Nose lift, CPO, PCNA
#196
Instructor
Interesting thanks John
Here's a copy of the Wiring for the unit i made up earlier. It aligns with the official one perfectly :-)
I am now ordering parts to make a tester to allow me to fully bench test this system and hopefully quickly isolate component faults on the FAL.
Here's a copy of the Wiring for the unit i made up earlier. It aligns with the official one perfectly :-)
I am now ordering parts to make a tester to allow me to fully bench test this system and hopefully quickly isolate component faults on the FAL.
#197
Instructor
Managed to get the pressure gauge and M8x1 adapter through the post today so I was able to test that my FAL can reach the 18bar pressure in the storage tank. Also checked that the 18bar pressure switch closes on the tank regulator......
Both tests were successful, so I am now building a tester using a Raspberry Pi processor to emulate the cars central control unit and actuate the valves for LIFT and DROP and thereby allow me to check the other two Suco pressure switches at the front of the unit mounted on the valve block.
Both tests were successful, so I am now building a tester using a Raspberry Pi processor to emulate the cars central control unit and actuate the valves for LIFT and DROP and thereby allow me to check the other two Suco pressure switches at the front of the unit mounted on the valve block.
The following users liked this post:
Elliotw44 (05-24-2021)
#199
Instructor
Homemade FAL Tester
Finally finished and made initial testing of my homemade FAL tester.... Used an old Raspberry Pi processor and some relays... Mounted it all in an old Garmin watch box......
Works perfect.. System initially charges when turned on from tester (simulating ignition on). After about 3 minutes the 18 Bar switch closes and triggers my script to set the amber LED (Amber = Charged).
Pushing the up button opens the solenoid controlled 2 way valve on the FAL. When the system gets to 13 bar of pressure, the front right 13 bar pressure switch closes which triggers my script to set the red LED (Red = LIFT)
Green LED is on all the time. When down button is pressed the dump valve solenoid is actuated once the system drops below 1.5 Bar the left front pressure switch opens, this signals my script to turn the green LED out. (Green LED out = DOWN)
The system can also test the heat switch on the motor housing. It just opens when the temperature gets too hot.
After all this playing around mine was just a faulty £4 drive belt available from Radio Spares !! Nuts that this is not a replacement part with Porsche.
Works perfect.. System initially charges when turned on from tester (simulating ignition on). After about 3 minutes the 18 Bar switch closes and triggers my script to set the amber LED (Amber = Charged).
Pushing the up button opens the solenoid controlled 2 way valve on the FAL. When the system gets to 13 bar of pressure, the front right 13 bar pressure switch closes which triggers my script to set the red LED (Red = LIFT)
Green LED is on all the time. When down button is pressed the dump valve solenoid is actuated once the system drops below 1.5 Bar the left front pressure switch opens, this signals my script to turn the green LED out. (Green LED out = DOWN)
The system can also test the heat switch on the motor housing. It just opens when the temperature gets too hot.
After all this playing around mine was just a faulty £4 drive belt available from Radio Spares !! Nuts that this is not a replacement part with Porsche.
Last edited by cdixon; 04-23-2021 at 08:10 PM.
The following 4 users liked this post by cdixon:
#200
Rennlist Member
Finally finished and made initial testing of my homemade FAL tester.... Used an old Raspberry Pi processor and some relays... Mounted it all in an old Garmin watch box......
Works perfect.. System initially charges when turned on from tester (simulating ignition on). After about 3 minutes the 18 Bar switch closes and triggers my script to set the amber LED (Amber = Charged).
Pushing the up button opens the solenoid controlled 2 way valve on the FAL. When the system gets to 13 bar of pressure, the front right 13 bar pressure switch closes which triggers my script to set the red LED (Red = LIFT)
Green LED is on all the time. When down button is pressed the dump valve solenoid is actuated once the system drops below 1.5 Bar the left front pressure switch opens, this signals my script to turn the green LED out. (Green LED out = DOWN)
The system can also test the heat switch on the motor housing. It just opens when the temperature gets too hot.
After all this playing around mine was just a faulty £4 drive belt available from Radio Spares !! Nuts that this is not a replacement part with Porsche.
Works perfect.. System initially charges when turned on from tester (simulating ignition on). After about 3 minutes the 18 Bar switch closes and triggers my script to set the amber LED (Amber = Charged).
Pushing the up button opens the solenoid controlled 2 way valve on the FAL. When the system gets to 13 bar of pressure, the front right 13 bar pressure switch closes which triggers my script to set the red LED (Red = LIFT)
Green LED is on all the time. When down button is pressed the dump valve solenoid is actuated once the system drops below 1.5 Bar the left front pressure switch opens, this signals my script to turn the green LED out. (Green LED out = DOWN)
The system can also test the heat switch on the motor housing. It just opens when the temperature gets too hot.
After all this playing around mine was just a faulty £4 drive belt available from Radio Spares !! Nuts that this is not a replacement part with Porsche.
#202
Rennlist Member
Finally finished and made initial testing of my homemade FAL tester.... Used an old Raspberry Pi processor and some relays... Mounted it all in an old Garmin watch box......
Works perfect.. System initially charges when turned on from tester (simulating ignition on). After about 3 minutes the 18 Bar switch closes and triggers my script to set the amber LED (Amber = Charged).
Pushing the up button opens the solenoid controlled 2 way valve on the FAL. When the system gets to 13 bar of pressure, the front right 13 bar pressure switch closes which triggers my script to set the red LED (Red = LIFT)
Green LED is on all the time. When down button is pressed the dump valve solenoid is actuated once the system drops below 1.5 Bar the left front pressure switch opens, this signals my script to turn the green LED out. (Green LED out = DOWN)
The system can also test the heat switch on the motor housing. It just opens when the temperature gets too hot.
After all this playing around mine was just a faulty £4 drive belt available from Radio Spares !! Nuts that this is not a replacement part with Porsche.
Works perfect.. System initially charges when turned on from tester (simulating ignition on). After about 3 minutes the 18 Bar switch closes and triggers my script to set the amber LED (Amber = Charged).
Pushing the up button opens the solenoid controlled 2 way valve on the FAL. When the system gets to 13 bar of pressure, the front right 13 bar pressure switch closes which triggers my script to set the red LED (Red = LIFT)
Green LED is on all the time. When down button is pressed the dump valve solenoid is actuated once the system drops below 1.5 Bar the left front pressure switch opens, this signals my script to turn the green LED out. (Green LED out = DOWN)
The system can also test the heat switch on the motor housing. It just opens when the temperature gets too hot.
After all this playing around mine was just a faulty £4 drive belt available from Radio Spares !! Nuts that this is not a replacement part with Porsche.
Last edited by Elliotw44; 05-24-2021 at 01:45 AM.
#203
Rennlist Member
When looking at this diagram of the FAL system: Link
There is two part numbers for switch 14.
997 341 967 90 & 997 341 964 90
Does anyone know the difference?
There is two part numbers for switch 14.
997 341 967 90 & 997 341 964 90
Does anyone know the difference?
#204
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
There was some discussion about them, and maybe one of them was upgraded, I can't recall-you'd have to go through the thread, and there are a few others if you search 997 GT3/GT3 section
I just used my FAL today, to keep it working. But I use it sparingly.
I think the valves can be bought directly for bout $50, vs $200+ at dealers
But the site was in German only as far as I recall
JB
I just used my FAL today, to keep it working. But I use it sparingly.
I think the valves can be bought directly for bout $50, vs $200+ at dealers
But the site was in German only as far as I recall
JB
Last edited by JB911; 05-24-2021 at 02:55 AM.
#206
Instructor
It fits :-)
The part number for the belt is as follows:-
CONTITECH HTD 312-3M-09
Contitech is Continental
HTD = High Torque Drive
312 is the circumference (312mm)
3m is the length range
09 is the belt width (9mm)
Here's a ink to buy in the UK. Quite a common usage part so you States side guys shouldn't have an issue :-)
https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/timing-belts/1821333/?cm_mmc=UK-PLA-DS3A-_-bing-_-PLA_UK_EN_Pneumatics_%26_Hydraulics_%26_Power_Transmission_Whoop-_-Timing+Belts_Whoop-_-PRODUCT_GROUP&matchtype=e&pla-4574930449233578&s_kwcid=AL!7457!3!!e!!o!4574930449233578!&gclid=c64a09f 96a2e18a74bcb6994c5eaed0b&gclsrc=3p.ds&msclkid=c64a09f96a2e18a74bcb6994c 5eaed0b
The pressure switches (Only replaceable parts on the system according to Porsche) are made buy Suco and can be obtained for about £42 + Tax and shipping each.
The part numbers are as follows:- NOTE they need to be calibrated to exact pressure by manufacturer.
13 Bar Pressure switch mounted on right of valve block as you look from above (Signals for lift message to come on when raise pressure reaches 13 bar and actuates switch) -------- 0140459031009
1.5 Bar Pressure switch mounted on left of valve block as you look from above (Signals for lift message to go out when raise pressure drops to 1.5 bar) -------- 0140457031003
17 Bar Pressure switch mounted on storage tank regulator ( Signals to control system to stop 12vDC feed to motor when tank pressure of 17 Bar reached) -------- 0140459031009
I attach the English product sheet for them
They can be sourced in the UK from:- (Note 7-8 week lead time, probably COVID / BREXIT has something to do with that)
Suco - 0140/0141 Pressure Switch IP65 0140457031003 | OEM Automatic Ltd
I'm still waiting on a call back about the solenoid actuated valves (Basically look like commercial vehicle parts) !
//Chris
the 13 Bar switch is the one you mention.
You also state you are going to rebuild your FAL with new switches and belt….. Is it working now or faulty?
The following users liked this post:
sfo (11-16-2023)
#207
Rennlist Member
Take a look at this posting from me, I also attach the original brochure in English for the pressure switches and have put the OEM suppliers part numbers.
the 13 Bar switch is the one you mention.
You also state you are going to rebuild your FAL with new switches and belt….. Is it working now or faulty?
the 13 Bar switch is the one you mention.
You also state you are going to rebuild your FAL with new switches and belt….. Is it working now or faulty?
#208
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
I might be the only one to have gotten the Lift Malfunction message on the dashboard-before this thread, my car had a FAL issue, and the dealer claimed to have replaced a switch. No idea which one, but I can try to look for the receipt(probably around 2014)
Once I got the Lift Malfunction message, I initiated another repair. I had to escalate the repair to replace the entire system, and hence this thread. It at first was denied, then a percentage of cost was offered which I then contested and politely but firmly demanded a full warranty repair. That dealer's manager managed to get the complete pump, and I thanked PCNA and the dealer publicly, as I'm pretty sure they monitored this thread at the time. My CPO coverage had just expired, my claim is that the repair wasn't fully addressed during CPO period. It had been expired for less than a week. So thanks again to PCNA and the manager at Porsche of West Broward.
The 991 lifts also malfunctioned, and that system can't be used on 997s as far as I know
Since these switches can indeed be bought for about $50, it's worth doing, and the belt might as well be replaced too.
There is also a procedure to attach the hoses- there are marks on them to indicate they can't be pushed too far in our out when tightening the nut:
And one more thought-there is a valve(like a tire valve)that the manual says to press or remove with a tire valve screw driver)to depressurize the system before taking it out of the car. It might be a good idea to replace that valve, or at least unscrew and see if it's ok, or just re-tighten since valves like that can have a slow leak-
Also, other posters showed that you can replace the 2 switches without removing the entire system, but tools to loosen them onboard I can't recall-
Thanks for all the collaborative efforts,
John
Once I got the Lift Malfunction message, I initiated another repair. I had to escalate the repair to replace the entire system, and hence this thread. It at first was denied, then a percentage of cost was offered which I then contested and politely but firmly demanded a full warranty repair. That dealer's manager managed to get the complete pump, and I thanked PCNA and the dealer publicly, as I'm pretty sure they monitored this thread at the time. My CPO coverage had just expired, my claim is that the repair wasn't fully addressed during CPO period. It had been expired for less than a week. So thanks again to PCNA and the manager at Porsche of West Broward.
The 991 lifts also malfunctioned, and that system can't be used on 997s as far as I know
Since these switches can indeed be bought for about $50, it's worth doing, and the belt might as well be replaced too.
There is also a procedure to attach the hoses- there are marks on them to indicate they can't be pushed too far in our out when tightening the nut:
And one more thought-there is a valve(like a tire valve)that the manual says to press or remove with a tire valve screw driver)to depressurize the system before taking it out of the car. It might be a good idea to replace that valve, or at least unscrew and see if it's ok, or just re-tighten since valves like that can have a slow leak-
Also, other posters showed that you can replace the 2 switches without removing the entire system, but tools to loosen them onboard I can't recall-
Thanks for all the collaborative efforts,
John
Last edited by JB911; 05-24-2021 at 12:57 PM.
#209
Instructor
No lift is almost certainly the 13bar Suco pressure switch.
This switch closes when the system reaches 13bar in the fron shock air chambers. This then closes the circuit sending 12v DC back to the control unit in the car which lights the word ‘lift’ on the dash
Likely to be hydraulic fluid from the shocks leaking back into the air chambers and then being pulled back into the FAL.
The belt is not a changeable part from Porsche so you will need to get from RS…. I placed a link in an earlier posting.
If you want I can send you electrical and pneumatic wiring diagrams and operational flowcharts that I reverse engineered to enable me to build my tester and write the python script for it. (PM me if interested)
This switch closes when the system reaches 13bar in the fron shock air chambers. This then closes the circuit sending 12v DC back to the control unit in the car which lights the word ‘lift’ on the dash
Likely to be hydraulic fluid from the shocks leaking back into the air chambers and then being pulled back into the FAL.
The belt is not a changeable part from Porsche so you will need to get from RS…. I placed a link in an earlier posting.
If you want I can send you electrical and pneumatic wiring diagrams and operational flowcharts that I reverse engineered to enable me to build my tester and write the python script for it. (PM me if interested)
#210
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
I also bought new washers for the ones, they go on the banjo bolts that attach to the shocks.
While I had them out, I ran the system for a few minutes to get fresh air through it just in case-I did it in the winter when the humidity level is low.
Yesterday when I activated the system and got Lift on the dashboard, I drove slowly for about 20 minutes to make sure it stayed like that. I then pulled over and lowered it with the satisfying swoooosh sound
While I had them out, I ran the system for a few minutes to get fresh air through it just in case-I did it in the winter when the humidity level is low.
Yesterday when I activated the system and got Lift on the dashboard, I drove slowly for about 20 minutes to make sure it stayed like that. I then pulled over and lowered it with the satisfying swoooosh sound