GT350
08-07-2016, 08:35 AM
#1516
Empherical data please. On longer circuits no. It's 7 seconds behind the GT3 at the Ring. On shorter technical circuits I seriously doubt it. M3 GTS is faster and the GT3 is faster than the M.
Case in point. Pobst did a 1:57 in the R at Chuckwalla. Patrick Long did a 1:57 at Chuckwalla in a vintage '69 911ST 2.5. Now imagine if he was working with a 991 GT3. Nuff said.
Case in point. Pobst did a 1:57 in the R at Chuckwalla. Patrick Long did a 1:57 at Chuckwalla in a vintage '69 911ST 2.5. Now imagine if he was working with a 991 GT3. Nuff said.
Comparing a 2,100lb 260hp 911ST racecar running race dampers and slicks to a showroom stock production car is your case in point?
Have you been to Chuckwalla? The track is very weather dependant and there's a big difference from an overcast, cleaned off, rubbered-in track on an HSR race weekend to a bright and sunny, dusty, private day with only 2 cars on track (Pobst MT H2H).
And yes I've back to backed a GT3 to a 350R.
0.02
08-07-2016, 10:10 AM
#1517
Nordschleife Master
There are no official 350R ring lap times, just made up internet heresay.
Comparing a 2,100lb 260hp 911ST racecar running race dampers and slicks to a showroom stock production car is your case in point?
Have you been to Chuckwalla? The track is very weather dependant and there's a big difference from an overcast, cleaned off, rubbered-in track on an HSR race weekend to a bright and sunny, dusty, private day with only 2 cars on track (Pobst MT H2H).
And yes I've back to backed a GT3 to a 350R.
0.02
Comparing a 2,100lb 260hp 911ST racecar running race dampers and slicks to a showroom stock production car is your case in point?
Have you been to Chuckwalla? The track is very weather dependant and there's a big difference from an overcast, cleaned off, rubbered-in track on an HSR race weekend to a bright and sunny, dusty, private day with only 2 cars on track (Pobst MT H2H).
And yes I've back to backed a GT3 to a 350R.
0.02
Yep my case in point is comparing a stock 3700lbs 525hp+ that revs to 8000rpm, with sophisticated Multimatic magnetic track tuned dampers, with Michelin Pilot Sport Cups, at 305 front and 315 rear. I seriously doubt any '69 vintage 911 is wearing shoes that large. Oh and the R has Massive 2 piece disc brakes with those trick CF wheels.Then we have that little 2600lb, 260 hp vintage racer that doesn't rev beyond 7000rpm. Yeah, that's my comparison. I would think in fact the R had the advantage.
And you don't think Pat Long could run a faster lap time in a 991.
GT3 with Sport Cups?
In your back to back did you get any lap times pushing both to their limits like Pobst or Long could or your limits? ..or was the back to back just blast down the street.?
I'm not saying the R isn't a fast track car but you guys have to stop drinking so much Koolaide.
08-07-2016, 10:17 AM
#1518
And you know the R ring times are Internet hearsay because...? Source?
Yep my case in point is comparing a stock 3700lbs 525hp+ that revs to 8000rpm, with sophisticated Multimatic magnetic track tuned dampers, with Michelin Pilot Sport Cups, at 305 front and 315 rear. I seriously doubt any '69 vintage 911 is wearing shoes that large. Oh and the R has Massive 2 piece disc brakes with those trick CF wheels.Then we have that little 2600lb, 260 hp vintage racer that doesn't rev beyond 7000rpm. Yeah, that's my comparison. I would think in fact the R had the advantage.
And you don't think Pat Long could run a faster lap lap time in a 991.
GT3 with Cup Sports?
In your back to back did you get any lap times pushing both to their limits like Pobst or Long could your limits? ..or was the back to back just blast down the street.?
I'm not saying the R isn't a fast track car but you guys have to stop drinking so much Koolaide.
Yep my case in point is comparing a stock 3700lbs 525hp+ that revs to 8000rpm, with sophisticated Multimatic magnetic track tuned dampers, with Michelin Pilot Sport Cups, at 305 front and 315 rear. I seriously doubt any '69 vintage 911 is wearing shoes that large. Oh and the R has Massive 2 piece disc brakes with those trick CF wheels.Then we have that little 2600lb, 260 hp vintage racer that doesn't rev beyond 7000rpm. Yeah, that's my comparison. I would think in fact the R had the advantage.
And you don't think Pat Long could run a faster lap lap time in a 991.
GT3 with Cup Sports?
In your back to back did you get any lap times pushing both to their limits like Pobst or Long could your limits? ..or was the back to back just blast down the street.?
I'm not saying the R isn't a fast track car but you guys have to stop drinking so much Koolaide.
The 911SC racecar is as useless as comparing it to a 130hp 1,000lb formula car. If you don't understand the difference in track conditions (given equivalent, Randy likely would have been a second faster than the 911SC and a GT3 would be right there with the 350R) and if you think a racecar running slicks at nearly half the weight is a valid comparison, I don't have anything for ya...
Yes, and both cars had sticker tires.
08-07-2016, 10:53 AM
#1519
Nordschleife Master
Because Ford has never released Ring times, ever, and HorsepowerKings is notorious for BS-filled click bait.
The 911SC racecar is as useless as comparing it to a 130hp 1,000lb formula car. If you don't understand the difference in track conditions (given equivalent, Randy likely would have been a second faster than the 911SC and a GT3 would be right there with the 350R) and if you think a racecar running slicks at nearly half the weight is a valid comparison, I don't have anything for ya...
Yes, and both cars had sticker tires.
The 911SC racecar is as useless as comparing it to a 130hp 1,000lb formula car. If you don't understand the difference in track conditions (given equivalent, Randy likely would have been a second faster than the 911SC and a GT3 would be right there with the 350R) and if you think a racecar running slicks at nearly half the weight is a valid comparison, I don't have anything for ya...
Yes, and both cars had sticker tires.
Oh and my source wasn't Horsepwer Kings.
Oh I understand differences in track conditions but where is your information they were running when the conditions were different? Moreover if they were different how do we know that the R didn't in fact have more favorable conditions?
Every track has different conditions. So do we throw all track time comparisons out that weren't done back to back?
Take those huge Sport Cup 2s off and you've just pulled the teeth out of the Abomindel Snow man.
Yep. Thats my comparison and I'm stick'n to it so looks like we don't have much for each other. So you still don't think Long could run a faster time in a 991 GT3 than that vintage 911?
08-07-2016, 12:29 PM
#1521
Instructor
I just bought a 17 GT350. I think they've fixed panel gap issues as I don't see any on mine.
At $65k I am having more fun with the mustang than I had with my 16 911 GTS. It could be that the Shelby is a manual and GTS was a PDK. Not sure. Or it could be the sound.
Off course It isn't built like a Porsche, off course the dealership experience sucks.
I intend on daily driving mine and plan on putting some serious miles on it. I will also heavily use it on the mountain runs and track. It's a car I can drive and not care where I park. I didn't even do the clear bra on it.
At $65k I am having more fun with the mustang than I had with my 16 911 GTS. It could be that the Shelby is a manual and GTS was a PDK. Not sure. Or it could be the sound.
Off course It isn't built like a Porsche, off course the dealership experience sucks.
I intend on daily driving mine and plan on putting some serious miles on it. I will also heavily use it on the mountain runs and track. It's a car I can drive and not care where I park. I didn't even do the clear bra on it.
08-07-2016, 01:26 PM
#1523
Oh I'm sorry. I was wrong. The R is actually running Sport Cup 2s. About the equivalent of Hoosier R6s.
Oh and my source wasn't Horsepwer Kings.
Oh I understand differences in track conditions but where is your information they were running when the conditions were different? Moreover if they were different how do we know that the R didn't in fact have more favorable conditions?
Every track has different conditions. So do we throw all track time comparisons out that weren't done back to back?
Take huge Sport Cup 2s off and you've just pulled the teeth out of the Abomindel Snow man.
Yep. Thats my comparison and I'm stick'n to it so looks like we don't have much for each other. So you still don't think Long could run a faster time in a 991 GT3 than that vintage 911?
Oh and my source wasn't Horsepwer Kings.
Oh I understand differences in track conditions but where is your information they were running when the conditions were different? Moreover if they were different how do we know that the R didn't in fact have more favorable conditions?
Every track has different conditions. So do we throw all track time comparisons out that weren't done back to back?
Take huge Sport Cup 2s off and you've just pulled the teeth out of the Abomindel Snow man.
Yep. Thats my comparison and I'm stick'n to it so looks like we don't have much for each other. So you still don't think Long could run a faster time in a 991 GT3 than that vintage 911?
Watch the videos, it's pretty easy to tell for anyone with some track experience.
It's the internet so feel free to believe whatever you like
08-07-2016, 02:14 PM
#1524
Nordschleife Master
Ok, whats your source? Mine is FastLaps and reviewing official recorded times at various tracks. The recorded times are pretty specific down to the hundreth. Granted there will be variations due to driver and all the other variables but thats whats available. No, I don't rely on "Horsepower Kings". Give me some credit here. 
Yes, it is the internet. Yes, we can all believe what we like. You can believe Pat Long can run a faster time in a '69 Vintage 911 ST that revs to 7000 with slicks than than he can in a new 991 GT3 with Michelin Pilot Sport Cups that has PDK sport, 4 wheel steering, torque vectoring and revs to 9000 rpm and I can believe he can't.
I'm confident I know which one of us is right on that one.
Yes, it is the internet. Yes, we can all believe what we like. You can believe Pat Long can run a faster time in a '69 Vintage 911 ST that revs to 7000 with slicks than than he can in a new 991 GT3 with Michelin Pilot Sport Cups that has PDK sport, 4 wheel steering, torque vectoring and revs to 9000 rpm and I can believe he can't.
I'm confident I know which one of us is right on that one.
08-07-2016, 02:47 PM
#1525
Then fastlap has no credibility for using HP Kings as their source since HP Kings post predates any mention of that fabricated 7:32.19 lap time, and Ford does not publish ring times.
08-07-2016, 05:44 PM
#1527
Nordschleife Master
Source for the statement the R time of 7:32.19 is fabricated ?
Ford tested the GT350 at the Ring, no? And you believe if they beat that time with the R we wouldn't know all about it?
Timo Kluck is down with a 7:25 in the 991 GT3. Pretty specific there. We have time and driver. Is that fabricated too? So you think the R can get into the mid 20s? Really?
Put the Koolaide down. You've had enough.
08-07-2016, 05:50 PM
#1528
Ford does not state ring times.
On another note. Have you ever seen a pic of the GT350 running around the ring with the R wing on it?
It's not kooliaid when it's first hand experience. Have you back to backed a 350R & GT3, or tracked either?
08-07-2016, 06:00 PM
#1529
I am going to get a GT350. Would you recommend finding a deal on a new 16 or play the over MSRP game on a 17. Best I was able to find in my tri county dealer on a 17 was $5k over. I am new at the gt350 search. Any help or advice would be appreciated. Thx
08-07-2016, 06:00 PM
#1530
Nordschleife Master
Back to back track times at the limit. No I haven't. Just driving them back to back doesn't cut it either.
So your saying the R can hit the mid 20s at the ring? We know kluck did a 7:25 in the GT 3. The Z28 never hit the 20s. So the R is that much faster at the Ring and it's all kept hush hush? Oey. Stop.
So your saying the R can hit the mid 20s at the ring? We know kluck did a 7:25 in the GT 3. The Z28 never hit the 20s. So the R is that much faster at the Ring and it's all kept hush hush? Oey. Stop.