New 911 Carrera T: a completely pointless marketing exercise
#181
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A different perspective...
I am finding this Carrera T increasingly fascinating.
1. I really like that Porsche is making an upgraded model about more than horsepower/torque. it's about the performance bits - the weight, the RWS, the PASM, the gear ratios -- as well as the experience -- the sound and the look.
2. consider this an alternative to the "Black Series", which was truly an end-of-model generation "parts bin special". nothing wrong with the Black Series, but in all honesty, nothing special. just a discounted base carrera with cosmetic bits. This is actually a DIFFERENT 911. which I love. I bet Porsche will consider making a "lightweight" or "touring" package for future 911s across the range - S, GTS. It depends on the response to this Carrera T.
While I hate "bench racing", I would like to address all this concern about inadequate performance from these "base" carreras: C&D got the PDK base C2 0-60 in 3.4 seconds. That is absurd and more performance than almost anyone needs out there. I bet they can get this C2T 0-60 in 3.3 seconds. Just outrageous.
I like it!!!
W
I am finding this Carrera T increasingly fascinating.
1. I really like that Porsche is making an upgraded model about more than horsepower/torque. it's about the performance bits - the weight, the RWS, the PASM, the gear ratios -- as well as the experience -- the sound and the look.
2. consider this an alternative to the "Black Series", which was truly an end-of-model generation "parts bin special". nothing wrong with the Black Series, but in all honesty, nothing special. just a discounted base carrera with cosmetic bits. This is actually a DIFFERENT 911. which I love. I bet Porsche will consider making a "lightweight" or "touring" package for future 911s across the range - S, GTS. It depends on the response to this Carrera T.
While I hate "bench racing", I would like to address all this concern about inadequate performance from these "base" carreras: C&D got the PDK base C2 0-60 in 3.4 seconds. That is absurd and more performance than almost anyone needs out there. I bet they can get this C2T 0-60 in 3.3 seconds. Just outrageous.
I like it!!!
W
Last edited by wwspeeds; 10-23-2017 at 11:30 PM.
#183
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991.1 and 991.2 Owners
#184
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I for one am excited about the 911 T - looks like it will be a great dual use street/DE car.
It’s a little disappointing that they seem to have cut back on exclusive options (e.g. no PTS, no deviated leather options and limited deviated stitching choices, etc.), but maybe its for the best if it forces buyers to keep the car simple (vs. getting, say, a GTS and adding another $35K in options).
I hope it has the Porsche Track Precision app like the 718 GTS
It’s a little disappointing that they seem to have cut back on exclusive options (e.g. no PTS, no deviated leather options and limited deviated stitching choices, etc.), but maybe its for the best if it forces buyers to keep the car simple (vs. getting, say, a GTS and adding another $35K in options).
I hope it has the Porsche Track Precision app like the 718 GTS
#185
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Nope. While I have insider knowledge on some stuff and have to keep my clap trapped about some things I see and/or drive, I didn't see this model coming. Knew something about a "911T," but not before submitting my order for a 991.2 Carrera MT—and I had no idea the T would get the SPASM I wanted and a host of other cool mechanical upgrades. No one knows/sees it all—it's part of what keeps Porsche interesting to me. This 991 breaks from 20+ years of model strategy (think 964 RSA, which is the right link). It was off the radar because it wasn't GT, and off the radar because the mules (if there were any) would have been invisible.
Still, this stings a bit. The T would have been a better bridge from my GT4 to 991.2 Carrera land. Alas, maybe it's good to get "stung" alongside the rest of the community from time to time—and I can't exactly complain about the Carrera. It was good enough 2 years ago in Tenerife to make me consider canceling my GT4 order.
Still, this stings a bit. The T would have been a better bridge from my GT4 to 991.2 Carrera land. Alas, maybe it's good to get "stung" alongside the rest of the community from time to time—and I can't exactly complain about the Carrera. It was good enough 2 years ago in Tenerife to make me consider canceling my GT4 order.
The sound deadening reduction is what makes me downright giddy, finally this company is realizing that a sizable chunk of enthusiasts want a raw sportscar, not just a fast one.
The GT3 was always that car (excluding the brief stint of PDKism), but it was inaccessible to almost everyone. Even those with the money couldn't get one.
This car represents a return to form; it's far from the perfect enthusiast's 911, but it's accessible, the RS-A of our day.
I'll end this off with a quote:
"YOU CAN'T LIE TO THE MOUNTAIN.
You can lie to your friends with facts and figures, spoilers and splitters.
You can lie to the racetrack with absurd power, yards of tire width, and a double-clutch transmission.
But you can't lie to the mountain."
Does anyone besides me know who wrote it?
#186
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Originally Posted by R_Rated
How do you like that 3.4? I have an S and sometimes think the 3.4 would have been a better car after driving a couple 3.4 cars.
I hear Porsche is considering taking the 4.0 out of the GT3 and replacing it with the 991.1 3.4. Measuring 0-60 with a calendar instead of a stopwatch is just so much more rewarding.
Last edited by sticky; 10-24-2017 at 12:35 AM.
#187
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A different perspective...
I am finding this Carrera T increasingly fascinating.
1. I really like that Porsche is making an upgraded model about more than horsepower/torque. it's about the performance bits - the weight, the RWS, the PASM, the gear ratios -- as well as the experience -- the sound and the look.
2. consider this an alternative to the "Black Series", which was truly an end-of-model generation "parts bin special". nothing wrong with the Black Series, but in all honesty, nothing special. just a discounted base carrera with cosmetic bits. This is actually a DIFFERENT 911. which I love. I bet Porsche will consider making a "lightweight" or "touring" package for future 911s across the range - S, GTS. It depends on the response to this Carrera T.
While I hate "bench racing", I would like to address all this concern about inadequate performance from these "base" carreras: C&D got the PDK base C2 0-60 in 3.4 seconds. That is absurd and more performance than almost anyone needs out there. I bet they can get this C2T 0-60 in 3.3 seconds. Just outrageous.
I like it!!!
W
I am finding this Carrera T increasingly fascinating.
1. I really like that Porsche is making an upgraded model about more than horsepower/torque. it's about the performance bits - the weight, the RWS, the PASM, the gear ratios -- as well as the experience -- the sound and the look.
2. consider this an alternative to the "Black Series", which was truly an end-of-model generation "parts bin special". nothing wrong with the Black Series, but in all honesty, nothing special. just a discounted base carrera with cosmetic bits. This is actually a DIFFERENT 911. which I love. I bet Porsche will consider making a "lightweight" or "touring" package for future 911s across the range - S, GTS. It depends on the response to this Carrera T.
While I hate "bench racing", I would like to address all this concern about inadequate performance from these "base" carreras: C&D got the PDK base C2 0-60 in 3.4 seconds. That is absurd and more performance than almost anyone needs out there. I bet they can get this C2T 0-60 in 3.3 seconds. Just outrageous.
I like it!!!
W
They address every issue. RWS? Check. Locking mechanical diff? Check. Less sound deadening? Check. Rear seat delete and weight stripped out? Check.
If people think of this in terms of being an accessible 911 R they will start to understand the premise.
Not to mention, with GTS turbos talk about GT3 humbling performance for a fraction of the price.
I'm in love.
Last edited by sticky; 10-24-2017 at 02:49 AM.
#189
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Too bad rear seat delete is only in conjunction with the sport buckets.
#190
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And if you don’t want to sell LWBs (given the T are no GT3 stripe and can be had in black stitiching with the somewhat generic 911 headrest script they should be appealing to many unlike the ones with other script — crests are obviously the most universal), someone will buy the rear seats to put in a GT3. I might just to show people it can be done (I have neither kids nor short friends). I have metal fab contacts and I am sure the brackets can be made easily and cheaply enough and the rest is nuts and bolts swapping stuff from a rear seat delete car.
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I too have been playing with the configurator since Noon-ish
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#193
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As an aside, no 991 is ever going to be that level of “fun.” Putting things in perspective about the add lightness of the T, an Elise (or Exige S 260 sport) is under 2000lbs. The only sound deadening is two small pieces of deadening glued under the seats and some foam behind the back plastic panel (I took mine out on my Exige S and you could not hear yourself think over the blower whine 8in behind you). There is no carpet, only two removable floor mats. You can easily pick up the seat with its rails with one hand, only the driver’s adjusts and then only manual front to back. Oh and they have coilovers (adjustable on the track package), LSD option, no nannies other than ABS (traction control was an option but it sucked), no dynamic stability control, 8700rpm redline with the nutso cam changeover at 6k rpm or so on the Elise which had a similar effect to a turbo kicking in on a 930. Keeping it on the second cam without bouncing off the rev limiter required split second precision shifts (which was not that easy being that the cable shifter was barely attached to the floor). Maybe if you stripped a 991 down to the level of the pike’s peak 991.1 turbo or bought a cup car you would get close, but then you are dealing with a unibody car that is large and relatively heavy as opposed to some glued together aluminium chassis ensconced in fiberglass or carbon fiber. The only thing that was remotely stout on the car was the roll bar (thank god!). My lotus were fun. Too much fun. They are also about as safe as a motorcycle and are up there with a 930 as far as widow making.
Everything is a compromise and I think Porsche got that compromise right with the T. It has the good handling stuff from the S (PTV (aka mechanical diff lock), SPASM, available RWS, presumably the slightly numerically lower final drive) a few uber cool things from the R/GT3 (sport chrono no wart, door pulls, LWBs, RSD), adds a little lightness, and eliminates the most obnioxious cosmetic issue of the 991 Carrera — the silver dash and console trim. Pretty much the RL wish list (minus NA and 6MT).
My only gripes are that no PTS/LTS and you have to pay an additional $910 for alcantara steering wheel and shift **** when you spec LWBs. I hate alcantara. I guess Porsche ordered too many steering wheels in alcantara before they figured out the GT3 touring was coming. And no, I won’t be trading my GT3 allocation for one and I would still go with a stripper base in PTS/LTS, but if for nothing else LWBs and RSD (and the lower price compared to an S/GTS with basically the same engine) make it the best bet in the Carrera line up.
#194
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with all the lightweight options, a manual transmission, it is a great Touring car, lighter than a GT3/GT3RS and without the waiting list drama. The base engine has enough torque for fun drives.