OT: My full Review of the 2016 Viper ACR
12-30-2015, 10:47 PM
#211
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So now that we see how much faster the ACR is on track, some will wonder what else could have been done to the 991 GT3 to make it better on track, at the expense of being less suited for the road.
I'd give priority to much more aggressive aero (more than the RS, and btw we don't need a top speed over 190 mph), grippier tires (just make the ACR tires in our sizes!), and suspension which is designed/tuned more specifically for the track (maybe dump PASM and go with stiffer springs and multi-way passive dampers?). This stuff might cut the delta between the ACR and GT3 by more than half.
Weight reduction would be nice, but seems that Porsche would charge a lot for it. More torque would be good too, especially if we have more aero, but maybe the engine is fine as is (if it doesn't blow - please go ahead and drop my rev limiter to 8750). PDK, RWS, and PTV+ can stay.
I'd give priority to much more aggressive aero (more than the RS, and btw we don't need a top speed over 190 mph), grippier tires (just make the ACR tires in our sizes!), and suspension which is designed/tuned more specifically for the track (maybe dump PASM and go with stiffer springs and multi-way passive dampers?). This stuff might cut the delta between the ACR and GT3 by more than half.
Weight reduction would be nice, but seems that Porsche would charge a lot for it. More torque would be good too, especially if we have more aero, but maybe the engine is fine as is (if it doesn't blow - please go ahead and drop my rev limiter to 8750). PDK, RWS, and PTV+ can stay.
12-30-2015, 11:38 PM
#212
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What is odd to me is why is the DD aspect is even popping up? For example, if you want the best combo of perf and DD in the Porsche line, why would you choose a GT3 over the Turbo S? The Turbo is the better daily driver and the faster car in most cases on the streets, so if you chose the GT3 instead, it speaks to wanting more track performance I believe. With the ACR, it is the ultimate in track performance with far less compromises on the market today.
Sometimes, and probably the majority of the time for me, it's about how the car performs and handles. In that respect, the GT3 is the better track car than the TT/TTS. And it still is as capable a daily driver as the TT/TTS unless you absolutely have to have AWD, or live in snowy climates.
12-31-2015, 12:08 AM
#213
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I agree the Extreme is a bit of a one-trick pony that has tons of compromise off the track. Also, it's built to a price point. LFA, Carrera GT, R8, Huracan are a bit more expensive and all will be slower on track. If I was not going to track the car, I'd have neither a GT3 nor ordered an Extreme. I'd have a new Z06 as IMO it's better on the street than either with a cavernous hatch area to give it a modicum of practicality.
It would be, to put it gently, misguided to buy an Extreme without the plan to use it extensively, if not primariliy, on track.
It would be, to put it gently, misguided to buy an Extreme without the plan to use it extensively, if not primariliy, on track.
12-31-2015, 12:21 AM
#214
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12-31-2015, 01:30 AM
#215
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Because it's not always about being faster -- either on the street or on the track.
Sometimes, and probably the majority of the time for me, it's about how the car performs and handles. In that respect, the GT3 is the better track car than the TT/TTS. And it still is as capable a daily driver as the TT/TTS unless you absolutely have to have AWD, or live in snowy climates.
Sometimes, and probably the majority of the time for me, it's about how the car performs and handles. In that respect, the GT3 is the better track car than the TT/TTS. And it still is as capable a daily driver as the TT/TTS unless you absolutely have to have AWD, or live in snowy climates.
My main point was the GT3 is a car trying to find an acceptable balance for track/street. The ACR has less intent on balancing with a much more biase to the track and I think that is not only ok, but desirable.
12-31-2015, 01:42 AM
#216
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I think you might have mis-read parts of my statement. Totally agree the GT3 is a better track car than the TT/TTS, but I disagree on them being close as daily drivers; unless you prefer stiffer ride, harsher shifting trans, louder, poorer gas mileage, less torque, etc.
My main point was the GT3 is a car trying to find an acceptable balance for track/street. The ACR has less intent on balancing with a much more biase to the track and I think that is not only ok, but desirable.
My main point was the GT3 is a car trying to find an acceptable balance for track/street. The ACR has less intent on balancing with a much more biase to the track and I think that is not only ok, but desirable.
But I think that's part of its problem. What makes it so sublime on the track, makes it equally ill-fitted as a road going daily vehicle.
There's nothing wrong with that.
But comparing the ACR to the GT3 is comparing the proverbial apples to oranges. Out of the box, stock, one is a dedicated track weapon (ACR), and the other is a dual-purpose threat (GT3).
Doesn't make one better or worse than the other, just that neither is a direct comparison to the other.
12-31-2015, 04:06 AM
#217
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This is great. I feel like I'm reading a message board dedicated to the end of Inception.
"It totally fell over!"
"No chance it falls over!"
I personally love a lot of cars, and have driven them as daily drivers, track beaters, garage queens etc but have to reiterate for a few people on here:
ACR is completely driveable, it's totally different than a Porsche.
GT3 have evolved into cars that are easier to extract 9/10ths at track from...996 was on crack compared to the 991. Porsche has come a long way in power, platform, and friendliness.
I was inspired to buy myself a Viper for the following reasons:
1) if you call Viper Exchange and ask for one, they have them and don't try to gouge you 100k over sticker
2) on most tracks it will be the baddest, fastest car at ANY price
2a) it is terrifying
2b) i like that you can defeat TCS and challenge it
3) my P1 will run out of warranty at some point
4) consumables and breakable parts on my LT/P1 are way more expensive
5) as good as a 991GT3 sounds compared to Viper, it doesn't offer me the ***** to the wall thrill
6) IT IS THE PRICE OF A REGULAR 991 C2S
7) everything is made out of carbon
8) it doesn't have the rebuild intervals of a 997 cup car, and i can drive to the track
9) if I have an off, chances are I can get replacement plastic parts for the diffuser etc
10) MANUAL TRANSMISSIONS
11) I have lots of other fun cars that are better DD or canyon cars etc
12) how many more years will companies be allowed to build V10 stick shift 8.4L engine cars?
If you are psyched up by my list you will love the car. If you are not psyched up by my list carry on, no harm no foul.
"It totally fell over!"
"No chance it falls over!"
I personally love a lot of cars, and have driven them as daily drivers, track beaters, garage queens etc but have to reiterate for a few people on here:
ACR is completely driveable, it's totally different than a Porsche.
GT3 have evolved into cars that are easier to extract 9/10ths at track from...996 was on crack compared to the 991. Porsche has come a long way in power, platform, and friendliness.
I was inspired to buy myself a Viper for the following reasons:
1) if you call Viper Exchange and ask for one, they have them and don't try to gouge you 100k over sticker
2) on most tracks it will be the baddest, fastest car at ANY price
2a) it is terrifying
2b) i like that you can defeat TCS and challenge it
3) my P1 will run out of warranty at some point
4) consumables and breakable parts on my LT/P1 are way more expensive
5) as good as a 991GT3 sounds compared to Viper, it doesn't offer me the ***** to the wall thrill
6) IT IS THE PRICE OF A REGULAR 991 C2S
7) everything is made out of carbon
8) it doesn't have the rebuild intervals of a 997 cup car, and i can drive to the track
9) if I have an off, chances are I can get replacement plastic parts for the diffuser etc
10) MANUAL TRANSMISSIONS
11) I have lots of other fun cars that are better DD or canyon cars etc
12) how many more years will companies be allowed to build V10 stick shift 8.4L engine cars?
If you are psyched up by my list you will love the car. If you are not psyched up by my list carry on, no harm no foul.
12-31-2015, 09:12 AM
#219
This is great. I feel like I'm reading a message board dedicated to the end of Inception.
"It totally fell over!"
"No chance it falls over!"
I personally love a lot of cars, and have driven them as daily drivers, track beaters, garage queens etc but have to reiterate for a few people on here:
ACR is completely driveable, it's totally different than a Porsche.
GT3 have evolved into cars that are easier to extract 9/10ths at track from...996 was on crack compared to the 991. Porsche has come a long way in power, platform, and friendliness.
I was inspired to buy myself a Viper for the following reasons:
1) if you call Viper Exchange and ask for one, they have them and don't try to gouge you 100k over sticker
2) on most tracks it will be the baddest, fastest car at ANY price
2a) it is terrifying
2b) i like that you can defeat TCS and challenge it
3) my P1 will run out of warranty at some point
4) consumables and breakable parts on my LT/P1 are way more expensive
5) as good as a 991GT3 sounds compared to Viper, it doesn't offer me the ***** to the wall thrill
6) IT IS THE PRICE OF A REGULAR 991 C2S
7) everything is made out of carbon
8) it doesn't have the rebuild intervals of a 997 cup car, and i can drive to the track
9) if I have an off, chances are I can get replacement plastic parts for the diffuser etc
10) MANUAL TRANSMISSIONS
11) I have lots of other fun cars that are better DD or canyon cars etc
12) how many more years will companies be allowed to build V10 stick shift 8.4L engine cars?
If you are psyched up by my list you will love the car. If you are not psyched up by my list carry on, no harm no foul.
"It totally fell over!"
"No chance it falls over!"
I personally love a lot of cars, and have driven them as daily drivers, track beaters, garage queens etc but have to reiterate for a few people on here:
ACR is completely driveable, it's totally different than a Porsche.
GT3 have evolved into cars that are easier to extract 9/10ths at track from...996 was on crack compared to the 991. Porsche has come a long way in power, platform, and friendliness.
I was inspired to buy myself a Viper for the following reasons:
1) if you call Viper Exchange and ask for one, they have them and don't try to gouge you 100k over sticker
2) on most tracks it will be the baddest, fastest car at ANY price
2a) it is terrifying
2b) i like that you can defeat TCS and challenge it
3) my P1 will run out of warranty at some point
4) consumables and breakable parts on my LT/P1 are way more expensive
5) as good as a 991GT3 sounds compared to Viper, it doesn't offer me the ***** to the wall thrill
6) IT IS THE PRICE OF A REGULAR 991 C2S
7) everything is made out of carbon
8) it doesn't have the rebuild intervals of a 997 cup car, and i can drive to the track
9) if I have an off, chances are I can get replacement plastic parts for the diffuser etc
10) MANUAL TRANSMISSIONS
11) I have lots of other fun cars that are better DD or canyon cars etc
12) how many more years will companies be allowed to build V10 stick shift 8.4L engine cars?
If you are psyched up by my list you will love the car. If you are not psyched up by my list carry on, no harm no foul.
12-31-2015, 09:24 AM
#220
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Is the ACR tolerable on the road when using the track settings for the dampers?
12-31-2015, 10:39 AM
#221
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12-31-2015, 12:49 PM
#222
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if you don't have the full extreme aero kit (massive chin lip and huge rear diffuser) it's not bad. I drove it home yesterday 175 miles after beating on it all day with the lip and diffuser on. you can bottom it out on really bumpy roads but whatever they are plastic!
12-31-2015, 12:58 PM
#223
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"I'M NOT A NERVOUS PASSENGER, but when SRT's Chris Winkler shifts into fifth at the same place I normally hit the brakes and turns what I consider a 110-mph right-hander into a 135-mph no-brake right-hander by hucking the steering wheel of the Viper ACR as hard as he can and letting the massive rear wing sort out the stability, I have to work very hard not to vomit. "
"The process can be more violent than most people are used to," Winkler notes without the slightest bit of irony to his tone, "but with the wide Kumho virtual race slicks and all the aero grip available, it's typically the fastest way around." When it's my turn to drive the ACR, I simply cannot do what Winkler does. My brain won't let me. It cannot believe in the wing."
if that gets you feeling tingly skinned (or not...)
12-31-2015, 01:46 PM
#224
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Thanks for posting.
No go for me at the moment 350R (Dependable? Love it otherwise) and Z06 (Already well documented overheating issues and I don't fit)
"That last is a pointed aside about the GT350R and Z06, which are showing some scary temperatures on their displays."
