993 WB Values are UP!!!
05-14-2022, 05:44 PM
#2476
Rennlist Member
Since we're on the CarFax topic, I'll just throw my two cents out there that the whole "Clean CarFax" is such a joke with these cars and other high-end sports cars.
Most people who bought these cars new or while they've appreciated in value typically have the means (and will) to repair their accident-involved vehicles by paying for repairs out of pocket, so they don't "taint" the precious CarFax "report card".
"Clean CarFax with no accidents" means **** with these cars. My 993 shows no accidents on the CarFax. After taking it to bare metal to change the paint, surprise-surprise... took a rear quarter panel along the way (actually, not so surprising as I had my suspicions).
Most people who bought these cars new or while they've appreciated in value typically have the means (and will) to repair their accident-involved vehicles by paying for repairs out of pocket, so they don't "taint" the precious CarFax "report card".
"Clean CarFax with no accidents" means **** with these cars. My 993 shows no accidents on the CarFax. After taking it to bare metal to change the paint, surprise-surprise... took a rear quarter panel along the way (actually, not so surprising as I had my suspicions).
Last edited by 911F1; 05-14-2022 at 05:49 PM.
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M. Schneider (05-31-2022)
05-14-2022, 06:14 PM
#2477
Nordschleife Master
If you monkeys are done discussing purple cars can we go back to widebody prices? 😀
Here is an interesting one:
https://www.pcarmarket.com/auction/1...rce=linkin.bio
The car has had paintwork on the front right quarter panel. From what I read (skimming only) it wasn’t disclosed by the seller until a comment buried in the PPI that was just added to the auction. I see a difference in paint color on the passenger side profile photos.
The car fax mentions an odometer discrepancy…
Pretty poor photos and the seller was not available for questions for most of the week.
Is it me or is this typical of pcarmarket?
It has sport seats though…
Here is an interesting one:
https://www.pcarmarket.com/auction/1...rce=linkin.bio
The car has had paintwork on the front right quarter panel. From what I read (skimming only) it wasn’t disclosed by the seller until a comment buried in the PPI that was just added to the auction. I see a difference in paint color on the passenger side profile photos.
The car fax mentions an odometer discrepancy…
Pretty poor photos and the seller was not available for questions for most of the week.
Is it me or is this typical of pcarmarket?
It has sport seats though…
- Sold for: $141,250
- Auction End: 2022-05-13
- Number of Bids: 42
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fatmike (05-17-2022)
05-14-2022, 09:22 PM
#2478
Rennlist Member
Totally agree! I'll take it one step further and say that Carfax is one big scam. They (Carfax) created this must have document through marketing that everyone believes now is the holly grail of records. It's not to be trusted and it's a pain in the *** for owners. Now everytime I go for a smog check I have to stress that the tech didn't enter the mileage wrong in the system. Because if they do, it will be a huge pain in the *** to correct.
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M. Schneider (05-31-2022)
05-14-2022, 11:09 PM
#2479
Nordschleife Master
Yep. Happened 2x. On my 964 it had 44,4xx. Tech put 444,4xx. Increased my mileage 400,000. I had my old truck smog done a couple weeks ago and the tech put in 253,xxx instead of 153,xxx. Waiting for it to show up on my carfax record so I can have it removed. Both cases they had to smog again. Fortunately it was the same day but it’s a major hassle. Nothing I could do since the file is immediately uploaded. No way to correct. I went to AAA and they said the DMV only shows the 8 delivery miles from when i bought it in 1996. They only record title transfers.
05-14-2022, 11:31 PM
#2480
Rennlist Member
They have an online process. You fill out a form describing the error and provide documentation. They assign a rep and investigate. It was an obvious error and they removed the incorrect one on my 964 record: As for the latest error I filed an inquiry. They came back telling me to submit a formal request so they can investigate. I’m confident it will be will be resolved but it is still a hassle. The worst part is you need to pay to get a Carfax on the vehicle to see if something is not correct on their records.
The following 2 users liked this post by pettelli:
FlatSix911 (05-18-2022),
M. Schneider (05-31-2022)
05-17-2022, 12:13 PM
#2481
Rennlist Member
TMU
Does it seem to you guys that the number of Porsches that now list True Mileage Unknown has grown exponentially in the last year? I have 38 years with Porsches and I’ve never seen this many cars advertised for sale as TMU.
An even bigger surprise is it doesn’t seem to impact selling price. After all the back and forth on odometers, buyers are asking more questions about tire dates and color of rims than the TMU disclaimer. Strange times.
An even bigger surprise is it doesn’t seem to impact selling price. After all the back and forth on odometers, buyers are asking more questions about tire dates and color of rims than the TMU disclaimer. Strange times.
05-17-2022, 12:23 PM
#2482
Thoughts from the group on current price (US car)? - 1998 C2S Tip, silver on black, low options, 38,000 miles, 100% original paint, very good to excellent condition for the miles.
05-17-2022, 12:26 PM
#2483
Racer
$135K-$145K. The Tip is hurting it, I would have said $175K if it were a manual.
05-17-2022, 03:55 PM
#2484
Three Wheelin'
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Marco Island, FL and sometimes New Jersey
Posts: 1,339
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257 Posts
An exceptionally clean and well optioned Slate Grey tip (C2S) with 20K miles sold for $115K in December (https://bringatrailer.com/listing/19...rera-s-3-6-31/)
Also in December a (more ordinary in my opinion) C2S with 17K miles sold for $158K (https://bringatrailer.com/listing/19...rera-s-3-6-36/).
I think the $158K was probably too high. The $115K feels too low. The car you are describing has double the miles. So maybe an average of of those into the mid-$130's feels about right since the market has gone up a little since then?
Good luck if you're buying. I'd certainly show them the Slate Grey auction result and offer them $115K to start.
/
Last edited by fatmike; 05-17-2022 at 04:05 PM.
05-17-2022, 04:11 PM
#2485
Does it seem to you guys that the number of Porsches that now list True Mileage Unknown has grown exponentially in the last year? I have 38 years with Porsches and I’ve never seen this many cars advertised for sale as TMU.
An even bigger surprise is it doesn’t seem to impact selling price. After all the back and forth on odometers, buyers are asking more questions about tire dates and color of rims than the TMU disclaimer. Strange times.
An even bigger surprise is it doesn’t seem to impact selling price. After all the back and forth on odometers, buyers are asking more questions about tire dates and color of rims than the TMU disclaimer. Strange times.
05-17-2022, 04:20 PM
#2486
Rennlist Member
i think the TMU thing started on BaT largely because of 964/993 speedo gears. some of the idiots in the peanut gallery didn't believe this was a DIY repair and thought that any number of miles could have been accumulated over a certain span. even a well noted Carfax report with linear mileage notes wasn't good enough for some. it got plenty of traction here on RL also. the aftermath is that many don't want to believe the mileage on these cars any longer. typical group mentality and over reaction. soon after a few auctions had a lot of disagreements over the mileage accuracy, all of the sudden BaT started listing some porsches with TMU. a lot of bitching and whining and a poor outcome, imo.
i forgot to add, some (on here) were demanding that speedo gear repairs be provided with "documented invoices and pictures throughout the process from professional shops" if a repair was done. when challenged that this would still not verify the mileage that transpired before the repair, it fell on deaf ears. you can guess who may have made such comment. mechanical items fail. do your due diligence.
i forgot to add, some (on here) were demanding that speedo gear repairs be provided with "documented invoices and pictures throughout the process from professional shops" if a repair was done. when challenged that this would still not verify the mileage that transpired before the repair, it fell on deaf ears. you can guess who may have made such comment. mechanical items fail. do your due diligence.
Last edited by rsabeebe; 05-17-2022 at 04:25 PM. Reason: forgot to add
05-17-2022, 04:49 PM
#2487
Thanks for the input guys. I really appreciate it!
05-17-2022, 06:58 PM
#2488
Drifting
Originally Posted by rsabeebe
i think the TMU thing started on BaT largely because of 964/993 speedo gears. some of the idiots in the peanut gallery didn't believe this was a DIY repair and thought that any number of miles could have been accumulated over a certain span. even a well noted Carfax report with linear mileage notes wasn't good enough for some. it got plenty of traction here on RL also. the aftermath is that many don't want to believe the mileage on these cars any longer. typical group mentality and over reaction. soon after a few auctions had a lot of disagreements over the mileage accuracy, all of the sudden BaT started listing some porsches with TMU. a lot of bitching and whining and a poor outcome, imo.
i forgot to add, some (on here) were demanding that speedo gear repairs be provided with "documented invoices and pictures throughout the process from professional shops" if a repair was done. when challenged that this would still not verify the mileage that transpired before the repair, it fell on deaf ears. you can guess who may have made such comment. mechanical items fail. do your due diligence.
i forgot to add, some (on here) were demanding that speedo gear repairs be provided with "documented invoices and pictures throughout the process from professional shops" if a repair was done. when challenged that this would still not verify the mileage that transpired before the repair, it fell on deaf ears. you can guess who may have made such comment. mechanical items fail. do your due diligence.
05-17-2022, 07:28 PM
#2489
Racer
Yeah, pics during the repair are redic lol.
My car has service receipts with the mileage showing it slowly increasing just before mine broke, then the receipt for the ODO repair. That's literally the best I can imagine anyone could do - correlate the dates/mileage of paperwork with the ODO repair invoice, then sleep well at night haha.
My car has service receipts with the mileage showing it slowly increasing just before mine broke, then the receipt for the ODO repair. That's literally the best I can imagine anyone could do - correlate the dates/mileage of paperwork with the ODO repair invoice, then sleep well at night haha.
05-17-2022, 09:11 PM
#2490
Rennlist Member