24Chromium

+5000!

fxz

Not a mistery F dealers at least here are not allowed
to charge MSRP (not indeed because they do philantropy...)

Why Pag is not clear on this? Which we
know very well, as every super inflated bubble,
will end very bad for all Pag too, just matter of time

NateOZ

I think we have a very different view on the role of the CEO. If brand and reputational damage is being caused to a core group of customers, he's guilty by not acting.

dark knight

this also encourages dealers to compete for you rather than the other way around

sccchiii

I tend to side with Eduardo on this....this is only my opinion and many can disagree but IMO Detlev and PCNA have done a very good job based on production/information provided by mothership. They have an obligation to the entire country's regional areas and must come up with an allocation system that is both as fair possible to dealer body (and dealers police it all the time for fairness) while at times getting slow and sometimes confusing communication from infrastructure in Germany. Unfortunately someone is always going to suffer even in the perfect world but having demand that overrides supply is not always the easiest customer service hurdle to get over. Also, within that mix you have each dealer with a seemingly different manner in which they handle the customer and you can imagine the layers of complications PCNA deals with. Nothing is perfect but Detlev/PCNA have handled most obstacles recently with a reasonable approach (engine recalls on big scale, short production numbers vs demand, requests for production increase with delayed response or "no" as response, etc). PLEASE REMEMBER PCNA DOSENT PRODUCE THE CARS! Eduardo and I have debated in the past (with the utmost respect I might add despite the fact we occasionally feel differently....you're still the man Eduardo!) ultimate influence of PCNA on certain issues. Yes PCNA has some limited input on certain items or designs and a lot of begging is done behind closed doors that we will never know about to help get our market what we want (or more of it) and customer concern items that PAG is responsible for but we must all realize that PAG must say yes to these requests!? Just my 2 cents!!

Whoopsy

Yes, 918 owners are buying cars at MSRP, no funny business like 'market adjustments'.

PCNA sold 297 cars, but quite a few buyers bought multiple 918s, and those are not likely to buy 2 or 3 of everything, So that drops the VIP allocations to say around 250 or so.

But then some of the 918 buyers are also dealer principals, they don't need the 918 owner status to get 1st dib on everything, but some of these dealer owners also bought multiple 918s so they can flip later, and they for sure ARE ordering multiples in order to flip. If you take these out also, and real allocations to real 918 VIP will be between 150-200. It really isn't a big chunk out of whatever models.

In the end, the bad guys are not the real 918 owners. It's your 'friendly' neighbourhood Porsche dealers. They are the one jacking up MSRP in the first place, and they are all the ones that flips 918 VIP allocations.

Mr. Adair

I can assure you every Porsche exec at PCNA knows about the shenanigans going on in regard to their cars allocations and markups. The best salesman at my dealer (who sold 7 RS's at MSRP) said "if you think they care about this stuff your nuts, they don't want to stick their nose in this at all". PCNA knows if they open this Pandora's box they will be babysitting issues all over the country. That fact the gentleman did not answer Eduardo's question speaks volumes..

Whoopsy

There is nothing wrong with PCNA handling the allocations, the problem has always been with the dealers. They play favourites and other games to maximize their gouging on customers.

The 918 VIP only means that the 918 owners can bypass their game and they HAD to to be honest with us. Truth is, the dealers hates the 918 owners, cause they screw up the greedy dealers' game plan. Porsche AG, PCNA and other Porsche entities however have a different view.

Out of the 700 or so 918 owners in the world, I have had contact, be it electronically or personally, with around 70-80 or so, they basically are all regular normal car nuts.

NateOZ

What about it has been a good job? Clearly, they misread market demand and pricing on all recent GT products. They left a ton of money on the table and they went with an allocation model 2 more times after it didn't work well the first time. They're rewarding the dealers causing the most damage to the Porsche brand. I agree nothing is perfect, but don't let good get in the way of perfect...

STG

There are many companies that are VERY protective of their image and have a pretty iron fist when when dealing with their resellers.

Many times companies and retailers forget the basic principles of sales and making money. The customer! Especially in good economic times. It's easy to blow through 100K+ cars when the stock market is flying the the gov't is printing money as fast as the presses can. Everyone looks like a golden boy then.

One time an older successful businessman told me a story about someone asking who the boss was. He then pointed to the customers in the place of business we were in, and said "they're the boss". True, isn't it?

Porsche has a VERY loyal customer base at the enthusiast level. Obviously, they've been overshadowed my the Macan/Cayenne crowd. At the end of the day, those loyal ones will support you through thick/thin. Until ... You start taking them for granted. Then, a slow erosion starts.

The USA is one of Porsche's biggest markets right? You'd think such great marketers of automobiles would be just as good marketers to their loyal buyers. Doesn't seem to be the case. Call PCNA, and they don't know you from Joe Dingbat. Even though you may be on your 10th Porsche. You'd think anyone interested in really maximizing their marketing, would have extensive Intel on their most loyal customers. Doesn't seem to be the case. It's always more expensive advertising to the masses. Maybe the plan is to broaden the reach and go after those new sales since the loyals will support you anyway. After all, the Porsche clubs are out there doing the dirty work catering to the enthusiasts.

The true challenge will come when the economic party takes a break, and only then will the scrambling start to appreciate "the boss".

It's easy to look the other way, ignore things, and pull out the charisma card. As they say, easy come, easy go.

All this Internet message board chatter isn't anything to worry about is it? Or is there something to be learned from it. I'd call it free advice ...

Whoopsy

Absolutely correct.

The dealers are actually Porsche's customers. We end users are customers of the dealers'. While the dealers ultimately are representatives of Porsche, they do have more sway with Porsche over end users.

There was actually a big 3 way fight between the dealers, 918 owners and Porsche. In the end, we the 918 owners were told basically with the VIP program we ended up bypassing the dealers' games, so what do we care? Well we do care cause everyone thinks we are the bad guys who hogs the allocations.

It isn't actually my fight, I am Canadian, and Canadian dealers can't add market adjustments, and Canada doesn't have that PCNA VIP program, but I do get what I want from Porsche Canada simply because I am one of the earliest 918 buyer here. I am in the fight because I am kind of the frontman for the 918 owners group and fight for my fellow American buyers.

NateOZ

I disagree with the allocation handling point - look at the late run 30 PTS GT3s, not to mention how many dealers (like Walters) took the PTS slots for their own inventory while customer orders were denied.

I have no issue with 918 customers or the whole program - have a few friends that picked them up. I'm not bitter about the RS situation with a Viper Green one incoming at MSRP. I'm really disappointed with the future direction of the Company - just my opinion as a professional investor and customer but they're not doing enough to win back my confidence...

sccchiii

We disagree on who "THEY" is....they (your points) is PAG not PCNA. PCNA can only make request or report supply issues. They DONT make ultimate call on production.

Whoopsy

Who reports the order to PCNA?

PCNA has no way to verify a legitimate customer order vs a dealer using one of their database entry to create a bogus one.

Ferrari dealers are master of doing that. Porsche dealers are just getting the hang of it.

In the end, the problem always ends with the dealers being the primary suspect.

NateOZ

PAG gives PCNA the number of units they have to allocate, PCNA ("THEY") come up with the allocation method and manage the allocation process. I'm talking about step 2 not step 1