with the newer turbo engines in the 991.2.
03-20-2020, 04:34 PM
#307
I dig my manual.
Rowing gears is fun, albeit maybe half a second slower.
Numeric shifter has been a big win too. Much tighter.
No complaints Cobb+Manual+Numeric
Rowing gears is fun, albeit maybe half a second slower.
Numeric shifter has been a big win too. Much tighter.
No complaints Cobb+Manual+Numeric
03-20-2020, 04:35 PM
#308
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I did not say the purest car ever would be a 991 or even a Porsche, but it would have a manual for sure IMO.
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NightBlueTTS (03-20-2020)
03-20-2020, 04:47 PM
#309
All:
I'm not a P-car owner currently and am (pre-COVID) evaluating a 991.2 T / C2/ C4 / C4S / GTS 7MT as my choice to replace my 2015 BMW m3 6mt. Still figuring out the must have options but really like what I see in a 911 T 7mt with the standard interior package, RAS, and FAL (I have a steep driveway entrance...I scrape slightly on a stock m3....is what it is).
Wanted to share experiences on tuning in general plus a question on what I read in this thread. Question will be submitted next...
On tuning: Cobb is an amazing, high quality tuner with an incredible OTS product that has stood the test of time across many platforms and iterations. Cobb's name means something, just like APRs name means something. You can count on them not ruining your vehicle and you can count on them supporting your product.
Previous posters are current that a "pro-tune" or better described as a personalized tune for your engine is ultimately going to give the best and safest results at any point in time. In an ideal world, you want your cylinders to be getting an IDEAL amount of fuel and air and timing at any given engine temperature, air intake temperature, fuel octane, cylinder temps/exhaust temps, etc.
You can't get that with an off the shelf (OTS) tune. You can only get as close to "perfect" as possible with a personalized and professional tune. They will ALWAYS be able to optimize the car for power output and closer-to-ideal parameters to ensure your engine is neither running lean (hot, bad, likely to knock) or running rich (too much fuel staying unburnt during combustion, not really good either though generally safer).
Why? Because your vehicle, ambient air quality/density, vehicle state of tune, fuel quality, and driving parameters are going to be somewhat unique.
Now here's the flip side of that.....a pro-tune is going to tune your car for what it is TODAY and MAY NOT be ideal in 20k miles when your plugs are worn, your air filter is near end of it's life, your fuel quality changed, etc....
And that's the upside of an OTS tune. They are generally built to a wider set of parameters to stay safe. They will, generally speaking, exchange less power output and running richer in exchange for a safer tune under a wider set of circumstances. Think about it this way: Cobb's off the shelf tune has got to be able to be installed on a 911 in a lower quality air environment, in a poorer state of tune (I.e. plugs and air filter state), in -10 degree weather or 120 degree temps.....and still run reliably well.
A good pro-tuner CAN and WILL create a tune that is still better than OTS and still very reliable and well suited for you for a wide variety of circumstances you are likely to encounter.
But that's what you are generally doing when you go Pro-tune vs OTS. You are trading a more generic tune that applies to a broader set of environments and conservative fueling and timing for something that will be more precise for your circumstances.
Personally I'd rather run a pro-tune on my car with the convenience of a Cobb AP. That's just me....
I'm not a P-car owner currently and am (pre-COVID) evaluating a 991.2 T / C2/ C4 / C4S / GTS 7MT as my choice to replace my 2015 BMW m3 6mt. Still figuring out the must have options but really like what I see in a 911 T 7mt with the standard interior package, RAS, and FAL (I have a steep driveway entrance...I scrape slightly on a stock m3....is what it is).
Wanted to share experiences on tuning in general plus a question on what I read in this thread. Question will be submitted next...
On tuning: Cobb is an amazing, high quality tuner with an incredible OTS product that has stood the test of time across many platforms and iterations. Cobb's name means something, just like APRs name means something. You can count on them not ruining your vehicle and you can count on them supporting your product.
Previous posters are current that a "pro-tune" or better described as a personalized tune for your engine is ultimately going to give the best and safest results at any point in time. In an ideal world, you want your cylinders to be getting an IDEAL amount of fuel and air and timing at any given engine temperature, air intake temperature, fuel octane, cylinder temps/exhaust temps, etc.
You can't get that with an off the shelf (OTS) tune. You can only get as close to "perfect" as possible with a personalized and professional tune. They will ALWAYS be able to optimize the car for power output and closer-to-ideal parameters to ensure your engine is neither running lean (hot, bad, likely to knock) or running rich (too much fuel staying unburnt during combustion, not really good either though generally safer).
Why? Because your vehicle, ambient air quality/density, vehicle state of tune, fuel quality, and driving parameters are going to be somewhat unique.
Now here's the flip side of that.....a pro-tune is going to tune your car for what it is TODAY and MAY NOT be ideal in 20k miles when your plugs are worn, your air filter is near end of it's life, your fuel quality changed, etc....
And that's the upside of an OTS tune. They are generally built to a wider set of parameters to stay safe. They will, generally speaking, exchange less power output and running richer in exchange for a safer tune under a wider set of circumstances. Think about it this way: Cobb's off the shelf tune has got to be able to be installed on a 911 in a lower quality air environment, in a poorer state of tune (I.e. plugs and air filter state), in -10 degree weather or 120 degree temps.....and still run reliably well.
A good pro-tuner CAN and WILL create a tune that is still better than OTS and still very reliable and well suited for you for a wide variety of circumstances you are likely to encounter.
But that's what you are generally doing when you go Pro-tune vs OTS. You are trading a more generic tune that applies to a broader set of environments and conservative fueling and timing for something that will be more precise for your circumstances.
Personally I'd rather run a pro-tune on my car with the convenience of a Cobb AP. That's just me....
03-20-2020, 04:51 PM
#310
My question is this:
Ive been DDing an f80 m3 for 5.5 years in Southeast PA. With 425hp and about 425 lb/fts torque (likely a tad underrated) in a 3,450 pound vehicle (weighed at a weigh station, I was not in the vehicle and it had 3 gallons of fuel in the tank), I've found this platform has too little traction for it's power. I'm CONSTANTLY traction limited in large part because 180 days a year in PA it's either wet, snowy, or below 50 degrees ambient.
Now the 911 has a much better chassis, suspension, weight distribution, and rear tire setup so it will simply do much better. But here I am considering a Carerra T 7mt which weighs ~3100-3200 pounds and tuning it to ~450-500 crank hp (Stage 1, maybe pro-tuned) and thinking to myself: Am I going to run into the same traction issues all over again.
For those with experience driving a stage 1 vehicle in colder weather or on wet roads, are you finding yourself frustrated with very regular traction control intervention?
Thank you,
Joe
Ive been DDing an f80 m3 for 5.5 years in Southeast PA. With 425hp and about 425 lb/fts torque (likely a tad underrated) in a 3,450 pound vehicle (weighed at a weigh station, I was not in the vehicle and it had 3 gallons of fuel in the tank), I've found this platform has too little traction for it's power. I'm CONSTANTLY traction limited in large part because 180 days a year in PA it's either wet, snowy, or below 50 degrees ambient.
Now the 911 has a much better chassis, suspension, weight distribution, and rear tire setup so it will simply do much better. But here I am considering a Carerra T 7mt which weighs ~3100-3200 pounds and tuning it to ~450-500 crank hp (Stage 1, maybe pro-tuned) and thinking to myself: Am I going to run into the same traction issues all over again.
For those with experience driving a stage 1 vehicle in colder weather or on wet roads, are you finding yourself frustrated with very regular traction control intervention?
Thank you,
Joe
03-20-2020, 06:46 PM
#311
JoefromPA - As a former BMW guy for years (and still a huge fan, having tracked many M3s, M4s and M5s) I can tell you your keen nose landed you in the right spot so far - you def want a T. And it's an exception to my note to Bob above about PDK vs. Manual that i neglected to mention. The short throw shifter in the T is awesome mated to the 3.0l turbo motor. It bangs into gear with violence at the higher revs and is intoxicating. That test drive was the best ever of my 30 plus test drives over past year. I also drove it with PDK and its great but not as visceral. Coming from the M3, you will fall quickly in love with the T. It's so much lighter and with the light nose and high grip rear traction it's a whole next level of driving fun. you can do so much more with a porsche 911 than you can with what at the end of the day was a really great sports front engined, rear drive sedan. Apples and Oranges. the reason I skipped the T was i need a rear defroster and the T's rear window doesnt have one - it's a plastic window for weight savings. ONLY REASON.
As for traction, I'm puzzled by your question. if you accelerate or corner too hard for conditions TC will always kick in, However, in the Porsche, its not as weird as in BMWs - it's still fun. In a 3100 lb T with a Tune, you'll be in a tree if you don't keep TC on. You can do 123 mph in 3rd gear, like THAT. There's really no room on public streets to drive the T to its proper capability, ditto forall of these cars.
As for traction, I'm puzzled by your question. if you accelerate or corner too hard for conditions TC will always kick in, However, in the Porsche, its not as weird as in BMWs - it's still fun. In a 3100 lb T with a Tune, you'll be in a tree if you don't keep TC on. You can do 123 mph in 3rd gear, like THAT. There's really no room on public streets to drive the T to its proper capability, ditto forall of these cars.
03-20-2020, 07:30 PM
#312
If you think the T manual is good you haven't tried this... https://rennlist.com/forums/market/1177970
03-20-2020, 07:56 PM
#313
Wrong. Depends on the car in question. The 991.2 does not feel right with a stick. I am a manual Purest myself. But the operational feel of the stick shift with the 3 L turbo in the base Carrera did not feel as sublime and natural as it does in the 991.1. The PDK is telepathically mated to the 991.2 platform. In almost all of the previous Porsche’s I would always get a stick. But it’s not the best solution for the 991.2.
The other reality is there is absolutely zero way anyone can shift a manual transmission as fast as the PDK in the 991.2 generation can. So in terms of crisp and linear power delivery to the wheels, in and out of acceleration and braking, the dual clutch transmission is light years more instant and direct than rowing gears with the clutch. Again, I say this as a manual loving car enthusiast. It’s just the raw hard facts.
that said, my point has absolutely nothing to do with how much fun it is to drive a manual transmission, which I would agree is a much more involving and satisfying experience overall. In the 991.1 naturally aspirated engine the manual shifter is an amazing experience and I would choose that over PDK every day of the week. But the PDK was much better matched with the newer turbo engines in the 991.2.
The other reality is there is absolutely zero way anyone can shift a manual transmission as fast as the PDK in the 991.2 generation can. So in terms of crisp and linear power delivery to the wheels, in and out of acceleration and braking, the dual clutch transmission is light years more instant and direct than rowing gears with the clutch. Again, I say this as a manual loving car enthusiast. It’s just the raw hard facts.
that said, my point has absolutely nothing to do with how much fun it is to drive a manual transmission, which I would agree is a much more involving and satisfying experience overall. In the 991.1 naturally aspirated engine the manual shifter is an amazing experience and I would choose that over PDK every day of the week. But the PDK was much better matched with the newer turbo engines in the 991.2.
03-20-2020, 11:35 PM
#314
Rob - I appreciate the thorough-ness of your posts. With that said, I think pure means back to basics. And that includes a MT. Regardless of how good or bad it is. Fun, enjoyment, excitement ect are all what a purist is looking for. Not how an auto is mated to the trans, how you dont loose boost between shifts, and especially how much faster the PDK is. We know and accept the PDK is better yet still choose the MT because its pure and basic fun.
Hope everyone is faring ok cloistered at home all day and night.
03-20-2020, 11:49 PM
#315
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Totally get it. I am still a purist as well. My other car is a stick and I love every minute I'm rowing the gears. There's nothing like it. But for my 991.2 I'm tracking the car so no-brainer had to get the PDK, and it just feels better in that car IMO.
Hope everyone is faring ok cloistered at home all day and night.
Hope everyone is faring ok cloistered at home all day and night.
Otherwise, FL is fine, and there are no cases (yet) in our county; however, dinner out is not possibility. Beaches are open and I still walk there every day, and I have my own bar and the weather here is perfect so I cannot complain but it is hard deciding to drop the top for a ride in the car or take a ride on the Harley each day...make the best of worst case situation.