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Thanks. He also talks about launching the car which is not really possible with the Carrera GT’s carbon ceramic clutch. I’d much rather have a clutch as described here than one like the CGT.
that’s actually the complete opposite of what I was told….we will see.
Either way, the clutch feel combined with that shifter notch, makes this the most exciting 911 for me in almost 10 years.
To which 8 second cars are you referring? Are they pure ICE?
Because outside of expensive one trick pony drag cars, most expensive sports that are still driven on road and F1 style tracks can’t do 10 seconds, let alone 8!
2 E85, 1 Diesel, 2 93. None on drugs or electic. The reason most production cars and race cars arent much over 1k HP which gets you in the 9s depending on weight is due to cost of materials for longevity. Horsepower makes heat which increases cylinder pressures which kills motors faster.
In the high HP racing world as the other user that had the UGR car.... the phrase buy once cry once is very real. I've got billet blocks that cost 40k alone. Automatic transmissions that can handle 3000ft lbs of torque. All inconel or billet internals which have high tensile strength. And the lists can go on. All are boosted of course except the Vipers which still runs a 9 and boosted motors run 25psi on the gassers and 80-90psi on the diesels. I know guys with 4-5k pulling trucks or 6 sec cars. They can get alot of races in at full tilt as yes that's their design. We're more worried about overspending Turbos, blowing boots, traction, or water downs.
All mine are super street class vehicles if competing. Lots of folks hate hard in Mopar for their vehicles as one truck ponies and having had a Demon I'll agree. Wasn't for me so started pushing others.
Frankly most production cars SHOULDN'T be faster than mid 10-11sec. It's more power than most can comfortably handle which isn't just dangerous for them, but others.
Originally Posted by agfox
AP talked about the clutch in the Carwow interview. He said it's aluminum, super light, not as durable, and very expensive. it's 21:25 time stamp. Time stamped link to YouTube.
Of all the ST videos the Car wow one is one of the best. Matt's pretty tough on brands including ones he loves. AP is very specific as you said to the clutch and eludes to it no being a daily friendly piece especially with its cost to replace.
I sat in the 911 ST yesterday in GIMS (Qatar) and the clutch padel felt heavier than my 992 GT3 closer to the 718 GT4 weight, also the shifter spring force was stronger.
I'm not sure if it would loosen up when used or if they are using a new part for the shifter.
sadly my PETKA is 8.3 and I don't see the new parts for the 911 ST listed.
From everyone that I know who has owned, or own, both a 991.2 GT3T and a 911R, will say that the 991.2 GT3T is simply not a iterative copy of the R.
The R is just different despite the quantitive similarities between the 2 cars on paper.
Originally Posted by DontLift
As one of those .. yes - substantively so..
They are very different experiences, and both amazing. But the R is very differentiated from the 991 Touring. Anyone that says otherwise has not experienced both
GT3 player par excellence Lifetime Rennlist Member
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I may be differnt.
lots of speculation on ST
to me, it's in this order
1. can I get the car, if not I have zero interest in knowing anything about it. if yes, I will just get the car and find out myself. no need speculate
carbon ceramic clutch if improved then great
if it's like CGT. NO.
every CGT owner have constant fear that they get rear ended in traffic, bc it's very very slow in taking off for the compute to roll the car.
The clutch in the ST is carbon, but the engagement is nothing like the carbon ceramic clutch in the CGT. The new carbon clutch in the ST doesn't like slipping too much, but it is more usable than the one in the CGT, as in you can take off normally. And nobody said anything "ceramic" about the clutch in the ST, so don't automatically assume the clutch in the ST is the same one used in the CGT. It's not.
Originally Posted by GrantG
Thanks. He also talks about launching the car which is not really possible with the Carrera GT’s carbon ceramic clutch. I’d much rather have a clutch as described here than one like the CGT.
The clutch in the ST is carbon, but the engagement is nothing like the carbon ceramic clutch in the CGT. The new carbon clutch in the ST doesn't like slipping too much, but it is more usable than the one in the CGT, as in you can take off normally. And nobody said anything "ceramic" about the clutch in the ST, so don't automatically assume the clutch in the ST is the same one used in the CGT. It's not.
The clutch in the ST is carbon, but the engagement is nothing like the carbon ceramic clutch in the CGT. The new carbon clutch in the ST doesn't like slipping too much, but it is more usable than the one in the CGT, as in you can take off normally. And nobody said anything "ceramic" about the clutch in the ST, so don't automatically assume the clutch in the ST is the same one used in the CGT. It's not.
can someone tell me the benefit of a carbon clutch outside of weight savings?just curious
can someone tell me the benefit of a carbon clutch outside of weight savings?just curious
I'm not an expert by any means, but as I alluded to in my earlier post, I watched a YouTube (link at bottom) on high end racing clutches recently, and these were my takeaways:
Clutches manage friction and heat
How well they do this is due in large part to materials used
The highest end racing clutches use the same carbon heat shielding used on the space shuttle (very $$$) because it dissipates heat well which = longer life
can someone tell me the benefit of a carbon clutch outside of weight savings?just curious
Yes, it's weight saving. However, it's not only the usual benefits of saving several pounds. You have the normal benefit of saving weight off the car, but you also are saving rotating mass on the engine (amplified more by mating the clutch with the light single-mass flywheel) which makes the engine far more responsive as there is less inertia to overcome when changing engine speed (rpm), both up and down. And maybe making the clutch carbon makes it more resilient (but not sure of the facts on that)...
Yes, it's weight saving. However, it's not only the usual benefits of saving several pounds. You have the normal benefit of saving weight off the car, but you also are saving rotating mass on the engine (amplified more by mating the clutch with the light single-mass flywheel) which makes the engine far more responsive as there is less inertia to overcome when changing engine speed (rpm), both up and down. And maybe making the clutch carbon makes it more resilient (but not sure of the facts on that)...
interesting. So the clutch is half the diameter as the GT3’s, according to AP, it’s Carbon, and some part of it is aluminum. 🤔
10-08-2023 | 02:23 PM
