Whoopsy

Daaaammmmnnn guys, calm down. I went off enjoying my just got home Dakar for the weekend and it's like WW3 in here lol.

Is the GT4RS the best car Porsche makes? Nope. But it is the rawest car since, well, the 997 GT3RS 4.0. It's not for everyone, it's not even the best track day car, that honour goes to the 992 GT3RS no contest. The target audience for this car is 'drivers', those with the capability to make a car dance and enjoy the feedback coming back from the car. It's also not the best being driven on normal streets. Where it shines is Sunday morning drives on empty mountain roads. It isn't a forgiving car like the 992 GT3, but that's why it rewards good drivers. Less capable ones are better off in the GT3. You clumsy at putting down power on corner exits? The GT3 is hyper stable there. You suck at managing weight shift, trail braking to mange 911 turn ins? The new front suspension on the GT3 literally will do the job for you. Not knocking on the GT3, in skilled hands, the same driver will be faster in the GT3 than in the GT4RS. The GT4RS isn't about pure quickness, it's about enjoyment for skilled drivers.

Different people value different attributes of a car as their 'enjoyment'. There is no 'right' or 'wrong' answer. Some people feels that for their 'enjoyment', they needs a manual in a car, others value acceleration from a stop as theirs, and then there are the ones that value neither of those as high as how hard a car can corner.

We should be glad that Porsche literally make all of those 'variants' for different folks. You want acceleration? Nothing beats a turbo S. You want manuals? There are the S/T, the GT3 Touring and the GT3. You want cornering speed? GT3RS. None of those are one trick pony either, they all are equally capable in other departments. Heck, now Porsche even have an off-road capable variant, the Dakar.

Did I mention Porsche even do mid-engine on top of rear engine cars? Or that one isn't limited to buying new cars, older Porsche are very enjoyable cars too. There is no better feeling than nailing a perfect shift in pre-993 manuals, with the vague gating and rubbery shifter, one can never tell if that's 2nd or 4th. Modern Porsche manuals are too perfect, too precise, one can never miss a shift, zero challenge.

Even a base Boxster with the 4 banger is enjoyable, because it is a Porsche. There are no wrong choices ever.

mrd_spy

Some people buy the 4RS because they can and many end up in the wrong hands, same with all GT models the last 9 years sadly. That's Porsche today :-(

168glhs1986

^^Thanks Porsche dealerships! They have ruined it for most of us. PNA had a little to do with it also with the 918 VIP program.

Collectors winning, enthusiasts suffering. Is the VIP program ending this year?

Manifold

I think you're right. That may explain the unusually wide range of impressions and opinions of the car:

- Not too loud, too loud
- Doesn't drone too much, drones too much
- Lacks mid range grunt, doesn't lack it
- Hard to drive and nervous near the limit, easy to drive and progressive near the limit
- Interior is nicely analog, interior is outdated
- Ride quality is fine, ride quality is quite harsh
- Slower than the 992 GT3 on track, just as fast as the 992 GT3 on track

I test drove it three times and concluded that it's not too loud, doesn't drone too much, lacks mid range grunt, interior is nicely analog, and ride quality is fine, so I ordered one. I anticipate that the handling near the limit will be fine, and that it will be just as fast as the 992 GT3 on track. My car will be at the dealer later this week. I'm more excited about this one than any other car I ordered before; the extremeness of the car in a mid-engine platform is a big attraction for me.

mrd_spy

It dont drone at all valves closed, it only drones exhaust values open at slower speeds if you forget to turn the exhaust off again, Hence Porsche added the values :-) Loads of people also mod their cars, add an exhaust then moan about drone. Porsche cars don;t drone oem.

It is harsh and the damping at the rear is wrong imho. thats life nothing is perfect, but this car cannot keep traction over bumps under throttle oem vs my Other Porkers or even my 991.2 GT3. Lowering the car , limited travel or even buying some posh dampers to fully cure it is again annoying messing about.
If AP said it's nota track car why did that add such hard spring rates ?

Whoopsy

This is a fact.


This however isn't.


This is partially correct. Collectors by definition buy lots of cars, so they are the big clients. YouTubers like the scumbag Manny is another one of those privileged to buy ahead of the line. Schmee is another. They get in only because of their YouTube channel and nothing else. Manny literally stole my 935 and then proceed to flip it. That car was created to reward the Motorsport side of Porsche's business, like the 918 for the street car side. One has to apply and show to Porsche one is involved in the Motorsport side of things in order to qualify, needless to say, Manny doesn't and can't show anything other than his useless channel. At RR7 they was like sorry for the 935 mess but you can have the GT3R Rennsport this time around. I was like, **** you, no thanks, I still remembered what was said 5 years ago about the 935.

Anyways, yes. the VIP program will start to be ending this year for the early owners, and continued to some time next year. But for most it won't matter as they bought enough during the 10 year period that they will already be a VIP with their dealers and stay on as the dealers' VIP instead of 918 VIPs. 2,3,4,5+ millions of car buying in 10 years, on top of the 918.





The 918 VIP program was never really a factor in the whole equation. Dealers just used that to deflect blame. There was 300 918 sold new in the USA. In reality, that translate to ~280 918 VIPs as some bought multiple 918s but in the grand scheme of all things Porsche they are only allowed 1 membership into the VIP program, except 1 person who managed to convince Porsche AG and PCNA that he deserves 3. So he gets 3 of everything.

A bunch of those are dealer principles, ~40, so they WILL get whatever they wish whether they are in the VIP program or not. They only have to tell their GM to reserve 1 car for them.

Of the ~240 left in the program, not all kept the car for the full 3 years in order to obtain the 10 year VIP status. ~120 is the number who got the whole 10 years. Of those, 5-10 got ejected from the program for abuse, aka flipping cars.

During the 10 year period, only the 911R, the Exclusive, truly was affected by the high number of VIPs that took their allocations. Everything else was produced in big enough number that the 100 or some VIP allocations don't really affect much, if at all. Not the Speedster, not the SC, not the S/T, not even the Heritage Targa nor the PORSCHE DESIGN Targa as the last 2 aren't 'hotly contested' cars.

Averaged it out, each US dealer has less than 1 allocation reserved for a real 918 VIP. How is that even a factor? Yes some big dealers have 2,3,4 VIPs, but that means 2,3,4,5 dealers don't for each of those big ones. Sleezy dealers just want to use the convenient excuse "Sure I would love to sell you this or that but it's taken by a 918 VIP". That sounds much better than " Sorry you can't buy this or that because I want this unreal ADM or you didn't buy enough from us yet"

PCNA doesn't sell directly to end users, the dealerships are the middleman, PCNA's hands are tied because of your franchise laws. They can only do so much to discourage but dealers are pretty much untouchable. Until your lawmakers changed the practice, this is the reality.

GT4RSYMPHONY

Pretty grim! Somehow makes Ferrari ownership sound nice. And Lamborghini like the four seasons.

Manifold

I find that the 992 GT3 and 991.2 3RS are pretty bouncy. At one track I go to (Shenandoah Circuit at Summit Point), I was unable to go full throttle in these cars in some parts of the track because they were like bucking broncos and the rears of the cars couldn't hold traction. At the same track on the same day, I coached in a 4RS, and the car felt better than both of the 911s.

TRZ06

I have watched a few YouTube videos over the last few years where those who track complain about the "pogo stick" effect of their GT cars and switched out to MCS or KW MR.

I don't know why, but that is a common theme with how Porsche tunes their PASM shocks for some reason. I felt it in my GT4 stock too, so it seems to be a similar algorithm that they use when tuning the software or how they set-up their internal valving on the shocks.

I'm no expert, but to me it feels over damped on the compression side. Then (at least on the GT4) they underdamp the rebound stroke.

When you move away from PASM and go with a motorsport damper, you lose all of that pogo stick effect.

Here is one of the videos... Around the 4:25 mark

hlvg

I wonder if that's something the DSC Sport Controller would help address?

Mr. Adair

DSC is easily the most effective low cost upgrade to help with this issue. Remember ride quality is very subjective. Old PASM on 7.2 RS's was really poor. Especially rebound. Bad roads would irritate the hell out of me. After I installed the DSC it removed the harshness by approximately 20-25%. Do not expect it to be like going from an RS product to a Carrera. To me, the 4RS PASM is so much better than both of my 7.2 RS's simply because electronic dampening has improved immensely since 2010. I recently lowered my 4RS 7mm in the rear and 5mm in the front and set the car to Manthey spec alignment from the 4RS kit. It absolutely changed the car. More stable, less bounce and definitely tracked better in the rear with a little better turn in on the front. No added shims etc. Best $450 you could spend to start.

Delidf8

I suppose you increased camber if you copied the Manthey spec. How can you do so without shims ?
Is it an eccentric bolt on the lower control arm ?

jmartpr

Without shims or camber plates...You can move the front top mounts full inboard and use the rear eccentrics...it will be limited but better than stock.

Delidf8

So the rear LCA has an eccentric ? or are you talking about the toe link eccentric ?

mrd_spy

Manthey base is no parts and -2.2 front -1.8 rear. I think that would just need a small shim. Manthey offical line is NO toe links for the 4RS.