PCNA GT3 Auction is at 4PM today
09-24-2014, 02:45 PM
#241
Race Director
I don't think Edwardo was saying a salvage title moniker disappears after auction. Edwardo said this: "In this particular state, the only 'branded' title is salvage. And this, according to the General Manager of this Porsche dealership, will not be a 'salvage title'! As far as this dealership is concerned, this gt3 is one more car to sell into a high demand environment!"
I interpret this to mean for certain states, such as Georgia, only a car that was declared a total loss by an insurance company and is repaired and given a "salvage title" after repair is marked with any kind of negative reporting on a title. Georgia doesn't list "lemon law title" and only lists "salvage title" when that case applies. So, if the car was salvaged, even in Georgia it would say Salvage title. But, if the car was a lemon in CA, it would have its title defect scrubbed after sale in GA since it is not salvage title but merely lemon law title which is meaningless in the state of Georgia.
California on the other hand may indicate "DMV$20, MANUFACTURER'S BUYBACK/LEMON LAW (AC) AS IS/NO ARB VEHICLE REPURCHASED FOR EXCESSIVE TIME DOWN WHILE WAITING FOR ENGINE TO BE REPLACED AS PART OF FEDERALLY MANDATED RECALL-REPLACED ENGINE"
https://rennlist.com/forums/991/8355...r-auction.html
That title will be scrubbed because the car was sold from GA. When it's brought back into CA, even though lemon laws intended the title to read as indicated above, that language will be missing. To that extent, I think your use of the word lemon and laundry is appropriate.
I interpret this to mean for certain states, such as Georgia, only a car that was declared a total loss by an insurance company and is repaired and given a "salvage title" after repair is marked with any kind of negative reporting on a title. Georgia doesn't list "lemon law title" and only lists "salvage title" when that case applies. So, if the car was salvaged, even in Georgia it would say Salvage title. But, if the car was a lemon in CA, it would have its title defect scrubbed after sale in GA since it is not salvage title but merely lemon law title which is meaningless in the state of Georgia.
California on the other hand may indicate "DMV$20, MANUFACTURER'S BUYBACK/LEMON LAW (AC) AS IS/NO ARB VEHICLE REPURCHASED FOR EXCESSIVE TIME DOWN WHILE WAITING FOR ENGINE TO BE REPLACED AS PART OF FEDERALLY MANDATED RECALL-REPLACED ENGINE"
https://rennlist.com/forums/991/8355...r-auction.html
That title will be scrubbed because the car was sold from GA. When it's brought back into CA, even though lemon laws intended the title to read as indicated above, that language will be missing. To that extent, I think your use of the word lemon and laundry is appropriate.
As long as everyone involved is honest and knowledgeable about the history of these cars the fact that the title is clear is ultimately of benefit to the buyer as well as the seller, IMHO.
09-24-2014, 02:48 PM
#243
Instructor
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 120
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
BTW, from what I've heard there is another auction of this type still to come..... such drama.
Really don't see what the hype is all about. The factory made all these cars right. Those of you that already have 2014s have the SAME car, only thing different is the title. These cars are worth MSRP imo.
Really don't see what the hype is all about. The factory made all these cars right. Those of you that already have 2014s have the SAME car, only thing different is the title. These cars are worth MSRP imo.
09-24-2014, 02:51 PM
#244
Burning Brakes
That seems to me to be the simplest explanation for this whole thing, to be honest. Who benefits from 20 engine-replaced, branded title GT3s being sold at auction at or near their original MSRPs?
It's not a ton of cars. Couldn't PAG could afford a little bit of side-dealing with bidders to avoid a lot of headaches from watchful current owners? Wouldn't you spend a little bit of money on the front end to avoid an embarrassing PR problem? Why was it a closed auction in the first place? Would it be legal to hold an auction where some of the bidders had a deal with the seller that the other bidders didn't know about?
Would you pay over MSRP for a branded-title 2014 sitting at the dealer, or pay MSRP for a 2015 that you had to wait a few months for?
It's not a ton of cars. Couldn't PAG could afford a little bit of side-dealing with bidders to avoid a lot of headaches from watchful current owners? Wouldn't you spend a little bit of money on the front end to avoid an embarrassing PR problem? Why was it a closed auction in the first place? Would it be legal to hold an auction where some of the bidders had a deal with the seller that the other bidders didn't know about?
Would you pay over MSRP for a branded-title 2014 sitting at the dealer, or pay MSRP for a 2015 that you had to wait a few months for?
09-24-2014, 02:55 PM
#245
Could be anything. Could be nothing, too. But not having articles coming out today about engine-replaced GT3s selling way under MSRP (and you just know that a lot of those articles would not highlight the title issue as a factor) is a very nice thing for everyone.
09-24-2014, 03:06 PM
#247
Sorry, I tried to read all the previous posts, but who said or confirmed that these 20 cars sold close to MSRP at the auction? I've been trying to look for them at Manheim.com, but I don't see any record of these cars.
09-24-2014, 03:13 PM
#248
Three Wheelin'
They are not on Manheim anymore. I believe someone posted vins and prices a few pages back
09-24-2014, 03:18 PM
#250
Rennlist Member
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 572
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
BTW, from what I've heard there is another auction of this type still to come..... such drama.
Really don't see what the hype is all about. The factory made all these cars right. Those of you that already have 2014s have the SAME car, only thing different is the title. These cars are worth MSRP imo.
Really don't see what the hype is all about. The factory made all these cars right. Those of you that already have 2014s have the SAME car, only thing different is the title. These cars are worth MSRP imo.
09-24-2014, 03:22 PM
#252
RL Community Team
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
09-24-2014, 03:25 PM
#253
Race Director
They're "worth" what dealers think they can sell them for and what prospective owners will pay for them. These are very low mileage examples of a desirable and relatively hard to get, apparently limited edition car. Go figure...
09-24-2014, 03:26 PM
#254
Instructor
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 120
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
09-24-2014, 03:26 PM
#255
Burning Brakes
I agree with you, but what they are worth will be determined when they are sold to the consumer. I don't have any data points, but somehow I can't see buying a used 2014( forget the title issue) for the same price as a new 2015.