Ynot

Supply and demand, I don't doubt if it's true. When most 991 are PDK's the MT will be rare, people who wants MT will specifically look for it, keeping the price up. Similar to MB's with MT. Only about 5% of them are MT and automatics were a $2K option. Now in the use market. AT is cheaper than MT which were a standard.

Bart Baeyens

A quote from 6speed:

The PDK has on several occasions downshifted right in the middle of a bend with resultant loss of rear traction - in all cases so far quickly fixed by the traction control using unsymetrical braking action (very noticable) rather than throttle retard. This intervention happens far faster than I as a driver can react.

And another:

Sometimes when driving moderately aggressively, when approaching an intersection in second gear and making a 90 degree right turn, as I begin to round the corner the gearbox will suddenly drop down into first gear, resulting in a spike in my RPMs into the 5500 range. It's unexpected, loud and can be pretty jerky.

So please excuse me while I keep enjoying my MT... It's not trying to kill me.

Hammer911

So maybe the Porsche engineers just designed in some missed shifts and slipped gears to keep the experience authentic?

chuckbdc

Sounds to me like Sport+ behavior. If so, that is because Sport+ is really designed for full scale track attack, with the mapping assuming that full throttle out of the corner is what iyou have planned, and highest RPM behavior is what one is after. Try Sport instead.

mrstep

As the local Aston dealer said to a friend of mine: "So what is your fun car?" That hits it on the head for me. I know some find the PDK to be fun, I just want to pedal and row and not in a Miata or Corvette.

FORENN

MT drivers everywhere cringed reading this.

bccars

After living with the car a bit more - but still only about 3500km on the clock at the moment - observations, random thoughts, ramblings about PDK vs MT, PDK Auto vs PDK Manual.

I was out a few days ago for a longish trip to the Spa Francorchamps track in my PDK C2 for a trackday (not as participant, spectator only), so I had plenty different types of driving to do. Long tedious highways, with both low traffic and cluttered with traffic. Gorgeous fast hilly bendy highways leading up to Spa Francorchamps region. Gorgeous slowish hilly and very bendy backroads around the F1 track

First of all. How on earth can you PDK guys be content with just leaving it in auto all the time and never enjoy manual mode ?

I read on forums and from journos that it is telepathic in auto mode, that it shifts when you would shift yourself. NOT a chance !
Mind you, it's as good as any reactive system can be expected to be. But it is only that, a reactive system, that reacts to sensor inputs and driver inputs. But it is nowhere near as good as a driver that does the shifts himself in PDK manual mode ! That same driver scans and sees the road and traffic, and makes proactive decisions on how to set up (throttle, braking, shifting, steering) his car for what he sees. Exactly this is something PDK can not do because it just can't see what the driver sees ! Manual mode is soooo much better, smoother, responsive, maybe even faster and with less drama than it was in auto mode for me at brisk 7/10 to 8/10 driving on hilly bendy backroads in Sport mode!
Even on cluttered straight boring highways where I had to brake and accelerate often with cars weaving in and out of my lane, PDK in auto mode sucked. Reaction time of shifting down was way to long. My proactive manual downshift allowed me to have accelerated past a car that had moved out of the way before the PDK Auto had figured out I was giving it more and more throttle because it refused to downshift and has absolutely no grunt whatsoever in 7th. Granted this was in normal mode, PSE off for my stealth mode on the highways as to minimize attraction of the men in blue.

I see only 3 cases where I prefer the PDK in Auto mode.
First a straight line drag race when it makes perfect upshifts at redline which obviously I can't, but I don't call that driving a car so I don't care about that.
Second on an open stretch of highway with low traffic where you very rarely have to brake and accelerate again for a car that moves over.
Third in very cluttered city traffic.
All three cases have absolutely nothing to do with driving and enjoying a Porsche like it was meant to. But still, those cases are part of our lives (well, not the first one obviously), so I'm glad they put in that Auto mode for those tedious times.

In conclusion, with of the above in mind, thinking about it on the drive home, I can understand why some of you MT diehards say the PDK sucks if they only tried it in Auto mode. Actually, I think it takes the mindset of a skilled MT driver to get the best of a PDK equipped 911, and that's only in manual mode. But in that case, it really is the next step, the best gearbox of this moment in time, that let's you have total control and involvement but withouth the inefficient hassle of declutching, rowing gears, loosing connection
with your car.
So IMO if you are only used to driving Auto slushboxes, and you move on to PDK and leave it in Auto, you are missing out, and yes, maybe in that case you should get a MT first to get into that MT mindset before you move on to a PDK. For me, I still think the PDK is way better than MT, and I still am convinced it is the right choice for me. But now I can see why someone would opt for a MT, because PDK in Auto just doesn't cut it !
Full enjoyment and efficiency can only be ad in PDK Manual mode, with a diehard/skilled MT driver at the wheel.

YMMV

GSIRM3

Because they are most likely smack in the middle of Porsche's target market for the 991, a buyer who wants a prestigious, sporty car, but with an automatic transmission.

rglbegl

I have said this before too. Porsche is catering to the buyers who will pay the high prices these cars demand. And the majority of those people want that new controllable automatic gearbox like all the racers are using. If it is what they want, Porsche will make it.

I do have a question about the 1970's Hurst t-gate shifter. Wasn't that an automatic that you could move over to the side and bang from 1st to 2nd to 3rd etc etc??? So was that an automatic or a manual?

And hooray for this thread still going

FullThrottle64

Racecars don't use "controllable automatics" - no race car today has an automatic transmission. What they use are clutchless (dual-clutch, really) manuals; every shift must be initiated by a driver's action. There is a REALLY big difference between the two.

The PDK in auto mode is nothing at all like any sort of racing transmission; the fact that it is being billed as such is pure marketing fantasy.

rglbegl

^^^
Potato - Potauto

My Lexus has an auto, but I can drop it in to low, then in to 2nd, 3rd, then drive . . . . .. Every shift is initiated by the driver. . .. . so how do I classify that?

GSIRM3

An auto just like the PDK.

rglbegl

BTW - Page 8 . .. . .Woot!!!

meine911

Just one more...

^^^!

FullThrottle64

It's an auto with a torque converter and a manual shift override.

The technology differences between old-style autos (Lexus), dual-clutch street autos (PDK), and racing dual-clutch manuals are significant. It's not "potato-potahto" at all.