2019 Engine Rebuild Comparison RND/FSI/EBS/Vertex
#151
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Remove the seal off the larger IMSB. Just a little added piece of mind with splash lubrication.
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#152
#153
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A very interesting thread.
Here at Hartech we do rebuild 1 engine/day. we handle the difficult situation of fitting our closed deck Nikasil alloy liners into blocks for other specialists (Worldwide), short blocks, whole engines and the much easier job of receiving the whole car though to rebuild (Videos available on our web site www,hartecg.org). The vast majority of rebuilds in which other specialists were involved go perfectly well (although if we ever do have problems it is when other specialists rebuild the engine (or fit it to a car). This is rare but we prefer to do it ourselves but that limits the number of owners we can provide our solutions to. We have been involved with Alpine for some time trying to provide our solutions over the pond - to supply this service to help everyone with different resources and requirements to rebuild the engine how they want it done (although we never compromise on issues we know are absolutely required).
We also provide oversized engines for Boxster S 3.2 to 3.7, 996 3.4 to 3.7, 996/7 3.6 to 3.9, Cayman S 3.4 to 3.9 etc.
Although extremely busy we carry out all work in house (our own precision machine shop and staff), our own rolling road etc.
This Autumn we hope to be in a position to export exchange blocks for all variants.
Among the special parts we manufacture are re-manufactured IMS with the larger later ball bearing for both new Hivo chain models and earlier Roller chain crankshafts and for racing - Accusump adaptors and deeper sumps with valved controls for surge,.
Although not yet able to provide video productions of all this - we are very soon able to send by E-mail - both short and very long technical reports outlining what we do and why.
If you want to be added to the list please for a report please send your request to baz@hartech.org and head it with a choice of the following.
The 4 main problems with this engine range "Short Version", or "long version", or "oversized engines". This includes seizing the 9A1 Gen 2 engine (even though it is extremely rare).
Please do not request the long versions if you are not interested in the very technical details involved, long detailed technical explanations, test results, photos and conclusions that are thousands of words long.
Baz
Here at Hartech we do rebuild 1 engine/day. we handle the difficult situation of fitting our closed deck Nikasil alloy liners into blocks for other specialists (Worldwide), short blocks, whole engines and the much easier job of receiving the whole car though to rebuild (Videos available on our web site www,hartecg.org). The vast majority of rebuilds in which other specialists were involved go perfectly well (although if we ever do have problems it is when other specialists rebuild the engine (or fit it to a car). This is rare but we prefer to do it ourselves but that limits the number of owners we can provide our solutions to. We have been involved with Alpine for some time trying to provide our solutions over the pond - to supply this service to help everyone with different resources and requirements to rebuild the engine how they want it done (although we never compromise on issues we know are absolutely required).
We also provide oversized engines for Boxster S 3.2 to 3.7, 996 3.4 to 3.7, 996/7 3.6 to 3.9, Cayman S 3.4 to 3.9 etc.
Although extremely busy we carry out all work in house (our own precision machine shop and staff), our own rolling road etc.
This Autumn we hope to be in a position to export exchange blocks for all variants.
Among the special parts we manufacture are re-manufactured IMS with the larger later ball bearing for both new Hivo chain models and earlier Roller chain crankshafts and for racing - Accusump adaptors and deeper sumps with valved controls for surge,.
Although not yet able to provide video productions of all this - we are very soon able to send by E-mail - both short and very long technical reports outlining what we do and why.
If you want to be added to the list please for a report please send your request to baz@hartech.org and head it with a choice of the following.
The 4 main problems with this engine range "Short Version", or "long version", or "oversized engines". This includes seizing the 9A1 Gen 2 engine (even though it is extremely rare).
Please do not request the long versions if you are not interested in the very technical details involved, long detailed technical explanations, test results, photos and conclusions that are thousands of words long.
Baz
#154
Rennlist Member
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I know folks are interested in which way I decided to go with my car, and the answer is...the short block swap. I dropped my car off this afternoon and I'll get it back in a few weeks. My mechanic is going to document things as he goes and I'll start another thread to post pictures.
Why did I go this way? Once you figure in head work, the short block swap ends up being around the same price as a cheap rebuild, but with more new parts. Additionally, I just couldn't get comfortable with the sleeving options available. This way, I can worry less about whether the block was done properly - it's from the factory. The short block comes with a two-year warranty (my mechanic is Porsche certified, a former dealer tech). Given that I'm only going to put on a couple thousand miles per year, I'm pretty confident the the factory block is going to give me many years of service.
Additional things I'm having done in addition to the new short block:
* Rebuilding the heads (machining, valve guides, pads, chains, springs etc.)
* New clutch kit
* New coolant tank
* New AOS
* New fuel filter
* Swapping the muffler-delete exhaust for some Agency Power cans
* Replacing a seat belt buckle with a bad sensor
I'll report my results back here. I know lots of people would make a different choice. If anyone does go a different route, please post your experience here. If it's something not included in the spreadsheet, I will add it.
Why did I go this way? Once you figure in head work, the short block swap ends up being around the same price as a cheap rebuild, but with more new parts. Additionally, I just couldn't get comfortable with the sleeving options available. This way, I can worry less about whether the block was done properly - it's from the factory. The short block comes with a two-year warranty (my mechanic is Porsche certified, a former dealer tech). Given that I'm only going to put on a couple thousand miles per year, I'm pretty confident the the factory block is going to give me many years of service.
Additional things I'm having done in addition to the new short block:
* Rebuilding the heads (machining, valve guides, pads, chains, springs etc.)
* New clutch kit
* New coolant tank
* New AOS
* New fuel filter
* Swapping the muffler-delete exhaust for some Agency Power cans
* Replacing a seat belt buckle with a bad sensor
I'll report my results back here. I know lots of people would make a different choice. If anyone does go a different route, please post your experience here. If it's something not included in the spreadsheet, I will add it.
#155
Former Vendor
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Additionally, I just couldn't get comfortable with the sleeving options available.
It sounds like going the way that you are is the quickest, and quite possibly along the same cost as the cheapest.
Now, that being said you really need to question the warranty before you need it. In my direct experience, the warranty was only good if the work was done under the roof of a Porsche dealership, and it didn't matter if someone was previously a Porsche certified technician. I would not assume this at all, and I would get it in specific writing clearly saying that the installer and his facility are authorized by Porsche to carry out this work, while retaining the factory warranty.
Some hassles now, may lead to a lot less hassle later.
#156
Rennlist Member
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Take too long? Cost too much?
It sounds like going the way that you are is the quickest, and quite possibly along the same cost as the cheapest.
Now, that being said you really need to question the warranty before you need it. In my direct experience, the warranty was only good if the work was done under the roof of a Porsche dealership, and it didn't matter if someone was previously a Porsche certified technician. I would not assume this at all, and I would get it in specific writing clearly saying that the installer and his facility are authorized by Porsche to carry out this work, while retaining the factory warranty.
Some hassles now, may lead to a lot less hassle later.
It sounds like going the way that you are is the quickest, and quite possibly along the same cost as the cheapest.
Now, that being said you really need to question the warranty before you need it. In my direct experience, the warranty was only good if the work was done under the roof of a Porsche dealership, and it didn't matter if someone was previously a Porsche certified technician. I would not assume this at all, and I would get it in specific writing clearly saying that the installer and his facility are authorized by Porsche to carry out this work, while retaining the factory warranty.
Some hassles now, may lead to a lot less hassle later.
The warranty for a factory reman shortblock is 2 years unlimited mileage. This does not cover labor if installed by anyone but a Porsche Certified repair facility. If installed by a Porsche Certified repair facility, parts and all labor is covered for 2 years unlimited mileage. As per 2019 US Porsche Warrany Manual page 25..
Replacement Parts and Accessories
Limited Warranty
This warranty is given to the owner of any Porsche replacement part or
accessory distributed by PCNA and sold by any authorized Porsche dealer in
the United States or Canada.
Time and Mileage Period
Parts supplied by PCNA and purchased from and installed by an authorized
Porsche dealer at time of purchase are covered for two years, unlimited
mileage from the date installed, unless the repaired or replaced part is
covered under the New Car Limited Warranty. Any repaired or replaced
parts are covered only for the remainder of this warranty. All parts replaced
under this warranty become the property of PCNA.
Warranty Coverage
PCNA will arrange for repair or replacement using new or remanufactured
parts distributed by PCNA, at its sole option, any part covered under this
warranty that is defective in material or workmanship under normal use.
Parts that were sold and installed by an authorized Porsche dealer will be
repaired or replaced without charge either for parts or labor. If installed by
anyone else, the cost of the replacement parts or accessories will be borne
by PCNA (even in the case of emergency repair), but labor charges will be
your responsibility. All parts supplied under this warranty will be supplied by
PCNA and all parts replaced become the property of PCNA.
Your Responsibility for Normal Vehicle Use
Your Owner’s Manual (which includes specific recommendations
against using your car in certain ways) was written with the assumption that
you will use your car only in ways for which it was designed:
• To carry passengers and cargo within specified load limits. (The load limits
are specified on labels located in different places depending on your
model Porsche. Your Owner’s Manual gives the locations.)
• To be driven on reasonable road surfaces within legal speed limits.
Porsche Guidelines specify reasonable mileage to be at least 15 miles /
24 kilometers per day or 6000 miles / 9600 kilometers per rolling 12
months.
• If you drive less than the above-mentioned limits, or in the event of
prolonged storage, contact your local authorized Porsche dealer for
instructions.
(Note: A battery maintainer is available at your local authorized Porsche
dealer. It must be used to maintain your vehicle’s battery state of charge if
your vehicle will not be used for several days.)
• To be run on unleaded gasoline with the recommended octane rating, or
Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel (ULSD), depending upon the vehicle's powertrain,
as specified in the Owner‘s Manual.
• To be properly maintained according to the Maintenance Schedule in the
Maintenance Booklet and Car Care Instructions in your Owner’s Manual.
You must keep the receipts as proof of maintenance.
You are responsible for presenting your Porsche vehicle to an authorized
Porsche dealer as soon as a problem exists. Failure to do so could result in
consequential damage
#158
Rennlist Member
#159
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I do need to inquire about the minimum mileage requirements, as I don’t plan to do 6k miles per year. I will change the oil a couple times a year and I have a battery tender. Do you know what else is expected?
#160
Burning Brakes
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Maybe labor warranty?
Would Porsche consider anybody other than a dealership, certified?
Would Porsche consider anybody other than a dealership, certified?
#161
#162
Drifting
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I think his point may be that the two year parts warranty is only if the part is installed by an authorized Porsche dealer.
"Parts supplied by PCNA and purchased from and installed by an authorized Porsche dealer at time of purchase"
"Parts supplied by PCNA and purchased from and installed by an authorized Porsche dealer at time of purchase"
#163
Burning Brakes
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“If installed by anyone else, the cost of the replacement parts or accessories will be borne by PCNA (even in the case of emergency repair), but labor charges will be your responsibility.”
This sentence backs up Porschetech’s statement.
#164
Drifting
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But I think that is specific to the clause about repair and replacement, not the warranty coverage.
I'm not a lawyer though. One of you who is should tell us what this means in practice.
#165
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The warranty for a factory reman shortblock is 2 years unlimited mileage. This does not cover labor if installed by anyone but a Porsche Certified repair facility. If installed by a Porsche Certified repair facility, parts and all labor is covered for 2 years unlimited mileage. As per 2019 US Porsche Warrany Manual page 25..
e.g. Lokasil bores, singular piston offset for both banks, etc.