Bill Ball

The hatch ground in '91 goes to T19. I looked at T19, but it's not a real practical way to wire this - hard to get to, doesn't want to come off its mount to the body. I could chop up the cover of the harness and find the brown/white wire.

I woulder what's wrong with grounding pin 21 on the '91 alarm box connector II with a hatch relay ground signal? That connects to the hatch ground wire as well as the door pins. I'll try that.

borland

Sorry, I got interrupted by important e-mail.

If you notice above on the last to wiring diagram cutouts, the timing relay is electrically connected to the door pins.

Additionally, the 'Additional Control Unit Alarm System' is electrially connected to the special gound (BR/WT) for the hatch release motor. The added micro relay simply connects the chassis ground wire (BR) to the special ground, while at the same time as it energizes the hatch release motor.

borland

On the '91 and later, you can find the special ground (BR/WT) at the Timing Relay under the center console (same as on '90).

Bill Ball

My new scheme. Brian/Alan- what do you think? Could use one double pole relay like you did, but this seems like it should work with no wire cutting at all, no new wires to the back or the other side, retains normal hatch pull function. I'm using the door pin circuit. I'll look at that timing relay too - thanks. The nice thing about schemes that don't involve wire cutting and/or swaps is that to go back to stock, you just pull the wire taps off.

I haven't forgotten Randy's original post. I want to make this dirt simple with pictures!
UPDATE: Changed to double pole relay

borland

Here's the method I used to mount the inline diodes. Stranded wire leads and diode mounted on small piece of perf board with skrink wrap.

borland

Bill,

Since your two SPDT relays activate together, you could replace them with one DPDT relay.

Some 12V micro relays at Radio Shack or here..

http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a.../Relays/1.html

Bill Ball

Thank you, Brian. That cuts the wiring and bulk down quite a bit.

9two8

...., forgive me if I,ve missed something here, but can anyone tell me if it,s possible to fit keyless entry on a car with vacuum operated locks ?

Ken
80 928 S
5 Speed

UK

Bill Ball

Looks like you can, but I don't have an OB to examine. If you look at the wiring diagrams, Part VI, it shows a "centrol locking control motor", right and left. It appears they have a yellow wire and a green/black wire that are positive leads rather than grounding, as in the later cars this thread covers. These wires pass through a couple of different connectors where you might intercept them.

borland

Bill,

If you have the window blip problem for pulses longer than 1/2 second on the '91 and later cars, you could add just one diode in the factory harness leading to the alarm controller Arm/Lock(-) wire. That would isolate the window/sunroof controller from sensing the KE lock pulse which attaches there.

Alan

Bill - you are correct - it is possible to do the hatch without any additional wiring to the back, or across the car.

You also only need 1 simple SPST relay for the hatch and can preserve the door interlock.

The scheme is the same as I have wired on my car (for the last ~10 years) but I do have additional wiring beyond what is actually really needed. If I were doing it again I'd make the change.

There are a few connections to change/make on the CE panel and also at the alarm/lock/light module.

The key items are changing the CE connections to the hatch switches - the switch feed gets disconnected from from fused (30) @ CE: F13 (RE) and connected to Switched Interior Light ground from CE: U11 (BR/WT). The other connection on CE: F13 (RE) that feeds the Glove box needs to stay connected the same (no change).

The yellow wire coming back from the switch goes to CE: O11 this needs to be disconnected and instead now feed the Hatch Relay: 85 pin as does the KE modules negative hatch unlock pulse.

Hatch Relay 30 pin gets a fused (30) supply and this is also conected to the Hatch Relay 86 pin.

Hatch Relay: 87 pin now feeds the CE: O11 connection.

At the rear hatch release motor the switched ground (BR/WT) is replaced with a permamnent ground (BR)

Its really a simple solution - no new through the car wires and only 1 simple cheap relay for the hatch. You do need to also connect the Hatch Relay: 85 pin to the hatch disarm input - Alarm Unit: II:4 (BR/BL) so the alarm doesn't go off when you open just the hatch.

This is a little simpler than some of the other schemes for wiring & components

I have mine set up so either the dedicated hatch output or the second channel unlock (double unlock press) will open the hatch. Most KE's support this mode - just connect channel 2 unlock and channel 3 unlock together.

Hatch only - opens the hatch with the hatch suspend alarm state - doors stay locked
- closing the hatch fully re-arms the system - no need to lock/arm

Channel 2 unlock (double click) - unlocks doors/disarms the whole alarm & opens the hatch.
- closing the hatch doesn't change alarm state - must lock/arm doors

I like this mode combination - though I occasionally end up with the hatch open when I didn't intend it

Clear enough or diagram needed?

Basic operation: Either the hatch release switch(es) or the KE module can activate the relay to initiate a hatch opening cycle. The KE module does it with a simple ground pulse. The Hatch Pull Switch activates the relay only if the interior door switched lights are on - as in the stock case (though the sense is inverted to the relay coil - and then back again at the relay output).

Alan

heinrich

Excellent stuff Guys ... Alan, how about immobilized... the stock alarm still does that, right? I have a nice alarm I want.to instal, wondering if I should instal it this way to use the factory alarm or separately as is more common.

Bill Ball

Hi Alan: Your scheme, although it only uses one SPST relay, involves wiring changes (permanent ground at the hatch motor, rerouting hatch pull wires to different spot on CE panel), so I will probably finish up the current install as I show in the diagram a few posts up, using a DPDT relay. I kinda like not having to cut or move any of the stock wiring at all. Do you see any problems with that scheme?

Ah, I see that the wire to the alarm Arm/Lock does connect to the window controller. I see the connection at J15. I haven't quite finished the install. I'll let you know how it acts.

Yes, the stock alarm does immobilize. With our install schemes, the stock alarm is preserved. Adding aftermarket alarms seems to always cause problems. Even though many of the keyless entry kits have alarm features, I don't use them. I just clip and tape off the unused wires on the kit's harness.

heinrich

Bill, one recommendation ... replace the LAME stock honk-honk-honk beetle siren with a real one

Alan

But - if you do that you cannot use the remote lock to close the windows & doors...

Just configuring for short pulses on the KE should be enough. Do also configure for the pulses to last at least as long as you hold the button (some may have a seperate output for this) - this way you can hold the lock button to close the windows/sunroof as with the key in lock mode.

Alan