To club race or not to club race. all opinions and suggestions welcomed!!
03-09-2009, 08:25 PM
#166
Rennlist Member
03-09-2009, 08:41 PM
#168
Drifting
... Hoosier will love you at Limerock. 2 new sets for the event. You will want to perform a root canal on yourself if you flatspot any of them... It will mean another brand new set for the Glen race...
03-09-2009, 08:50 PM
#170
Rennlist Member
I am not trying to win, I just want to savor the experience.............
03-09-2009, 09:45 PM
#171
Toyos were great until it tried Hoosiers. Hoosiers were great until I tried slicks. Slicks are unbelievable.
I now run on the new Pirelli DM slicks. I got my first overall victory on them this summer. Like I just pulled several seconds a lap out of a hat. Then I went on the win the national championship (I'm actually talking about BMW CCA. You gotta be nuts to race a 930).
Maybe racing doesn't have to be expensive. But winning sure as hell is...
I now run on the new Pirelli DM slicks. I got my first overall victory on them this summer. Like I just pulled several seconds a lap out of a hat. Then I went on the win the national championship (I'm actually talking about BMW CCA. You gotta be nuts to race a 930).
Maybe racing doesn't have to be expensive. But winning sure as hell is...
03-09-2009, 11:12 PM
#172
Pro
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I thought I might try and get this thread back on course and away from the "squabbling".
i started this thread in order to seek out some great advice and suggestions from the many Rennlist members that frequent this forum. Indeed I have received many! The amount of help that one can find here really is incredible. The decision whether or not to club race at this point is purely financial at this point. If i were to I would be inclined to go with a 964 (someone else's project) or a stock Boxster. In this current ecnomic environment I may just keep on doing more DE's this year, primarily open track days, and get a lot more experience. I am still on the fence, but the thought of spending 3-5 thousand dollars every race weekend seems to be quite a bit!
i started this thread in order to seek out some great advice and suggestions from the many Rennlist members that frequent this forum. Indeed I have received many! The amount of help that one can find here really is incredible. The decision whether or not to club race at this point is purely financial at this point. If i were to I would be inclined to go with a 964 (someone else's project) or a stock Boxster. In this current ecnomic environment I may just keep on doing more DE's this year, primarily open track days, and get a lot more experience. I am still on the fence, but the thought of spending 3-5 thousand dollars every race weekend seems to be quite a bit!
Lets brake it down....
entry fee $575
gas to and from the track (Balt. to VIR) $150
gas at the track (100 octane) $300
hotel $300
tires $1100 if you must run HoHos and new ones at that (I do, but only new ones every other weekend)
misc. stuff $200
Total.... $2625
A DE weekend at the same place is going to be about $2000
To race for an additional $625???? Thats a no brainer. YES!!!!
03-09-2009, 11:37 PM
#173
Rennlist Member
factoring in 3 years of expenses to set the car up for racing seems ridiculous to me. Guess what you were doing during those three years of sorting; RACING, I hope!
Besides, like a leased vehicle, I need to move on after three years anyway.
Besides, like a leased vehicle, I need to move on after three years anyway.
03-10-2009, 01:02 AM
#174
Rennlist Member
wow...missed a few days...oh yea, CAUSE IT WAS A RACE WEEKEND!
DMD, all i can say is quit overthinking this and go do it! If this is an academic analysis you're going to talk yourself out of this all day long.
I have a really nice RS america setup as a full blown cup, that is sitting in the garage catching dust cause I was out getting my *** handed to me in a 944 spec race by a sixteen year old and loving every minute of it...(feel free to pile on at any point guys...) There where 15 spec cars out, perhaps 2 911's, so finding a good size group to run with is pretty important. I'd just get into a series with a car you like and a good size group to run with, be it 911, 944, boxster or (gasp) miata... running by yourself is just like a DE with traffic...
I can go out in the RS and run nine seconds faster on the same track, but go out wheel to wheel with a bunch of guys who have the same setup and limitations and you get a whole different respect to what a second looks like and what it takes to keep it. In a DE or a TT you can find out how fast you can go around, but try it with a whole track full of other guys all working to keep you behind them and it's a whole different game.
Three cars came off the track damaged, a broken spindle, a trans and a some fender rash from some close contact...if it were the RS I would have been pretty concerned, with the spec car no big deal, its the beauty of a "disposable" car. I had some mechanical issues but ran anyway, racing is racing. Don't get me wrong it sucks if something goes wrong or the car would get tagged but it's an acceptable risk. If you start with something that you are too attached to you'll never take the plunge.
do it, Do It, DO IT!!!!!
just my .02....
DMD, all i can say is quit overthinking this and go do it! If this is an academic analysis you're going to talk yourself out of this all day long.
I have a really nice RS america setup as a full blown cup, that is sitting in the garage catching dust cause I was out getting my *** handed to me in a 944 spec race by a sixteen year old and loving every minute of it...(feel free to pile on at any point guys...) There where 15 spec cars out, perhaps 2 911's, so finding a good size group to run with is pretty important. I'd just get into a series with a car you like and a good size group to run with, be it 911, 944, boxster or (gasp) miata... running by yourself is just like a DE with traffic...
I can go out in the RS and run nine seconds faster on the same track, but go out wheel to wheel with a bunch of guys who have the same setup and limitations and you get a whole different respect to what a second looks like and what it takes to keep it. In a DE or a TT you can find out how fast you can go around, but try it with a whole track full of other guys all working to keep you behind them and it's a whole different game.
Three cars came off the track damaged, a broken spindle, a trans and a some fender rash from some close contact...if it were the RS I would have been pretty concerned, with the spec car no big deal, its the beauty of a "disposable" car. I had some mechanical issues but ran anyway, racing is racing. Don't get me wrong it sucks if something goes wrong or the car would get tagged but it's an acceptable risk. If you start with something that you are too attached to you'll never take the plunge.
do it, Do It, DO IT!!!!!
just my .02....
03-10-2009, 01:39 AM
#175
Cows-4-Rent
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Here's my .02....You will have as much fun with a 10k car as a 100k car, at least while you are starting out which means about 3 full seasons. You'll learn a TON in those seasons and THEN you can worry about the best car for the best class. I chose based on where my friends were racing and I wanted one of the more competitive classes.
I lived in Chicago w/a 1 car garage. I had a cayenne and a few other cars...for the race car I bought an enclosed trailer and stored the car and trailer at a public storage with no problems.
I lived in Chicago w/a 1 car garage. I had a cayenne and a few other cars...for the race car I bought an enclosed trailer and stored the car and trailer at a public storage with no problems.
03-10-2009, 08:50 AM
#176
Burning Brakes
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Gums, you kind of make my point. We spend a lot of money setting up the car. When it is done, then we move on to another one. Using your leasing logic, all setup costs should be considered operating expenses since we don't get the money back out of the car when we sell.
The first rule of racing is NEVER, NEVER add up those invoices. Tim, you are using what I call 'wife math' to minimize the difference between DE and racing.
How many cars have you bought and sold, engines rebuilt, extra sets of wheels, etc? Would you have really done all these things if you were just DE'ing? How many consumables do you buy at the track, data aquisition systems, on and on. Any one that gets track support cannot even enter this argument, and there are fewer and fewer driver/mechanics out there each year. Don't forget, DE's are usually 2 days and race weekends are 3-4 days long with Test&Tune days. Oh and don't forget that extra $200 or the extra hotel nights.
I DE'd heavily for 5 years before I started racing in 03. The costs absolutely to not compare. The best example is that I used to be able to do 8-10 events with the same budget as I do 3-4 races with now.
I know this was a thread about wether or not Doug should race or not, and my answer is hell yes, but let's be real about the differences. But, It is worth every penny.
The first rule of racing is NEVER, NEVER add up those invoices. Tim, you are using what I call 'wife math' to minimize the difference between DE and racing.
How many cars have you bought and sold, engines rebuilt, extra sets of wheels, etc? Would you have really done all these things if you were just DE'ing? How many consumables do you buy at the track, data aquisition systems, on and on. Any one that gets track support cannot even enter this argument, and there are fewer and fewer driver/mechanics out there each year. Don't forget, DE's are usually 2 days and race weekends are 3-4 days long with Test&Tune days. Oh and don't forget that extra $200 or the extra hotel nights.
I DE'd heavily for 5 years before I started racing in 03. The costs absolutely to not compare. The best example is that I used to be able to do 8-10 events with the same budget as I do 3-4 races with now.
I know this was a thread about wether or not Doug should race or not, and my answer is hell yes, but let's be real about the differences. But, It is worth every penny.
03-10-2009, 10:10 AM
#178
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03-10-2009, 11:50 AM
#180
Three Wheelin'
Gums, you kind of make my point. We spend a lot of money setting up the car. When it is done, then we move on to another one. Using your leasing logic, all setup costs should be considered operating expenses since we don't get the money back out of the car when we sell.
The first rule of racing is NEVER, NEVER add up those invoices. Tim, you are using what I call 'wife math' to minimize the difference between DE and racing.
How many cars have you bought and sold, engines rebuilt, extra sets of wheels, etc? Would you have really done all these things if you were just DE'ing? How many consumables do you buy at the track, data aquisition systems, on and on. Any one that gets track support cannot even enter this argument, and there are fewer and fewer driver/mechanics out there each year. Don't forget, DE's are usually 2 days and race weekends are 3-4 days long with Test&Tune days. Oh and don't forget that extra $200 or the extra hotel nights.
I DE'd heavily for 5 years before I started racing in 03. The costs absolutely to not compare. The best example is that I used to be able to do 8-10 events with the same budget as I do 3-4 races with now.
I know this was a thread about wether or not Doug should race or not, and my answer is hell yes, but let's be real about the differences. But, It is worth every penny.
The first rule of racing is NEVER, NEVER add up those invoices. Tim, you are using what I call 'wife math' to minimize the difference between DE and racing.
How many cars have you bought and sold, engines rebuilt, extra sets of wheels, etc? Would you have really done all these things if you were just DE'ing? How many consumables do you buy at the track, data aquisition systems, on and on. Any one that gets track support cannot even enter this argument, and there are fewer and fewer driver/mechanics out there each year. Don't forget, DE's are usually 2 days and race weekends are 3-4 days long with Test&Tune days. Oh and don't forget that extra $200 or the extra hotel nights.
I DE'd heavily for 5 years before I started racing in 03. The costs absolutely to not compare. The best example is that I used to be able to do 8-10 events with the same budget as I do 3-4 races with now.
I know this was a thread about wether or not Doug should race or not, and my answer is hell yes, but let's be real about the differences. But, It is worth every penny.