plpete84

Well said, @G.I.G. Seems like you've been doing the right thing as far as maintenance. Since the PPI, have you pulled the sump to see if there has been any visual changes to the bores after 2 years and 10k miles? I'm in a very similar situation and will be doing this after having driven about 8k miles. It will be nice to have a data point that I can reference.

997 at 275

Yes 997.1 smoking and ticking at 68K used about 1.5 lt of 0w-40 mobil one (crap oil) in 40 0r so miles, light scorring #6 cyl but enough... solution...FSI 4.0 engine ...that was the fix before it screwed up my summer. . look at my two other forums about this..that's all

rtl5009

1.5 quarts every 40 miles?

G.I.G.

No, and I have no intention to do so. I've received several great UOA's at this point, and my car continues to run reliably with no symptomatic signs of bore scoring. The wear metals are in the low single digits. My last oil change had only 4 PPM of aluminum with 2,600 miles on the sample, and the virgin sample I sent in for reference (Millers CFS 10W-50 NT+) had 3 PPM of aluminum. So my wear metals are negligible at this point. Unless I see an increase in wear metals (namely aluminum) or tell tale signs of scoring (sooty driver's side exhaust pipe, ticking sounds, spike in oil consumption, etc.), I plan on continuing with frequent oil changes and maintenance, and driving and enjoying the car.

Flat6 Innovations

As long as the particles are not too large to be detected by the UOA regimen.

Sporty

Would you then see them in the opened up oil filter?

plpete84

If that was the case, wouldn't the UOA show an increase first followed by a decline, which would then point to particles being too large to be detected by the test?

Flat6 Innovations

In some cases, but they will first appear in the oil sump plate.

Flat6 Innovations

Yes, IF you are sampling often enough to catch this.
There’s an excellent video of this exact situation at www.rennvision.tv
search for “used oil analysis and a failed engine”

People put too much stock in wear metals. I can see mechanical wear in other ways.

plpete84

Cool. Seen the videos. It seems like a systematic approach to UOA is best if you want to have a steady data trend to study from. At least for those of us who are not M96/M97 engine whisperers

G.I.G.

Makes sense. But if the aluminum particles are too big to show up on a UOA, am I wrong in assuming that you would have fairly advanced stage bore scoring at that point with the aforementioned symptoms (sooty exhaust pipes, a spike in oil consumption, possible ticking noises, etc.)? My UOA's are just one of several trends/data points that I monitor. Oil consumption (which has been very consistent since I purchased my car 2 years ago) is another.

I also forgot to mention that I do cut open my oil filters and they have been free of debris. Again, it's just one data point of several.

Charles Navarro

ICP method (Blackstone) can see up to about 5 microns. RDE method (SPEEDiagnostix) can see up to 10 micron. Anything under 40 micron you aren't going to be able to see with your eyes and would require a separate test to identify for particle size and count.

G.I.G.

Good to know. Thanks, Charles. I've been using SPEEDiagnostix for my UOA's purchased from LN Engineering, of course

My follow-up question: from your experience, can UOA's be an indicator of potential bore scoring before other symptoms occur? The reason why I ask is I'm questioning if I should be doing UOA's after every oil change if the aluminum from the bore isn't detectable due to it's size once scoring has begun.

Charles Navarro

Yes. A UOA will detect early signs well before symptoms manifest. As long as you have a baseline for your engine, when the iron, aluminum, and silicon levels rise, that's a safe indicator of the start of bore scoring on a stock engine.

G.I.G.

Got it. I'll continue to monitor those levels with my UOA's. Thanks.