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718 GTS 4.0/GT4/GT4RS/Spyder/25th Anniversary Discussions about the 718 version of the GT4RS, GTS 4.0, GT4, Spyder and 25th Anniversary Boxster
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Old 04-15-2022, 02:15 PM
  #5986  
Whoopsy
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Originally Posted by jmartpr
and then you have a GT4RS that cost more than the 992 GT3......blowing all their model structure and probably creating a mess on the production line.
Again....it is, what it is and we should be glad they actually did this car. They even finally addressed the gearing problem.
How you come to that conclusion?

MSRP already starts at a lower point for the GT4RS, and even comparably equipped, the GT3 still cost a bunch more.

Of course this is excluding ADM. But that's from the dealers, not Porsche.
Old 04-15-2022, 02:17 PM
  #5987  
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Originally Posted by greatfox315
This is exactly my point. If there were no hierarchy, we wouldn't see bits like the 992 suspension being withheld from the 718/Cayman chassis. This isn't a complaint, this is an observation. Frankly, the GT4RS is already so expensive that only a select few well-heeled enthusiasts will even be able to purchase one. I am not advocating for it to go up-market.

Yes....I'm actually very surprised they used the 992 GT3 engine and did a re-gear of the PDK.
I always believed they would just Tune the current 9A2 Evo engine to 450-460 hp add all the other stuff and call it a day.
It really is a big jump from the 718 GT4 in terms of performance, not usual for the GT department to do from a GT to a GT RS.
Made it impossible for me to say NO to an allocation.
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Old 04-15-2022, 02:52 PM
  #5988  
welikethetrack
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Originally Posted by Whoopsy
How you come to that conclusion?

MSRP already starts at a lower point for the GT4RS, and even comparably equipped, the GT3 still cost a bunch more.

Of course this is excluding ADM. But that's from the dealers, not Porsche.
I think he is referring to Porsches internal cost. If you weren't aware R+D/development is insanely expensive for them and their process, it isn't making some hackjob aftermarket suspension system.

Just the front side markers on the 2011 gt3rs 4.0 cost 250k to develop according to AP....Imagine how much a whole new suspension would be on a car they are sunsetting after 2 years and will only sell maybe 5k of...

It would be unwise from a cost/production and timeline perspective.
Old 04-15-2022, 03:08 PM
  #5989  
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Originally Posted by Whoopsy
How you come to that conclusion?

MSRP already starts at a lower point for the GT4RS, and even comparably equipped, the GT3 still cost a bunch more.

Of course this is excluding ADM. But that's from the dealers, not Porsche.

Exactly what @welikethetrack just posted above.....from a development standpoint, adjusting/modifying a 981/982 platform to accept Double wishbone and/or multi link (on par with the necessary OEM needs...warranty, cost, useful life, etc) would just push the cost of the vehicle way up....which would result in a higher MSRP, unless PAG wanted to eat that development on a low volume, 2 year production....not very PAG being the most profitable brand in the market.
Old 04-15-2022, 04:04 PM
  #5990  
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Originally Posted by Whoopsy
The 924 is so much more of a looker than the 914 dude. Shape of the 914 is just plain ugly. Some 40 years now, the 924's proportion still looks perfect. It spawns the 944 and 968 after all. The 914 on the other hand, looks like a small tissue box sitting on top of a big tissue box.
Styling is subjective. I happen to think the opposite: 914 looks better to my eye than the 924.

Originally Posted by Whoopsy
Could more expensive and better geometry components helped the GT4RS, of course, but it will also means more dollars. But the gain will not be as big as on a 911. Diminishing return so to speak.
I agree with you here. If you read my later post, you’ll see that I do not think the GT4RS would benefit from moving up-market (and incurring additional cost)
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Old 04-15-2022, 04:13 PM
  #5991  
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Originally Posted by jmartpr
Yes....I'm actually very surprised they used the 992 GT3 engine and did a re-gear of the PDK.
I always believed they would just Tune the current 9A2 Evo engine to 450-460 hp add all the other stuff and call it a day.
It really is a big jump from the 718 GT4 in terms of performance, not usual for the GT department to do from a GT to a GT RS.
Made it impossible for me to say NO to an allocation.
Totally agree. The extent to which they improved the car is impressive. The step from GT3 to GT3RS is not nearly as large as the step from GT4 to GT4RS
Old 04-15-2022, 08:41 PM
  #5992  
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Originally Posted by Whoopsy
If one only put away the bias that the 911 is the top dog and 'should' be faster.......

911, with the rear engine layout, takes time to get used to, and is rewarding once one get the hang of it. Doesn't means it's the best layout for going fast, but it is what most Porsche owners are used to.

The Cayman/Boxster had always been the 2nd class citizen in the line up, handicapped engine output, handicapped gearbox, etc. It was never given a fair fight.

The GT4RS is the closest thing to a 'fair fight' against a 911. Same engine as a GT3, with a bespoke gearbox. Tire sizes are still a compromise but at least it's close enough for people to compare mid engine vs rear engine sort of fairly.

Having driven almost every single model Porsche made, which includes all generations of 911s, all generations of Cayman/Boxster, same with Macans, Cayennes, Panamera, Taycan, 924, 944, 968, 928, CGT and 918. Only road cars I haven't is the GT1, 959, 356s, 550 Spyder and the 914 ( never will, completely not interested in the ugliest Porsche ever and it's not even a proper Porsche, but that's another long topic for some other time). I really think the GT4RS is the best from Porsche up to this point in time, yes, even better than the 992 GT3, just because of the mid engine layout and much much better gearing. 992 GT3 is just simply over rated and the GT4RS under rated.

If I were to only be able to keep 3 Porsches ever. #1 would be the 918, there will never be another more complex car made, technology tour de force. A 911 turbo S, any generation, as they are the pinnacle of all around sports car of their respective generations, and the 3rd car might as well be the GT4RS, alternative would be a 959, or a GT1. That's how highly I think of the GT4RS.
love it !!
I just might print this out and frame it 😅
Old 04-15-2022, 09:49 PM
  #5993  
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Originally Posted by greatfox315
Totally agree. The extent to which they improved the car is impressive. The step from GT3 to GT3RS is not nearly as large as the step from GT4 to GT4RS

Lets see what the 992 GT3RS is like......from the test mules looks like they are also doing lots of new stuff. Wonder on the engine.
Old 04-16-2022, 01:11 AM
  #5994  
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Originally Posted by jmartpr
Lets see what the 992 GT3RS is like......from the test mules looks like they are also doing lots of new stuff. Wonder on the engine.
I think at most the 992 GT3 RS is going to add only half as much power as the GT4 RS added over the GT4. And a good chance it could be less than half.
Old 04-16-2022, 01:27 AM
  #5995  
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Originally Posted by greatfox315
Styling is subjective. I happen to think the opposite: 914 looks better to my eye than the 924.




Hmm. Cool.
Old 04-16-2022, 08:47 AM
  #5996  
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Originally Posted by Whoopsy



Hmm. Cool.
I would take the 924 too......
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Old 04-16-2022, 08:49 AM
  #5997  
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Originally Posted by GrantG
I think at most the 992 GT3 RS is going to add only half as much power as the GT4 RS added over the GT4. And a good chance it could be less than half.

That would be the usual if we go by past models......if they do that it would make the 4RS even more special, not better of course, but more unique.
Old 04-16-2022, 10:48 AM
  #5998  
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I would be stunned if +80HP were the new rs paradigm, unless this is the last purely ice 3rs.
Old 04-16-2022, 11:00 AM
  #5999  
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Originally Posted by Adrift
I would be stunned if +80HP were the new rs paradigm, unless this is the last purely ice 3rs.
I think thats a pretty safe bet at this point, that the 992 Generation is the last full ICE generation of car.
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Old 04-16-2022, 11:02 AM
  #6000  
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Originally Posted by Whoopsy
Hmm. Cool.
oooh, can I play?




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