dgrobs

Spot on.

I am now in the right seat as I started instructing this season, and I have been blessed with nothing but students who listen and learn so far.

Had a wonderful newbie green student at the Niagara DE at The Glen last week and he was in a 911 and it wasn't a vintage car, it was a fast 911.

I can't really find the words to describe how rewarding it was for me (and my student), when something finally clicked and I saw the bulb light up in the student's eyes.

That is the reason I am instructing. Not for discounts on reg fees, not for free reg fees and other perks, and not for the fact I can now say "I am great because I am an instructor". Couldn't care less about those things.

I became an instructor so I could give back, plain and simple. For all the instructors that have been in my right seat over the years, you are the reasons that I became an instructor, period!! You did for me, so I do for others. That's it. Really is that simple.

I am not looking forward to the day that my student is a 22 year old hot shot who's never been on track who's daddy just bought him a brand new Viper as a graduation present.

I will deal with that student the way I was taught to. Real his *** in if he gets out of control. Make him understand why we are on the track, and that IS NOT to see how fast your new Viper can go.

I made a promise to family, and that's why I am allowed (sort of) to be on track as much as I am. I promised them I would not die on a racetrack. I have every intention of honoring that promise and keeping my word.

At the beginning for me back when I was a greenie, I remember a couple instructors who were clearly instructing to get the free track time.
I didn't say anything, just did my laps and hoped for better next time. The next instructor was always better.
This only happened a couple times, but there are def some instructors out there who couldn't care less about the student, just the discounted or free track time.
I will NEVER be one of those instructors. Never Ever!! Thankfully, those instructors are few and very far between. Thankfully.

I am doing this to give back, and that's it. For all those selfless instructors who really cared when they were in my right seat, you were the motivation. You still are the motivation. You are why I am instructing.
Not the track time, not the ego boost. Just want to give back. If my student can leave a DE a better driver than when he arrived, and I am part of the reason that happens, that's all I need and that's all I want.
The reward I get is seeing that bulb light up when the student finally "gets it". To me, that is worth more than any amount of discounted or free track time.

I left that Niagara DE with a smile that you couldn't whack off my face with a hammer.
The student listened.
The student learned.
The student left The Glen a better driver than when he arrived.
That's my only reward, and I flat out love the feeling I get when the student gets it.
Little by little, but finally gets it.

That is why I instruct, period!!
Same reason why I was a ski instructor back in the day.
When the student gets it, I get it too.
Can't put a price on that.

That is why I instruct.

OK that's all. My one and only post in this thread.

Carry on..........

anthony42hat

Sounds like his instructor needed to reel him in a little.

Not sure what you are implying with the Summit (or any other track for that matter) comment. What are they supposed to do...parade it around the paddock for all to see and then have a memorial service?

Matt Romanowski

You got it! The only difference was my FIRST student was a recently retired 50something that bought the Porsche to learn how to race. The flagger at Pocono North said go and he laid rubber!

Working with a great student is tons of fun.

Glyndellis

Come run with Allegheny region. The requirement for a front row hook is on the tech form

996AE

As a club (PCA) is trying to introduce new Porsche owners and long time Porsche enthusiast to the track. Guys and gals that are new to the track. Our HPDE are not races.

I think we should back up a bit and accept that there are many different drivers and cars at our PCA HPDE. But the overwhelming majority are novices (requiring instructors) that would like to drive around race track. Not race around it. Coaching smooth, fast, car control techniques, straight line braking, apex, looking down track, situational awareness, flags, corner workers, two wheels off, four wheels off, both feet in, safe passing, lots to learn.

No novice, which is 90% of our students is coming to the track with roll bar, H&NR, 5/6 way harness, race slicks and cool suit. Tow hooks, come on its hard enough to get numbers on cars. If your novice does have all of this you might think twice about that.

We are not racing at HPDE, and very few intermediate drivers need or want a ride along instructor in less you're Pro, or at a minimum a top SCCA, POC, NASA.... driver.

Our focus is novices and coaching high performance driving. This is not racing!

We need to keep HPDE in perspective. A perspective Instructors are instrumental in promoting. We're not racing. Its a HPDE. A very big difference and students need to know this!

PS. If your coaching in RED run group better know what youre getting into or dont get in the car!

RobertR1

I’ve said this before but manufacturers need to start putting hp dials in these new age of hp wars. Showing up in 600hp+ car is just sheer intimidation that much of the time is spent in fear of the car rather than learning it. On the other end of the spectrum you have those will bin it trying to prove their mastery of these cars until anything happens that they’re not used to. Then phobic responses kick in and everyone is going for a ride.

ProCoach

@996AE you make the point, over and over, that it’s DE, not racing. I don’t think anyone is disputing that.

Not sure how that distinction is relevant to the conversation around the highly personal decision of whether or not to get in the right seat, for everyone who chooses to consider that.

Almost everyone I have ever seen in this sport, novice up to red, just wants to get better.

The principals of driving the BEST you can, the “best execution of fundamental skills,” is the same.

No matter the venue…

I remember the old Merrill Lynch ad.

A retired business tycoon or professional is pictured in his Shelby Cobra, out and alone on a beautiful road racing course.

The caption reads; “ I spent my life building my fortune. Now, I would give all of it for two-tenths of a second…”

We can all identify with that. No matter what the venue.

Without question, some of the smartest, most successful, driven (pun intended) people are folks I see at DE’s, and also in competition.

With few exceptions, they all just want to get better, no matter what “group they’re in.”

However individual instructors, groups, chapters, regions and organizations facilitate this safely and make this happen, that is a GOOD thing.

Who said anything about racing? SMH…

177mph

Glad that all works for you. I have had nothing but good experiences with an instructor sitting right seat with me and even a few instances when quick thinking helped me avoid an incident. This would not have occurred with a walkie talkie. I now sit in the right seat and while I have no issue with other forms of instruction, I also believe there is no substitute for two people in a car when learning the finer points of a racetrack and driving quickly.

Locker537

As a novice that is attending PCA events, thank you to all the instructors putting the effort into teaching.

I love to learn. My emphasis is on having fun and being safe. In-car instruction and the people that do it are what makes this happen. Thank you.

dgrobs

Agreed....

Matt Romanowski

I think there is a place for all different forms of teaching, instruction, and coaching. I've been fortunate to have training as a tutor, teacher, and mentor, along with coach while being surrounded by some fantastic people of all of those vocations. If you look at the drivers who have progressed the quickest and farthest, they usually have utilized in car, data, lead follow, sim, and more to improve their skill set. It takes a bit of everything! I still volunteer and instruct because I want to give back to the club, pass along knowledge, and have fun at the track! Any time you teach someone something, you further your own understanding as well.

The topic of DE not being racing is certainly germane here worthy of it's own thread as well. It's one of the first things I tell people in my driver's meetings.

I would even throw a different take on things - instructing in new cars, even though they are faster, is easier with the advent of PSM, traction control, and ABS. Yes, the thresholds are much higher, but harder to cross than in an old 911T (not that there are many at events anymore!).

Outlaw 06

This coaching method doesn’t just “work for me”. It’s worked for tens of thousands of drivers, including countless national champions. Additionally, there’s no way to right seat coach in a Formula Ford, Spec Racer Ford, etc. There’s definitely differences between getting professional instruction vs. amateur instruction. Oftentimes, you get what you pay for. The professional coaches I’ve had never sat in the car with me (except on a skid pad a long time ago). They observe drivers on the track, analyze data, watch in-car video and coach in the paddock. My point is that the same can be done (very safely) at DEs.

CodyBigdog

So wait, for any, and every DE event that I attend, I have to go to my dealership, and pay them to do a thorough inspection on my new car?

dgrobs

Yes, and with good reason.

If you have an Indy you use, they should do the tech sheet no charge.

Dealer would be my last choice for a tech inspection due to the $$, but as a last resort, yes.

You need to do a tech form for every PCA DE that you do. Most regions offer a free tech "get together" about 2 weeks prior to each event, and that is no charge, and you get to hang out with your PCA track buddies for an hour or so.

Don't show up to a PCA DE without your tech sheet. Could be a problem.....

996AE

ProCoach

We are not talking about pro level race car driver instruction. Hell were not coaching race car drivers at PCA HPDE! Thats my point my friend.

This thread is about volunteer instructors helping newbie learn clean, smooth, fast lines and car control. And why OP stopped.

He is/was scared and quit. We all, that race and coach understand that. I wanted to get to what I believe is the heart of the issue.

No one should be scared at this level. If you are dont get in the car. Set the expectation early that this is a HPDE. The speeds are different and that's a big deal.We are coaching you walk before you run. We must set the expectation early. If you want to race, get a race car and a pro coach. If youre driving over your experience and I will shut you down. Thats a coach and must be an instructor if riding in the right seat!

Thank you for your perspective Mr. Pro. This is mine.