OT: My full Review of the 2016 Viper ACR
12-31-2015, 01:56 PM
#226
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this is all you need to read about the viper:
"I'M NOT A NERVOUS PASSENGER, but when SRT's Chris Winkler shifts into fifth at the same place I normally hit the brakes and turns what I consider a 110-mph right-hander into a 135-mph no-brake right-hander by hucking the steering wheel of the Viper ACR as hard as he can and letting the massive rear wing sort out the stability, I have to work very hard not to vomit. "
"The process can be more violent than most people are used to," Winkler notes without the slightest bit of irony to his tone, "but with the wide Kumho virtual race slicks and all the aero grip available, it's typically the fastest way around." When it's my turn to drive the ACR, I simply cannot do what Winkler does. My brain won't let me. It cannot believe in the wing."
if that gets you feeling tingly skinned (or not...)
"I'M NOT A NERVOUS PASSENGER, but when SRT's Chris Winkler shifts into fifth at the same place I normally hit the brakes and turns what I consider a 110-mph right-hander into a 135-mph no-brake right-hander by hucking the steering wheel of the Viper ACR as hard as he can and letting the massive rear wing sort out the stability, I have to work very hard not to vomit. "
"The process can be more violent than most people are used to," Winkler notes without the slightest bit of irony to his tone, "but with the wide Kumho virtual race slicks and all the aero grip available, it's typically the fastest way around." When it's my turn to drive the ACR, I simply cannot do what Winkler does. My brain won't let me. It cannot believe in the wing."
if that gets you feeling tingly skinned (or not...)
But not a beginner track car but it reads to me that being as fast as the car is capable will separating the man from the PDKS boys ;-)
12-31-2015, 03:00 PM
#227
Instructor
This is great! Mine arrives in mid Feb. Can't wait to get it. For me, it's a track only car, could care less about street driving it. I'll put a 100 miles on it, send it to have the head/cam, headers/exhaust ecu package done, then track the hell out of it. It's going to be fun going back and forth from my Cayman S race car to this. RS will be another garage queen...
12-31-2015, 06:50 PM
#229
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Cj was really rolling in the ACR in his first day at Chuckwalla, it was fun to watch. I was thinking the car would be a good track day car from the previous TA I saw at COTA and from Cj's original write-up. After seeing the car at Chuck, I think it is the best performance for the money - and it is not all nannied up!
Let up know how the sub-1:52 goes...
Let up know how the sub-1:52 goes...
12-31-2015, 07:53 PM
#230
12-31-2015, 07:59 PM
#231
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Does the ACR/E require very advanced track expertise to extract its performance, or is the wing/body downforce actually kind of "forgiving", allowing average track drivers to get great times?
12-31-2015, 08:04 PM
#233
12-31-2015, 09:16 PM
#235
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Average drivers will have a hard time with driving the car smoothly, that is really the hardest thing about the car to manage.
You don't get wheelspin compared to most other cars unless you are full throttle exiting a chicane in 2nd gear. Above that it just hooks up. That builds confidence- like most front engined cars it won't snap oversteer unless you are 100% planted on throttle with a huge amount of wheel turned in.
Aero allows you to throw the car into corners faster and faster but creates a semi-neutral understeer that is only cured by taking 5-20% out of the gas pedal or using a little left foot brake depending on the phase of the corner. If you go to the F3 school at Sonoma/Infineon/Simraceway or Dirtfish rally school in Seattle they will teach you how to drive around that type of action.
You have to be mentally ahead of the car to extract the best performance. Since you can get 1.7G in a corner, the fastest way around most tracks is to build that G-load slowly and you do that by taking huge radius for every corner. You roll massive speed by using the brakes less- no need to go to a 10 pedal unless it's a super hairpin off a 5th gear straight.
Basically it's a very analog car with incredible tuning and with the suspension setup "track setting" from the owners manual, you can go faster than you will ever go in another car. If you can do a 2:00 on a lap in your 997GT3RS you can do a 1:56-1:57 in this car regardless of the track configuration without improving your skills.
Terminal velocity is hindered due to massive drag- compared to my P1 the straights are at least 10-15mph slower. because of increased tire grip you don't have to brake as much to enter the non-aero corners (50-80mph)
All settled now?
12-31-2015, 10:08 PM
#236
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That is a great question.
Average drivers will have a hard time with driving the car smoothly, that is really the hardest thing about the car to manage.
You don't get wheelspin compared to most other cars unless you are full throttle exiting a chicane in 2nd gear. Above that it just hooks up. That builds confidence- like most front engined cars it won't snap oversteer unless you are 100% planted on throttle with a huge amount of wheel turned in.
Aero allows you to throw the car into corners faster and faster but creates a semi-neutral understeer that is only cured by taking 5-20% out of the gas pedal or using a little left foot brake depending on the phase of the corner. If you go to the F3 school at Sonoma/Infineon/Simraceway or Dirtfish rally school in Seattle they will teach you how to drive around that type of action.
You have to be mentally ahead of the car to extract the best performance. Since you can get 1.7G in a corner, the fastest way around most tracks is to build that G-load slowly and you do that by taking huge radius for every corner. You roll massive speed by using the brakes less- no need to go to a 10 pedal unless it's a super hairpin off a 5th gear straight.
Basically it's a very analog car with incredible tuning and with the suspension setup "track setting" from the owners manual, you can go faster than you will ever go in another car. If you can do a 2:00 on a lap in your 997GT3RS you can do a 1:56-1:57 in this car regardless of the track configuration without improving your skills.
Terminal velocity is hindered due to massive drag- compared to my P1 the straights are at least 10-15mph slower. because of increased tire grip you don't have to brake as much to enter the non-aero corners (50-80mph)
All settled now?
Average drivers will have a hard time with driving the car smoothly, that is really the hardest thing about the car to manage.
You don't get wheelspin compared to most other cars unless you are full throttle exiting a chicane in 2nd gear. Above that it just hooks up. That builds confidence- like most front engined cars it won't snap oversteer unless you are 100% planted on throttle with a huge amount of wheel turned in.
Aero allows you to throw the car into corners faster and faster but creates a semi-neutral understeer that is only cured by taking 5-20% out of the gas pedal or using a little left foot brake depending on the phase of the corner. If you go to the F3 school at Sonoma/Infineon/Simraceway or Dirtfish rally school in Seattle they will teach you how to drive around that type of action.
You have to be mentally ahead of the car to extract the best performance. Since you can get 1.7G in a corner, the fastest way around most tracks is to build that G-load slowly and you do that by taking huge radius for every corner. You roll massive speed by using the brakes less- no need to go to a 10 pedal unless it's a super hairpin off a 5th gear straight.
Basically it's a very analog car with incredible tuning and with the suspension setup "track setting" from the owners manual, you can go faster than you will ever go in another car. If you can do a 2:00 on a lap in your 997GT3RS you can do a 1:56-1:57 in this car regardless of the track configuration without improving your skills.
Terminal velocity is hindered due to massive drag- compared to my P1 the straights are at least 10-15mph slower. because of increased tire grip you don't have to brake as much to enter the non-aero corners (50-80mph)
All settled now?
01-04-2016, 10:41 AM
#237
Track Configurations?
That is a great question.
Average drivers will have a hard time with driving the car smoothly, that is really the hardest thing about the car to manage.
You don't get wheelspin compared to most other cars unless you are full throttle exiting a chicane in 2nd gear. Above that it just hooks up. That builds confidence- like most front engined cars it won't snap oversteer unless you are 100% planted on throttle with a huge amount of wheel turned in.
Aero allows you to throw the car into corners faster and faster but creates a semi-neutral understeer that is only cured by taking 5-20% out of the gas pedal or using a little left foot brake depending on the phase of the corner. If you go to the F3 school at Sonoma/Infineon/Simraceway or Dirtfish rally school in Seattle they will teach you how to drive around that type of action.
You have to be mentally ahead of the car to extract the best performance. Since you can get 1.7G in a corner, the fastest way around most tracks is to build that G-load slowly and you do that by taking huge radius for every corner. You roll massive speed by using the brakes less- no need to go to a 10 pedal unless it's a super hairpin off a 5th gear straight.
Basically it's a very analog car with incredible tuning and with the suspension setup "track setting" from the owners manual, you can go faster than you will ever go in another car. If you can do a 2:00 on a lap in your 997GT3RS you can do a 1:56-1:57 in this car regardless of the track configuration without improving your skills.
Terminal velocity is hindered due to massive drag- compared to my P1 the straights are at least 10-15mph slower. because of increased tire grip you don't have to brake as much to enter the non-aero corners (50-80mph)
All settled now?
Average drivers will have a hard time with driving the car smoothly, that is really the hardest thing about the car to manage.
You don't get wheelspin compared to most other cars unless you are full throttle exiting a chicane in 2nd gear. Above that it just hooks up. That builds confidence- like most front engined cars it won't snap oversteer unless you are 100% planted on throttle with a huge amount of wheel turned in.
Aero allows you to throw the car into corners faster and faster but creates a semi-neutral understeer that is only cured by taking 5-20% out of the gas pedal or using a little left foot brake depending on the phase of the corner. If you go to the F3 school at Sonoma/Infineon/Simraceway or Dirtfish rally school in Seattle they will teach you how to drive around that type of action.
You have to be mentally ahead of the car to extract the best performance. Since you can get 1.7G in a corner, the fastest way around most tracks is to build that G-load slowly and you do that by taking huge radius for every corner. You roll massive speed by using the brakes less- no need to go to a 10 pedal unless it's a super hairpin off a 5th gear straight.
Basically it's a very analog car with incredible tuning and with the suspension setup "track setting" from the owners manual, you can go faster than you will ever go in another car. If you can do a 2:00 on a lap in your 997GT3RS you can do a 1:56-1:57 in this car regardless of the track configuration without improving your skills.
Terminal velocity is hindered due to massive drag- compared to my P1 the straights are at least 10-15mph slower. because of increased tire grip you don't have to brake as much to enter the non-aero corners (50-80mph)
All settled now?
Looks like there are enough RL'ers here that either own this car or are interested enough to post your suggestions?
I'm most curious about camber setup and what your shock settings are? The bump and rebound thing really confuses me and have NO idea where to even start?
Running the GT3 at Sebring, I found NOT hitting the suspension button (softer street setting) improved my times. While I feel turn 17 is bumpy, I've never felt it nearly as bad as others?
Alans, if you're out there I'm curious if you've played w/ your setup yet too?
01-04-2016, 11:36 AM
#238
The supplemental ACR manual has some good suggestions on where to start for track settings. Supposedly, Dodge was also going to provide the setups they used to set the record runs at the respective tracks.
01-04-2016, 01:09 PM
#239
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C.J., just read through entire thread and didn't see any posts for setup?
Looks like there are enough RL'ers here that either own this car or are interested enough to post your suggestions?
I'm most curious about camber setup and what your shock settings are? The bump and rebound thing really confuses me and have NO idea where to even start?
Running the GT3 at Sebring, I found NOT hitting the suspension button (softer street setting) improved my times. While I feel turn 17 is bumpy, I've never felt it nearly as bad as others?
Alans, if you're out there I'm curious if you've played w/ your setup yet too?
Looks like there are enough RL'ers here that either own this car or are interested enough to post your suggestions?
I'm most curious about camber setup and what your shock settings are? The bump and rebound thing really confuses me and have NO idea where to even start?
Running the GT3 at Sebring, I found NOT hitting the suspension button (softer street setting) improved my times. While I feel turn 17 is bumpy, I've never felt it nearly as bad as others?
Alans, if you're out there I'm curious if you've played w/ your setup yet too?
Betim told me they got my car corner balanced and cross weighted within 4 lbs and dialed the camber to -3.0 in the front. FWIW I found that to handle better than the -3.5 that V-EX had me set on- at -3.5 the inside edges of the front tires got roasted fairly quickly.
Overall the speed differential vs GT3 or other track cars in the Viper ACR comes from fast entry type corners as that is where the aero really pays off. Also the massively wide torque curve that allows you to pull out of a corner at 65mph in 3rd gear and run all the way to 115mph redline in the same gear. Most tracks will be exclusively 3rd and 4th gear in the ACR.
There is a front tire wear VS setup VS lap time continuum and it seems that I am on the super harsh edge with the Kumhos. They seem to perform best at 34-37 HOT psi in ambient temps of 50-70F. The problem is that if you run them to 39-40 they can blister really quickly (being a 25 section tire does not allow for much margin for error).
As such this car is really best on more of a time attack style approach- open track days with no run groups and going out for 6-7 laps at a time at maximum attack 6-8 times a day. If you go and try to run 40 minutes straight you will end up using over a half tank of gas and the tires will go from 26psi all the way to 38-40psi.
I have yet to cord or blister a rear tire but the fronts are really really fickle and I lose them quickly. After these few sets of Kumhos I will switch to the Hoosier R7 which is more robust but obviously requires a tow vehicle, trailer etc. I've just been driving the 90-140 miles to each track which is also not doing me any favors.
01-04-2016, 03:17 PM
#240
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