Mabuhay

I don't buy that. Being a former mechanical engineer, I can appreciate the technology innovations that reduces the size of electronics drastically. But to have a transmitter small enough to fit the "valet" key is impossible to date. I'll believe it for the regular car key, but no way for the valet key.

crispenigl

No updates for a few weeks. Waiting for plea to be entered still.

The suspect has a long history of this and might know a trick that no else knows. Who knows right now.

waiting to find out more like the rest of you.

Macster

The RFID pill is pretty small. Open your key module and look for small "pill" shaped glass cylinder in one of the key module halves.

The electronics can be fitted on a 0.05mm by 0.05mm "chip". What takes room is the antenna. A smaller antenna of course means a smaller device but with less transmission range.

As it is the RFID pill only needs to transmit a few inches to provide the code to enable engine start. Power is generated at the RFID pill by the query or who are you transmission from the in-dash security module. This wakes up the device and triggers its response with its ID.

Sincerely,

Macster.

Edgy01

Despite all the dialog about "how" the perpetrator got into and started up the car, we still have no clue as to "why" the car would be driven out into the desert and then torched. It certainly wasn't used for a joy ride. The level of sophistication of the theft portion of this doesn't align with the disposal portion.

Max Power

it could have been stolen with the intention of taking it to someone who would have disassembled it for parts or shipped it to Russia, and that someone simply didn't anwser their phone that night

Mabuhay

WOW... if true this would be way too cool. In my BMW M3, I know that the "turning action of the key" is what energizes or "powers" the chip. I would still be at awe then how it can be made this small. Technology is improving so exponentially that it's scary!

Unfortunately, it's a sickness... Why? Because they can and it's something to do. Arsonists just "like to see it burn".

JDHertz11

I am a locksmith and have been at the forefront of transponder technology since it first came online here in the US in the mid 90's. Nearly any late model vehicle that is reported stolen and is equipped with a transponder is an inside job. The systems used by Porsche have an encrypted and sometimes rolling code system. This means that there are millions, if not billions of possible values out there. I have just finished some testing on a "Clone" key system that is aimed at retail auto parts stores but we cannot seem to break the VW/ Audi/ Porsche system down. Feel free to ask any questions that you may have, I'd be happy to answer them here.

Mabuhay

So if I use one key to unlock and drive the car and it "sets a new rolling code", then why or how is it that I can unlock and drive the car with my other key or even the valet key? I.e. - if it's a "rolling code", then how could the other keys know about it? This is something I never understood. Do the "original 3 keys" have a "base code" of some sort? If so, then that would sound like a security flaw to me.

JDHertz11

The systems run off of a pre-learned algorithm much the same way garage door openers work. I think, but I'd have to check that Porsche uses an encrypted but non rolling code Type 48 chip. When you order a key from Mercedes Benz or BMW they come coded to work the car out of the box. They do this by setting up a specific amount (8 keys) of codes in the ECU. The keys are burned to the predetermined codes when the dealer calls for them. The Porsche on the other hand, sends out cut keys that still need to be programed to the car. The car then learns the chip value through programing with the factory scan tool...

andrew2008

So what methods are used in cases where there's a transponder and it's
*not* an inside job?

JDHertz11

The systems can be defeated in many ways but usually involve the use of tow trucks or vin ordered keys. There are some offshore companies that sell devices to add and delete keys through backdoor means. Eastern European countries are known for havng very bright criminals. The lack of conventional work has led to these geeks starting side jobs in computer hacking...

996FLT6

How do tow trucks get away from not triggering the alarm from sounding. Does jacking up one side of the car disable the alarm and security function and then use a valet key ? Mike

JDHertz11

The term valet key has been used very loosely in this thread. A valet key is a key that opens the door and starts the car in most cases. A master key allows entry into the vehicles' doors, glove box, trunk, ignition etc. I think that you guys are confused with the function somewhat. A mechanical key is what I think you are reffering to. A mechanical key will open locks that do not need to see a transponder value. A door can be unlocked with a mechanical key. Most late model Porsches have mechanically locked ignitions that will turn with the key but still need to see the correct transponder value to start the engine. The Cayenne for instance, does not have a conventionally locked ignition cylinder. It's key has an extra cut that triggers the car to "look" for a transponder value. This may be confusing to some. I can post some pictures if anyone is interested...

dtmarsh

JD, We're interested... post some pics. Thx.

JDHertz11

I'll get some pictures together this week when I'm at work. BTW there are some tuners that turn off the immobilizer on VW's and Audi's when they do engine swaps. I have heard of some Porsche tuners doing the same. Mileage is also a very easy file to over right especially on VW/ Audis and I suppose Porsches as well... Once you know where the info is held in the code you can "fill in the blanks"