WolfDenShoebox

Yes, confusing indeed. Thanks for clearing this up. I am always concerned with adaptive damper systems and electronic modules on cars because it adds an extra layer of complexity I am not comfortable working on myself. I guess we will see how it goes.

The previous owner says PASM comes with magnetic adaptive dampers... are the dampers really magnetic like GM's magnetic damper systems?

Fortunately, the car does come with Sport Chrono, but no PDCC or PASM Sport.

PAPorscheGuy

I understand. Sounds like a great car. People on Rennlist are saying that the 991 S is getting harder and harder to find. I don’t do advanced repairs on my cars, but I have not heard of issues with this system. I love the “S” and feel it’s well worth the difference over the base. You can tell PASM by the “shock” button on the console. PASM sport would be on the window sticker, but you can always enter the VIN into Vinanalytics.com to make sure it doesn’t have the PASM sport option.

Concerning the technology, not sure about the “magnetic” but this is the explanation I found: to alter the suspension’s stiffness, hydraulic dampers are filled with oil, which is compressed by a piston. In the PASM damper, the channel is used to control the flow of oil.In ‘Normal’ mode, the valves controlling the bypass channel are open, allowing a greater flow of oil, resulting in a softer damper. However, when ‘Sport’ mode is activated, the bypass channel is closed. This increases the compression needed to force the oil through the damper body, creating a stiffer damper, and a more responsive Porsche. I have a similar system in my e92 M3 (2011) and it’s been fine.

Gary JR

Not backed up, of course.

AdamSanta85

You mean a measly 55hp, nearly 15%. Engine is also almost half a liter bigger, better dampers, spring rates deserving of a sports car, bigger sway bars, 6 piston brakes, an electronic differential... and the you can go further with pasm sport which adds front lip, higher rear wing angle, even better dampers and sway bars...

PAPorscheGuy

The “S” listed for $14K more (about $10K-$15K premium in the used 991 market). For that you get hp, brakes, wheels, suspension, and traction upgrades that I believe are well worth it if you have the $. Many reasons have been given here for the “high” prices including supply-demand, economy, and federal incentives, but I believe another major reason is the ever increasing prices of new 911s. The sticker on my 2019 991.2 C2S MT was $126K. The same spec would cost me $140K+ Try configuring your spec on a new 992 on the Porsche website. You could easily justify paying $100K for a low mileage used 991 - especially if you’re like me and actually prefer the 991! Btw, MT not available on the 992 base - you need to order an “S”.

AdamSanta85

There is no reason to buy a base over an S unless you need a more comfortable car.

Base 991.2 suffers from the same problems as base 991.1. Taller gearing, soft suspension, plain Jane brakes, and no differential. Suspension and brakes can be fixed but not the other two.

If you are buying the 911 because it’s a sports car, T or better for 991.2. And I would bet good money resale value reflects this in 5 years, just as it does with the 991.1.

Gary JR

Make my point. Not worth $14k.

WolfDenShoebox

To each their own, but if you were to get those options independently of being packaged and pay for it out of pocket, I have a sneaking suspicion it would be over $14k.

Gary JR

Yes independently is the way I'd go picking maybe half of them at most.

RSBro

I am regretting that now lol. A year ago it wasn't that huge of a gap between the two models.

RSBro

I went for the base bc I planned to and do daily it, and my wife complained about the lack of comfort in my 996, so that's where I went. Knowing what I know now about it however, I would have upped for an S with a bit more miles. At the time I was searching the country for a certain spec S and just weren't any even close to a good fit for the $. Oh well.

PAPorscheGuy

i feel like I found a unicorn. A ‘19 991.2 C2S MT with less than 2K miles. I knew it was rare when I bought it, but didn’t realize how rare it was. If you value the “S” feature set it’s a no-brainer. Easily $20K+ not to mention resale value. I can relate to the doubters as I feel that way about the GTS.

manifold danger

This comment implies that money aside, there are reasons to select a base over an S. I disagree.

I've read at least one article where the author claims that the S may have "too much power" for the street, and the base car offers a more accessible powerband. I can see where that would be appealing- and if you have no intention on tracking the car then the brakes on the base car are fine as well.

But that still rules out the available options for Sports PASM and Rear Axle Steering, which both offer clear upgrades for street or track. You could argue that the SPASM ride is too stiff; but the data doesn't back that up, even for a daily driven car. The 911 is a sports car, might as well get it as sporty as you can, and I think most on here would agree (money aside).

I've also read elsewhere that if you haven't driven a car with rear axle steering you wouldn't necessarily miss it and would still think the 991.2 handles exceptionally well. And some truly hardcore track guys have suggested it's an option they wouldn't want, but I haven't seen where that sentiment has actually been backed up with evidence as to why that would be the case, as it's standard on the GT cars.

Where this gets interesting is with the T. You can get all the cool "S-only" options on a car with the base engine (except for the brakes), and many folks thinks that's the sweet spot for a street car and I would be hard pressed to disagree.

Personally though, my car is an S with SPASM and rear axle steering and I think it's an amazing spec, second only to the GTS as far as Carreras go, and that's only for a slight power bump and the wider hips. This turbo engine is fantastic and I love having the power available in the lower part of the rev range when driving on the street. I find it actually very usable, and I've had an F82 M4 where I thought it actually was "too much power for the street". Those rules don't seem to apply to this car, and it's fun at any speed.

Porsche does a great job of providing options to fit every buyer. If your personal desires for the car are a more comfortable ride and you'll never use any of the track-centric features, then yes the base car is the right one for you and you may as well save the money.

But if you're trying to argue "worth", that is always going to be a sticking point because it's subjective.

I think the market is the best data point to fall back on, and the S cars are always worth more, new or secondhand.

RSBro

Someone in my DE run group this weekend was in a beautiful yellow T. We did some lead/follow stuff, he was quicker in the straights but I caught up in some sweepers and curvy bits, but it was just nice to get to watch it go, as I was all set on something in Racing or Speed Yellow myself. Was nice to know my base could keep up too, with similar driver abilities, with us both being in Blue. I could see the T being my next purchase.

smiles11

Only thing that should keep someone from buying an S over a base is $$ unless they’re just looking for a GT cruiser. When you start adding it up - the S transitions into a drivers car. Suspension, big reds, +HP, wheels, PTV+, eLSD. Not to mention sporty options that aren’t available in a base model (RAS, PDCC).

The disparity is even worse now with the 992 as the MT is only available in the S trim.